Microsoft Surface and Windows 8 aims to bring together creation and consumption on one device.

Windows 8 RT will ship with Office home and student RT, which should provide you with all you need.

So if you can hang on until the end of the month it could be an option?

I pretty much run my business off a iPad, can certainly create all the letters and spreadsheets I need to plus it runs my accounting software. I’ve got an Apple wireless keyboard which makes typing an awful lot faster.

The big advantage it has over a PC (and I still use those for web development etc) is that it’s instant-on, always-working. The thing never crashes, never gets a virus, never needs a registry cleanup, stuff like that.

Sure, it’s a toy, but it’s a very useful toy…

I’ve used the Bluetooth keyboard off mi iMac with mine and it actually works quite well. I’d probably still go for a cheap windows laptop for now though (until they are old enough to justify a nice second hand MacBook 🙂 ).

And try not to get a laptop with a glossy screen, or get him to use it in a location where reflections and glare are minimised, unless you want him to start having eye problems.

Are laptops compulsory for school these days then? Sounds both expensive and time consuming and not to mention a possible massive source of distraction but then I’m old enough to have only ever used excercise books and pencils at school and am easily distracted these days.

Flash is dead

Sadly if you own an iPad (or other i device) you’ll find that’s not the case. Mrs aracer who “owns” the ipad all too often ends up reaching for my laptop for stuff which just doesn’t work – the latest and greatest example being some survey for a major company (can’t remember which) that the designers in their infinite wisdom had coded in Flash, despite it offering no obvious advantage. Not a Flash issue, but it was also impossible to do the school admission for our youngest in the iPad (also impossible in Chrome, as the “developers” of that site had written it for old-fashioned IE 👿 )

The big advantage it has over a PC (and I still use those for web development etc) is that it’s instant-on, always-working. The thing never crashes, never gets a virus, never needs a registry cleanup, stuff like that.

Just like my laptop when left in standby mode then. OK so it takes a handful of second to come back to life, but then stuff on the iPad isn’t actually that instant – the laptop also multi-taks properly, so you can switch apps much quicker. I suppose arguably I should do a clean up and defrag on this, but it’s certainly not suffering for not doing so – I’ve just run up the tools for the first time in ages and an analysis doesn’t show much benefit to running them.

The iPad mostly gets used for playing games.

Learning important skills such as sharing and living economically are clearly low priority.

Putting a password on the PC for a day or two is one of my ways of ****ing junior off when he ****es me off. I checked with the school and they confirmed that PCs are available for kids that don’t have computer access at home.

As for all these games, skype and facebook, they’re banned in the home when I’m there. No parental control though and Google is left in unsafe search mode.

Ok sorry flash is dying 🙂

Dosnt stop lazy designers though 🙂

Ok sorry flash is dying 🙂

Dosnt stop lazy designers though 🙂

As an iPad owner I would recommend getting a PC instead as life would just be so much easier and he would learn skills that would be needed later in the workplace. I have just bought a Lenovo X131e which is designed for the education market and has been excellent so far – 11.6″ I3 with USB3 and tough as old boots. Paid < £400.

Could you afford a laptop and a Google Nexus? – they are excellent tablets for a bargain price.

iPad fanboi here: I’d go with a laptop. 😀

iPads can easily create docs and spreadsheets, including Microsoft formats. There are a number of office suites that do this including the Apple offerings and Smart Office: http://www.picselsmartoffice.com/

And as for being a distraction, it is very easy to lock down an ipad with restrictions (e.g. No installing, no web, no FaceTime etc). You can even lock it in an app by disabling the home button and entire areas of the screen.

BUT… school IT is quite likely to be some way behind the times and other homework tasks may involve flash, activex plugins, badly written sites that only work in IE, or even straight Windows programs. So for that reason I’d stick with windows.

You can make great docs and presentations on iPad. But for school? That would be crazy for so many reasons.

Instead, find a cheap, or used, small laptop and get them to use that.
Cheap? It’ll get abused and broken or stolen. Small? If they have to carry it or move it a 15″ widescreen will be a bit big & heavy to carry if it’s cheap.

For homework you surely do not need a spiffy all singing, all dancing, machine. That kids are expected to use computers for this sort of thing is testament to the world gone topsy turvy. Make ’em use pen & paper. It teaches planning, discipline, free thinking and allows them to function in business when all the IT stuff goes wonky.

Hey, maybe you could get a RaspberryPi and plug it into the TV?

Not really.

I am a big user of Apple products and have an iPad1, it’s a fantastic device and I use it for work and at home, creating and editing documents (wireless keyboard) but it’s not a substitute for a laptop/desk machine. I gave away my laptop but I have a desk machine and the iPad.

I have heard of a number of private schools which give out iPad’s but I’d say they are more useful for receiving material to read/study than creating significant content.

That kids are expected to use computers for this sort of thing is testament to the world gone topsy turvy.

Personally I’d rather my kids were prepared for the real world, where IT is ubiquitous. (And yes, they do still use pen & paper, too).

Ok sorry flash is dying

On your computer, or are you talking more generically 😉

I have to admit, one thing I really admired Steve Jobs for was his courage to stand up against Adobe – did us all a favour by hastening its demise. Sadly it’s here for a while to come yet.

The big pain with anything other than something that can run full office, isn’t that you can’t create documents on it – most things will let you create documents. It is that some swine carefully crafts a document and expects you to edit it and then send it back to them, without messing up anything at all. If you find they’ve used some obscure feature, or done absolutely millimetre perfect positioning, or something else that isn’t exactly the same in your ‘word compatible’ office suite, it all goes wrong. It is quite annoying in word, and can be nightmarish in Excel or PowerPoint.

Get this all the time with publisher templates – where the article has to be in exactly the right format to look correct against other articles. It never quite works with open office or any other non office product.

In some ways it’s all Microsoft’s fault for Word being such a nightmare format full of so many backwards compatibility kludges and little fixes and stuff, but unfortunately that is how it is. The flip side of it is that if you only use Word, it pretty much just works – even really old word docs layout pretty much the same in the latest Word.

something else that isn’t exactly the same in your ‘word compatible’ office suite, it all goes wrong

Yep, I used to get this a lot when trying to use Open Office on the PC. It would work but wouldn’t be quite right.

Don’t think it would be such an issue for schoolwork though – I think the bigger issue would be legacy Windows PC specific systems at the school as mentioned earlier.

wrote my final year project in open office ……as i was being cheap against buying office at the time.

cue all nighter in the unis lab rewriting it in word when the printing firm opened it in word and printed it out – the formatting was just wrong

BUT… school IT is quite likely to be implemented on a tight budget with compatibility for the masses prioritised over Flashy gadgets for the few!

FTFY

cue all nighter in the unis lab rewriting it in word when the printing firm opened it in word and printed it out – the formatting was just wrong

Would now be a good time to tell you that you could have just saved it as a PDF and the printing firm would have been happy with it…

BUT… school IT is quite likely to be implemented on a tight budget with compatibility for the masses prioritised over Flashy gadgets for the few!

Err. yeah – except that’s not quite right is it?

If they go with Windows-specific stuff then they have chosen technologies that are less compatible, not more.

If catering to the cheaper end of the market is important then you would want compatibility with Linux-based systems where the OS is free and can run on lower spec old hardware.

Edit – funny how those of us who actually use an iPad to create document on an almost daily basis seem to have a slightly different view on what the capabilities actually are…

I use an iPad every day but I find them a pain in the ring fr writing emails let alone full documents.

If they go with Windows-specific stuff then they have chosen technologies that are less compatible, not more.

How do you work that out? As somebody who has worked in IT (in several different sectors such as manufacturing, Distribution, FMCG to name 3)by far the most prevalent and popular front end is MS based.

As others have said above, get your kid a laptop running some version of MS Windows and MS office.

> If they go with Windows-specific stuff then they have chosen technologies that are less compatible, not more.

How do you work that out?

Quite simply really.

Not everyone uses Windows, ergo if Solution A only works on Windows (and then probably only on Internet Explorer), and Solution B works on any browser on any modern platform regardless of OS, then Solution A is less universally compatible than Solution B.

Put another way, would YouTube be as successful if you could only watch it from a Windows PC?

Not everyone uses Windows,

Really 🙄

Not everyone uses Windows, ergo if Solution A only works on Windows (and then probably only on Internet Explorer), and Solution B works on any browser on any modern platform regardless of OS, then Solution A is less universally compatible than Solution B.

But your mixing browsers up with the operating platform. I use Windows mainly however I seldom use IE.

You said

If they go with Windows-specific stuff then they have chosen technologies that are less compatible, not more.

Compatible with what? Windows is by far (whether we like it or not) the most popular operating system in use. You are infering that by choosing it that you are at a disadvantage due its limited compatibility.
What do you mean?

School IT is routed in about 1998, so they’ll expect you to have a PC with Word and Excel, not some other computer with different software. Not a good thing, but a fact you won’t be able to change.

I’d suggest an old school ‘computer’ whatever, simply because learning to type on a tablet is daft.

Get a £250 Windows laptop. Rubbish for getting things done, but ideal for your child to learn on in parallel to what their school does.

My all means get an iPad for messing about on as well, they are ace fun.

Get him an iMac, not fair to make him struggle doing docs and stuff on an iPad. Get him an iPad for when he is travelling.

School IT is routed in about 1998, so they’ll expect you to have a PC with Word and Excel, not some other computer with different software. Not a good thing, but a fact you won’t be able to change.

Why is it a bad thing?

Get a £250 Windows laptop. Rubbish for getting things done

Rubbish for what things?

As a teacher work just gave me an iPad to check out it’s possibilities to be used in the classroom. Conclusion great as a conduit of information but pretty pants for kids level serious work. think equations etc.

Got the iPad in June, bought a Acer One 567(?) in August.

But your mixing browsers up with the operating platform. I use Windows mainly however I seldom use IE.

Really 🙄

I mentioned ActiveX components earlier. Which means IE.

I don’t think any of the other leading browsers run ActiveX by default (thankfully).

You are infering that by choosing it that you are at a disadvantage due its limited compatibility.
What do you mean?

It was a response to mickyfinn suggesting that supporting high-end niche “Flashy gadgets” (like an iPad) was lower priority than “compatibility for the masses”.

My point is that not all of the “masses” use Windows. Universal solutions would be better as they are then compatible with Windows, high-end things like iPads, and low-end things like crusty old *nix laptops.

And Android. 😀

*glitchy bump*

pretty pants for kids level serious work. think equations etc.

?? Pretty sure iPads can do sums.

Windows 8 is out at the end of the month. So i’d wait for that before making a choice.

My point is that not all of the “masses” use Windows. Universal solutions would be better as they are then compatible with Windows,

What do you mean by “universal solutions” and what does ActiveX have to do with anything? from a users perspective a browser is a browser, the operating platform is largelly irrelevant and their experience will be based on the MS applications such as Excel and Word.
Whether you agree or not they are overwhelmingly the most common and have the greatest compatibility which is in contrast to what you said.
Its no use having a piece of software that is “compatible” with everything that does not have the look and feel that the vast majority of users are used to and like.
Given its popularity compatibility is not an issue anyway.

What do you mean by “universal solutions” and what does ActiveX have to do with anything?

I fear you didn’t read the thread.

My original point was that Word/Excel compatibility was okay on the iPad, but I’d be worried about hooking into antiquated school IT, which “may involve flash, activex plugins, badly written sites that only work in IE, or even straight Windows programs”.

I did actually hence my comment.

iPads have been far more popular than many people thought they would be (me included) and they have sparked a whole industry of tablets, many of which are more useful commercially than the iPad.
The iPad version of Excel is pretty much unusable to anyone other than a diehard Apple fan who would be prepared to overlook any shortcomings and perceive them as features. The Word processor is better but the tablet format is never going to be conducive to real data or text input.

GrahamS you appear to be mixing up The real world with some ideal.
/Dream…
Kid I need a computer for School Dad…
Dad OK I’ll buy the parts and install Fedora and open Office for you. it’s safe secure and will do almost everything you need school wise.

/Reality….
Kid I need a Computer for School Dad…
Dad hops in car off to PC World!

That is the Majority(Shouldn’t have used masses before) the Schools will cater for with their limited budgets.

I can’t recall seeing any learning platform in use that relies on ActiveX controls. The ones I see on a day to day basis eg Moodle, Blackboard, use Java and HTML 5.

/Dream…
Kid I need a computer for School Dad…
Dad OK I’ll buy the parts and install Fedora and open Office for you. it’s safe secure and will do almost everything you need school wise.

Thats a strange dream!

Indeed it is, They’d probably buy a Mac 😀