I admit it wouldn’t be ideal but it’s possible. In a very poor example it’s like saying no one would go for an ebb when track ends are simpler, easier and cheaper but we know people are happy with both… Again, yes its a poor example

And what would you change? Rohloff have a proven, reliable product. Lighter would be good (and Rohloff supposedly had one in the works a few years back) but difficult as Shimano have shown. Cheaper would be good (but not at the expense of reliability – difficult as Shimano have shown)

As was posted a couple of years ago, a 400/7 Speedhub might be nice, but (unless I’ve misinterpreted) doesn’t the Speedhub cope with more torque than an Alfine because it gears down for 10/14 gears?

Basically, for the same reason that Ford don’t make a super car for £10k. Some things are just expensive to make properly – if you’ve ever seen an exploded diagram or the video of Rohloff internals, the amount of precision gubbins in there is amazing.

It’s not economies of scale either – Rohloff have made almost 200,000 hubs, they’re already mass produced.

I’m surprised Rohloff haven’t produced a ‘premium’ hub with titanium gear shafts & fasteners.

I’m surprised Rohloff haven’t produced a ‘premium’ hub with titanium gear shafts & fasteners.

Well, they have been developing a 170mm fatbike hub.

Are you not talking about the Alfine 8 speed hub? I have one on my commuting bike and it is great.

Would not really want one on my mountain bike though as the rear wheel is heavy and it is harder to hop over logs and rocks so it would get a bit of a bashing. I also would not want one as it goes best with smooth pedalling that I do not think suits mountain biking where you have to change power in a much more aggressive/erratic way than what I use the Alfine for on the road.

so it would get a bit of a bashin

My Alfine 8 is going to a gravity Enduro next week. They can take more punishment than you think. Not sure what you mean about aggressive and erratic peddling either. That’s not something to aim for on any bike – but dont see why an Alfine would suffer any more than a normal drive?

I’m surprised Rohloff haven’t produced a ‘premium’ hub with titanium gear shafts & fasteners.

There have been prototypes. Problem was that it would end up double the price for a couple of hundred g in weight saving, and it wouldn’t be as strong, so didn’t go any further.

The Fatbike hub is interesting – it’s the same internals in a wider shell, with extended LH axle and shifting rod, so a relatively simple version.

My Alfine 8 has amazed me; three years and a few thousand miles of solid abuse and I only serviced it because I wanted to.

Jumps and climbs well; maybe lose out a bit on the descents.
I have converted another bike to 1 x 10 and like that as well so who knows what the answer is?!

A 500% Nuvincini hubs is what’s needed but about 800gms less than the current 360 % version

I mean it is harder to unweight the rear wheel so the rim gets bashed more. Not the hub which seems pretty tough.

You might not want to use one but there are at least two of us on here with alfine equipped full suspension bikes and I met a guy with a rolly on a transition something or other last weekend.

It’s all about choice

The only issue I have with my Alfine full susser is pinch flats. I have to run 45 PSI in the back tyre to avoid getting flats on rock gardens. At this pressure I can forget about it though and just plough on through. Yes I could go tubeless but rather avoid all that mess and faff if I can.

Hey Saccades relax. My experience not yours.

I too fear / hate taking the rear wheel out on the alfine and run a higher pressure… Great minds eh?

I too fear / hate taking the rear wheel out on the alfine

I have stopped taking a spanner and tube out with me now. If I get a puncture (rare) I patch it with the wheel still attached. If its not fixable I push back to the car. Does help that where I ride its never a long walk.

Anything Shimano brings out seems to be obsolete within a few years – doesn’t sit comfortable with me!

Er… What exactly has been obsoleted?

I’ve got an Alfine 8 in a Niner Sir9. It’s not that healthy now but still fine. It is an acquired taste with definite drawbacks but I’m glad I’ve got one bike setup like that. Others have mentioned breaking rear derailleurs is a non issue so what’s the point. The point for me is that our shitty mud around these parts means that on gloopy days a conventional derailleur setup often stops shifting after about 15-20miles until you can get it home and clean it properly rather than just poking it with a stick. The Alfine bike just keeps on shifting away. What I don’t like about the setup most is the faff of slackening the ebb in the Niner to remove the wheel to the point that I actively avoid doing it unless necessary.

What I’d love Rohloff to make would be a version with a few less gears (or range of gears) sacrificed for a little less weight for the mtb market. And maybe lose the twist shift. Rohloff puts the 1:1 gear ratio in a much better place in the range than Alfine for MTB riding in my opinion.

Er… What exactly has been obsoleted?

Di2 (in it’s dura ace 7900 guise)
Saint hubs/mechs

What I’d love Rohloff to make would be a version with a few less gears (or range of gears) sacrificed for a little less weight

+1

but keep the range for me?

Alfine 8 gears with a Rohloff range….

Oh and the trigger shifter of the Alfine 11. Don’t like the fact I have to back off when shifting to an easier gear as I am normally hitting a steep upwards incline. It makes sense for the spring loaded shift to select a harder gear as your not likely to be torquing the pedals in this scenario.

Has anyone got any comments on what was so wrong the Alfine 11?

A lot wider range, is it any less reliable than the 8, or is ti something else??

Has anyone got any comments on the Alfine 11? A lot wider range, is it any less reliable than the 8?

I was going to replace my ageing 8 with an 11. But the reliability issues you frequently hear have made me think twice. That and the silly positioning of the 1:1 gear at 5th out of 11 gears. Alfine 8 also has the 1:1 at 5th so all the extra range of the 11 is above the 1:1 point. As one of my main reasons for changing would be to get more range low down I would be forced to use a silly pair of chainring and sprocket and completely blow the recommended ratio out of the water (not that I’m sure that it would make much difference going to less than 1.9).

Interesting info on Rohloff on Wikipedia –

On the 1996 IFMA in Cologne, Rohloff announced a 14-speed gear hub with a weight of 1700 grams. At the time, the gear hub with the greatest number of speeds was the fragile 3700 gram 12 speed Sachs Elan (discontinued by 2000), made by the hub-gear manufacturer Sachs (later acquired by SRAM). A year later Rohloff presented a workable prototype at the 1997 IFMA and won a crate of champagne from the employees at Sachs, who had bet against them the year before. The managing director of the dominant cycling component manufacturer Shimano approached Rohloff and asked: “Shimano could release a 14 speed gear hub onto the market tomorrow, but it would weigh double as much as yours” – “How do you manage this?”[1]

I’ve got a Rohloff on my Helius but, TBH, I think I could make do with one with say 4 widely spaced gears, not 14.

Would make a huge weight saving.

Rachel

The only thing I don’t like about my Alfine hub is that I tend to puncture a lot

I don’t really understand why as it’s not that much heavier, especially when you factor in my bodyweight

3700 gram

wow

I’ve used an Alfine 11 on my fatbike and have just ignored that recommendation. I was initially a bit concerned (given the potential torque loadings of a fatbike) but it’s never been an issue.

You do hear a lot of reliability problems (actually it’s usually about the pawls slipping which seems to be a result of cable slippage or dirt in that part of the system) but I’ve not had much problems with mine. Since everything is in one unit rather than distributed as in a derailleur system it’s easy just to say “it’s the hub” rather than one of the subsystems within the hub.

Having the 1:1 ratio where it is is probably due to how they (Shimano) developed it, to get the 11 gears there’s a funny double shift between 6 & 7 – you can feel a different “clunk” when you change gear – I think it’s due to there being a second planetary gear for the extra (upper) gears.

I found the gap between gears to be too big with the recommended 1:9 ratio but swapped out for a larger sprocket and it’s fine, even though I’d spin out on downhills but then I’d prefer to coast at those speeds. I don’t use mine off-road, it’s on the commuter where high speed isn’t what I’m after. A couple of years in and about 4K Km and I’m happy with it. Not sure if I’d get another one but it’s likely to last me a good few years yet.

Problem was that it would end up double the price for a couple of hundred g in weight saving, and it wouldn’t be as strong

I’m don’t think it would be anywhere near double, if you’ve got the machines to make the shafts in steel, you only have to add the extra cost of the raw materials & buying in Ti fasteners wouldn’t be much extra, I recon cost to Rohloff would be less than £100 per hub easily & getting the weight below a deraileur group would be kudos & a selling point.

cost to Rohloff would be less than £100 per hub

Even if this was true, (and I think Ti needs new tooling which wears out more quickly and I suspect the increase would be more – a ti bolt is at least 4 times the price of a steel one), then that’s more like £250 by the time you’ve added on their margin, distributor margin and retailer margin.

And they used to claim to be no heavier than a (heavy) conventional set up – there was a marketing image with a balance scale that I can’t seem to find on the web now. However, there will always be a lighter conventional setup that someone can use to beat them with – you can always drill more out of a conventional kit.

Titanium is a whole lot harder to machine than steel, so it’s not just the materials cost – and probably couldn’t just do like-for-like parts, probably had to change some too.

Years ago I did a like-for-like weight test – my bike had a normal XT derailleur system, which I took off and replaced with a Rohloff, keeping only the cranks and big ring, and I weighed everything. The weight increase was about 150g I think.