I’m after a 4 season tent so I can hikepack and bikepack at reasonable altitude during the gloomy months. I’ve got my eye on this tent by Terra Nova:

Laser Compact All Season 2

It fits my requirements of packing down small but is long enough for my lanky frame and it claims to be 4 seasons. However, I always thought that a tent needed some kind pole crossing, geodesic design to stand up to high winds? Have I got this wrong? I know that there are some hardy winter campers amongst us, so let me know your experiences! Will I be ok with tent or is going to be flattened against my face on a storm?

Agreed. Looks like an odd shape for a supposedly 4 season tent. On the plus side, being a Wild Country, the less poles it has then the cheaper it’ll be to replace the set each time they break..

The latter is distinctly possible but that can be part of the plan as a tent that flattens doesn’t tend to snap it’s poles. So you win some , lose some.

Are you planning on using this on snow, or as an all year tent, in Scotland or so on? The reason I ask is that if you get something like a Helsport Patagonia it’s great on snow, and warm, but the long flysheet (so you can bury the rim in snow) means it’s way too hot in Summer. If it’s really windy air flow under the fly on the Terra Nova will make it chilly

Are you planning on using this on snow, or as an all year tent, in Scotland or so on? 

Yes, very much so, and if I can camp up on the peaks so much the better. I appreciate you need a pretty hardy tent to be able to do that! But I love being up there and would love to be able to open up my options rather than always feeling like I need to hike down into the valley to camp

The reason I ask is that if you get something like a Helsport Patagonia

I’ve seen tents like this, they look amazing but I won’t always be in snow, so it seems a bit overkill for me

In my youth I did some back packing in Scotland in winter. There’s a lot to weigh up. Unless you plan walking in the dark you’ll be in your tent for a long time each night, that favours a larger tent. If it snows that really tough on a tent.

I wouldn’t use a Laser as a proper 4 season mountain tent. I’ve used them for years bike and back packing and always pitch in as much of a sheltered spot as I can find. It’ll get blown to bits in a proper gale. You’ll also probly get wet as you’ll be almost touching the inner fabric everywhere as they’re quite compact.

I use a Quasar (geodesic dome) for proper winter mountain use. It’s about as strong as they come but weighs over 4kg and still would get blown flat if you plonked it on the top of Cairngorm in a proper hoolie. I.e. tents have their limits.

I use a Quasar (geodesic dome) for proper winter mountain use. It’s about as strong as they come but weighs over 4kg and still would get blown flat if you plonked it on the top of Cairngorm in a proper hoolie. I.e. tents have their limits

I was wondering about this. Maybe I am asking too much and just need to accept that, sometimes, you need to be a bit sensible!

I have a geo and it makes sense to me that they stand up better in foul weather. Also they are easier to move around when pitching. However, Hilleberg tunnels apparently stand the winds very well so it’s not cut and dried. So did my mates old Blacks Mountain Tent, though no-one in their right mind would want to carry one.

Unless you plan walking in the dark you’ll be in your tent for a long time each night,

Yep, the short days are a massive problem to be fair!

Winter or 4 season tents are generally designed to be able to withstand snowfall IIRC, and as have been mentioned already some come with snow valances that you bury in the snow – basically an extra long flysheet. The downside is condensation as it restricts airflow. I’ve used them in the arctic where you are pitching on several feet of snow, in Scotland that is less likely of course

IMO the main criteria for Scotland is stability and strength in high winds, and  general weatherproofing. I have a Terra Nova Voyager that is rated as 3 season as it can’t really take heavy snow on its flattish roof. However it is extremely stable in high winds, and otherwise a good design for the UK with low cut fly and bathtub groundsheet. It has managed snow fall on the roof, just not loads of it. In reality, snow on scottish hills is generally going sideways and not vertically, so the big build up on the roof of your tent won’t happen like it does in the Patagonia catalogue.

So a good solid 3 season tent will probably suffice in the real world and probably be quite a bit lighter.  Personally i’d be looking at geodesics as they will stand on their own and providing you are in it, they (probably) won’t blow away!! I have a Quasar too, and while it’s going to stay standing after all your clothes have been ripped from your shivering body, it is heavy.

The Laser wouldn’t be my first choice for a winter tent, you could make it work with a sheltered pitch but it is gonna get battered in a strong wind! Lots of fairly flappy panels to catch the wind and drive you mad. Once the pegs rip out it will be misery.

There are a few MSR tents that look pretty good and seem to have good customer support. They do tend to have quite high cut flysheets though, something to think about in blowy weather. On the plus side they come in at good weights

Ultralightoutdoorgear website is a good site to peruse lots of tents and compare weights and staff reviews, well worth a look

I wouldn’t use a Laser as a proper 4 season mountain tent

Apparently this one has been beefed up with materials from the Quasar range to make it suitable for winter

The Hilleberg Soulo and the beefed up Tarptent Scarp model were always the standard answers to this question. For a Scottish winter I’d take a bigger, lighter tent and choose my higher camps based on the weather forecast.

Some great advice, thanks! Sounds like a geodesic is the way to go unfortunately. They all seem to be a bit short and bulky when packed! I’ll keep looking

For a Scottish winter I’d take a bigger, lighter tent and choose my higher camps based on the weather forecast.

Yeah this^^

I’m pretty sure my wife’s colleague just bivvies. She holds the female munro record (12 rounds) so presumably knows her stuff.

This one looks like it might be a bit more sturdy in a high wind, and it’s long enough for me

https://ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/copper-spur-hv2-expedition-tent/

It’s a lot more bulky when packed though, and that colour is not exactly going to blend in with the pristine countryside!

The Laser is a variation on the old Saunders Spacepacker design ie transverse ridge.

It’ll probly survive but you’ll get damp/wet and won’t get a lot of sleep. You want more space, more poles and heavier duty for multi day winter use.

Anything will do for one night in a sheltered spot but multiple nights requires a different approach if you don’t want to have a miserable time.

This is an interesting tent and it comes in bigger versions too. It’s basically a beefed up NX tent

http://ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/2021-access-1-tent/

Something to be aware of is that winter tents generally have solid pertex inners, whereas non winter tents have mesh inners, or at least mostly mesh. This makes them lighter, but draftier and colder. A solid inner has less good ventilation though.

Scarp 1 would be a good choice. You can pitch it with one pole or use the optional crossing poles in more inclement  conditions. I have one and my winter Twitter feed always features some on the Scottish mountains.

That Hilleberg Soulo looks just about long enough for me (it needs to be 220cm min really) but a little spenny tho!

The Scarp looks awesome but too short for me unfortunately!

Whether you need crossed poles rather than separate hoops is partly influenced by whether you can peg guys securely. The hoop on the Laser has two guys each side, and they are essential to keeping the hoop the right shape. If you lose the guys, the hoop is likely to distort badly and possible break. A geodesic can be placed on hard ground and will be stable, you just need enough weight to stop it blowing away.

I’ve used tunnel style tents in winter – fine unless it’s really windy. This was a Macpac Minaret II tent which I think Cougar bought off me. It was pretty decent in strong winds, would have to be gale force to cause it a problem.

[url=https://flic.kr/p/dT7w8E]CAMPING ON RED PIKE[/url] by Ben Freeman, on Flickr

Also had a TNF VE-25 Geodesic – which was larger and generally more beefy..

Actually that Tarptent Scarp looks fine- I misread the specs- can you buy them in the UK?

Maybe just avoid days when there’s a gale likely….

A few years ago I did a night in -20 in January in Norway camping to prove a point….. it’s possible to be cozy in the bag but it’s super cold in most tents,, and a long night.. dark by 4, light at 9. Bivvying in that would not be to my taste.

What are you planning as a stove? Gas or burner?

Gas

and a long night.

I used to take a portable radio – listened to that to help pass the time….

A few years ago I did a night in -20 in January in Norway camping to prove a point…

That’s not really that cold by modern down bag standards, a bag bag for -20 C isn’t that large – maybe 750g filling.

Tunnel or geodesic I’d still choose one from a company that stands behind their product.

I won’t take another Terra Nova/wild country product on tour.

Fool me once thats ok , fool me twice fair enough . You won’t fool me a third time.

They wouldn’t even respond after the second failure. The tent poles lasted 3 nights of our Canada cycle tour before I had to start repairing it. Great headline weight. Not to be trusted. Should have bought the hilleberg.

My and I were bike touring up the top of Scotland a few years back. He had a tunnel tent and I had a geodesic one. It was pretty windy. His tent got flattened but mine was fine. 🤷‍♂️

I think high winds can happen any time of year. As above, your issue is going to be snow and you need something that can stand up to it. Don’t go light weight.

I recall when the Peapods came out – the first hooped tunnels. I think we were up in Torridon in winter and it was a bit blowy. The Peapod kept flattening then bouncing back. It survived the night but I don’t think the people inside got much kip…

A winter tent isn’t usually a light tent. As you will be in it from 6pm until 7am you need something bigger imo so you can at least sit up in it and have room inside for all your winter gear.

I have a hilleberg akto and soulo – and both are too small imo for winter camping.

It survived the night but I don’t think the people inside got much kip

This is what concerns me. I’ve spent the night worrying about the tent instead of sleeping before, not much fun!

That Tarptent Scarp works out at anout £620 with shipping and taxes from the US. I might wait a bit and see if the pound gets any stronger..

I was lucky enough to buy mine second-hand off the STW Classifieds many moons ago!

I won’t take another Terra Nova/wild country product on tour.

Fool me once thats ok , fool me twice fair enough . You won’t fool me a third time.

They wouldn’t even respond after the second failure. The tent poles lasted 3 nights of our Canada cycle tour before I had to start repairing it. Great headline weight. Not to be trusted. Should have bought the hilleberg.

Sadly this. I got fed up of having to pay for new Quasar poles continuously. The tent was great when it was pitched, just had a habit of shattering poles when pitching it.

In think a Hilleberg Akto will stand up to the wind and snow… bit it will be quite small to spend 12+ hours in.

I have a Hilleberg Nallo and that is pretty good, if a bit noisy, in a wind.

We had a 3 hoop Hillberg for our Scotland in winter stuff. I think Bo he recommends double poling if it gets really bad

I was lucky enough to buy mine second-hand off the STW Classifieds many moons ago

Very lucky! 😀