sputnik – Member
Emsz, be grateful you live in a country where you can enjoy your magic carpet ride without fear of getting stoned to death for your actions.

What has that got to do with anything?

sputnik – Member
Emsz, be grateful you live in a country where you can enjoy your magic carpet ride without fear of getting stoned to death for your actions.

Lifer – Member
What has that got to do with anything?

+1

Some places are worse, so we should be happy with inequality? That’s some pretty amazing logic right there.

We far too often reflect on what we don’t have and not on what we do have.
Calling the people that run the country idiots for not keeping all of the people happy all of the time is pretty amazing logic.

So many twist and turns this thread, i’m going back to the where Emsz described a naked body, I enjoyed that bit 😛

Your claim is that our inequality is not as bad as others inequality so we should be grateful odd argument
No one is expecting the govt should [] or could] keep everyone happy but they could treat everyone equally -they have the power to do the later if not the former

No one has made the argument you just attacked.

What a strange word homophobia is. I suspect that the majority of people who are accused of being homophobic are not in any way at all afraid of homosexuals but rather have a personal view that it is not something they agree with. For whatever reason. That does not make them homophobic it just means they have a different view.

I would also suspect that the reason behind civil ceremonies banning religious content is because they are intended to provide a marriage service without the religious bits because people find that offensive. Quite possibly the driving forces behind the civil ceremonies being introduced were strongly anti-religious and therefore wante to create an opportunity for people to have the ceremony wthout the “hypocrisy” of a religious service just so that they could get married.

I don’t really understand why people who are so strongly anti-religious even consider wanting to get married in a church either. Why do that?

Chill Junkyard, I’m attacking no arguments, just saying be grateful for what you have…

what you have is less than what a heterosexual has ..I dont see why you should be grateful for being treated less equally than others in this society

I could steal one of your bikes and say hey be grateful I did not steal them all for example…its a weak argument but I can see your point of view.

this is mye chilled you read some of my other stuff 😯

sputnik – Member
Chill Junkyard, I’m attacking no arguments, just saying be grateful for what you have…

If the step were not being taken, if the stumbling-forward ache were not alive, the bombs …would not fall, the throats would not be cut. Fear the time when the bombs stop falling while the bombers live – for every bomb is proof the spirit has not died. And fear the time when the strikes stop while the great owners live – for every little beaten strike is proof that the step is being taken. And this you can know – fear the time when the Manself will not suffer and die for a concept, for this one quality is the foundation of Manself, and this one quality is man, distinctive in the universe.

sputnik – Member

Chill Junkyard, I’m attacking no arguments, just saying be grateful for what you have…

Your claim that Emsz should be “grateful” that she won’t be stoned to death is quite frankly absurd.

I’ve decided not to track you down and set your house on fire……..how “grateful” does that make you ?

Very grateful Ernie. Thank you.
Ps Why did you want to set my house on fire and what changed your mind?

Pps Absurd you say?

And if you can’t be bothered to click linky:

Sudan is one country that uses stoning as part of their punishment for homosexual behavior, particularly against women. Lesbian women in Sudan are stoned and given thousands of lashes on their very first offense. They are buried up to their neck in the ground while being pelted with stones at the head.

woosh you are somewhat missing the point there..no one is arguing that homosexuals are not treated worse in other countries but your argument is that they should be grateful that our unequal treatment is not as bad as other countries unequal treatment and they should accept theirlot so to speak.

As others have tried to show this is a weak argument.

Ernie and I could kidnap you and agree to break only one of your legs rather than them both would you be grateful we only did one leg or angry we did one leg?

Very grateful Ernie. Thank you.

You see…..be thankful for small mercies.

Ps Why did you want to set my house on fire and what changed your mind?

Well I was thinking of ways which I could murder you, as they do in Sudan. Did you know that you can get away with murder in Sudan ? IIRC they haven’t had a government in Sudan for 17 years, so pretty much anything goes.

But then I remembered that I don’t live in Sudan, so I changed my mind. Lucky ol’ you sputnik eh ?

To clear one thing up, I’m NOT saying homosexuals should be treated differently, OK? And agree that they should be able to marry just like anybody else, OK?
What I AM saying however is look on the briiiight side of life, ta da, la ta ta da ta da.

And it is not just Sudan:The following are countries that find homosexuality punishable by death: Mauritania, Sudan, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Iran, Somalia, United Arab Emirates, parts of Nigeria and parts of Malaysia .

So we all agree that homosexuals could have it worse, much worse. We mostly agree that they should have it better and at least have access to the same institutions the rest of us either participate in or otherwise dependent on personal choice not sexual orientation.

Fair summary?

I reckon.

Good summary Atlaz 🙂

Fair summary?

Homosexuals have always been able to marry in this country.
In fact, it has generally been encouraged, particularly in the institution of which the OP originally complained (the Conservative Party).

Edit: but fair summary too atlaz

atlaz – Member
So we all agree that homosexuals could have it worse, much worse. We mostly agree that they should have it better and at least have access to the same institutions the rest of us either participate in or otherwise dependent on personal choice not sexual orientation.

NO, just a limited number of people who have botheresd to read a cycling forum, which in no way is the rest of the uk society.

Like ive said before, perhaps ask your gay freinds for details of homophobic bullying, where they have been sidelined or ignored for promotion, where they have ben bullied out of their jobs, beaten up on the street etc.

Its nice to see support for the gay comunity on here, just perhaps it can spread into the real world someday.

I wonder how WH feels about all this?

let homosexuals have the same rights as heterosexuals, there’s no reason not to.
but can happy people and girls with the name have the word ‘Gay’ back please.

Why not ask some non-religious homophobes, of which there are many?

I’ve no doubt there are, but for the past couple of hundred (thousand?) years homophobia has been accepted/embraced by society, hetero was the norm, anything else was to be scorned, maybe you even got locked up for it (if not worse) There’s a few dinosaurs lagging behind who find still take offense at such things but where do you get your ideals and values from? Family and friends mostly, i reckon there’s a fair few ‘isms and various bigotry handed down father to son and this is one of those that is stil lingering but hopefully will soon be wiped out. Now I’m wondering who were the main drivers behind the original anti gay legislation/stuff? Was it only religious factions or were there otheers?

Don’t want to start an attack on religion BTW was just something I wondered while reading the thread.

Mind you, recent events have shown you still get people at the top residing in the closet but are publicly anti gay – quite strange.

but can happy people and girls with the name have the word ‘Gay’ back please.

Boys name as well.

Quite possibly the driving forces behind the civil ceremonies being introduced were strongly anti-religious and therefore wante to create an opportunity for people to have the ceremony wthout the “hypocrisy” of a religious service just so that they could get married.

also people who are religious and maybe even found a congregation who accepted them but ultimatley the religion’s head man decided their sexuality/lifestyles/being married before, excluded them from marrying their chosen partner. They of course can get partnerised at the moment but even if they themselves are religious they can’t have owt religious at the ceremony, not even a dodgy pop song crooned by some bloke from stoke apparently.

tru dat.
Gay Byrne (oirish TV chap) is the only male Gay i know of.

i work with a gay, people dont even like saying her name when told what it is

perhaps you could explain why i am a hypocrite

I can’t explain why you’re a hypocrite – you’ll have to look into your own soul for that one.

How you’re a hypocrite is that you talk about tolerance like it’s a good thing but advocate a position that is intolerant of religious freedom. Bigots, on the other hand, never claimed to be tolerant in the first place.

EDIT : Actually no, i’m not going there. Apologies to anyone who read that. That was something for another thread.

How you’re a hypocrite is that you talk about tolerance like it’s a good thing but advocate a position that is intolerant of religious freedom.

they are free to do and believe in what they want but they are not free to impose that view on others who dont believe their big book of truths.

I would not force the churches to marry gay people for example however they have no right to decide what others do re marriage.

Tolerance is great but obviously there will be a limit and conflict when it impacts or violates other principles. I am intolerant of paedophilia ,the freedom to rape , murder, steal etc but I dont see why this makes me a hypocrite

Have some total awe from me for your supercilious answer , just how smug/proud did it make you feel? I did look into my soul but it is empty without your approval 🙄
See this is the problem with STW, can we not just accept that some things are complicated [ very little is an absolute] and explore them openly and honestly without behaving like smug arses ?
I only can if you can or else I treat folk how they treat me…well anything else would be hypocrisy right Kona 😉