Chances of an adverse reaction to the vaccine..I’d say given 50000 have taken it so far and it’s deemed safe, probably reasonably low. Whether it causes us all to become zombies in 6 months, who knows..

Chances of long covid, a debilitating illness ..1 in 10 cases apparently

Chances of myocarditis of the heart if you get covid.. Well according to one report I saw it was 50% ..

I’m more than happy to be getting a dose..

Squaredog – do you have any graphics on hospitalisation rates from 1st/2nd wave?

Im down in E Sussex, which has been one of the lowest hit throughout the pandemic. In the last few weeks its gone crazy though. I know of 5 households in the village with positive cases. In all cases the vector seems to have been 6th form age children.

Well according to one report I saw it was 50% ..

If you can remember where it was I’d appreciate a link to show my doctor.

I think someone (pondlife?) had suggested earlier in the thread that London was the region hit hardest during the first wave of the pandemic.

If we are using these metrics, he/she appears to be correct.

I did some numbers in a post a couple of days ago that also appeared to show this contention is correct.

Nobeerinthefridge
Free Member

There’s no hate btw, just frustration at people making decisions without being informed.

Speaking for myself, I absolutely do hate anyone and everyone who’s trying to discourage people from getting the vaccine, and who actively works to undermine health measures. Doing it yourself is one thing, trying to get other people to do it? Hate is the proportionate response.

There will be a high number of adverse reactions, but the vast majority will be mild. It is simply a reflection of the massive numbers being produced.
It however shouldn’t put people off the vaccine, as anyone who has ever read the pack insert for any medicine will tell you, the list is terrifying.
my particular favourite found in a load is ‘may cause death’
Judging from the various trial numbers and also the numbers the Chinese and Russians are coming out with (not that those 2 examples should give any faith in safety reporting) there will have been way over 1 million given one of the various vaccines by now

I develop drugs for a living. It’s my day job. And I will state that I believe everyone should have the right to remove treatment consent. The only time that falls over is for children, where matters are more complex. But I don’t believe in mandatory vaccination. I certainly believe in vaccination though!

The Moderna vaccine reported Grade 3 adverse event at about 2%. Grade 3 is severe, so for 1/50 it may not be the most pleasant experience. For 1/50 with infection, worse is true. For 1/200 the outcome is much much worse.

I think they have to be expecting sae’s at 1-2% for the traditional vaccines. Which has to be in line with normal levels anyway
Edit, the moderna levels are way higher than the astra stage 2 trial. But the scale was significantly smaller

When sampling raw sewage was one of my tasks I was vacinated against a long list of tropical illnesses. One of them gave a reaction not far short of flu, but I didn’t catch any tropical diseases. 🙂

I had the H1N1 vaccine, one of roughly a tenth of the French population who turned up to be vaccinated. If you think take up is likely to be low in the UK I reckon it wil be a lot lower in France. I’ll turn up for the Covid vaccine, the lower you think turnout will be the more reason to go yourself.

The UK has some of the highest influenza vaccine take-up in the world (about 75% of target and about 75% effective). SARS-CoV-2 won’t be short of people who will want vaccination. It’s just media noise.

Those reactions in full – it might smart a bit but that’s your immune system at work.

Grade 3 (severe) events greater than or equal to 2% in frequency after the first dose included injection site pain (2.7%), and after the second dose included fatigue (9.7%), myalgia (8.9%), arthralgia (5.2%), headache (4.5%), pain (4.1%) and erythema/redness at the injection site (2.0%).

It is simply a reflection of the massive numbers being produced.
It however shouldn’t put people off the vaccine, as anyone who has ever read the pack insert for any medicine will tell you, the list is terrifying.

The problem is that the covid sceptics, anti maskers etc will seize on every example as proof it’s dangerous

Agreed, can’t have it both ways though. Hide the numbers and it makes things worse. Plus regulators won’t let you

Seems to bear out points above

WSJ write up of long haul covid
You would hope this might make people think of the consequences of not having the vaccine

TiRed – thought you may be interested in my friend: She is an NHS worker, who (she’s pretty sure she caught C19 last week of January with all the symptoms except loss of smell and taste) still has the antibodies months later. She is tested often due to now working on a covid ward.

You would hope this might make people think of the consequences of not having the vaccine

Are you against anyone making their own informed decision?

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/nov/22/nhs-patients-at-risk-as-icus-routinely-understaffed-doctors-warn

Told you…

What a f***ING farce of an afternoon I’ve had. I’ll share my experience in the hope it helps others…. And maybe sharing will help me feel better.
Upon waking today my 3 year old daughter had a cough. It seemed better at breakfast but returned at lunch. Wife and talk it over.. Decide it probably fits ‘continuous cough’. Quickly online I book a test at the nearest centre, 1.1 miles away, walk in testing at Streatham common. No 3yo will enjoy the test so wife and I try and explain what will happen, calmly. Leaving wife with 5 yo and 20 wo, I head off with sweets for bribes, Peppa pig on the phone, and the very nervous 3 yo. Arrive. Directed to a bay in a marquee….all fine until this point. Now it all goes wrong. In the next bay a little kid is really upset…. Understandable. His incredibly selfish mother is going batsh1t crazy at him, ranting that he has to do the test. Now it’s going to be a stressful experience for a little kid, and I’ll vouch for the fact that it’s also stressful for parents.. But FFS,AS A PARENT YOU HAVE TO MANAGE THAT STRESS. SHOUTING AT YOUR CHILD FOR 20 MINUTES ISN’T GOING TO HELP THEM…. AND HAS A BIG IMPACT ON OTHER KIDS IN THE MARQUEE! I spent 30 minutes just cuddling and trying to calm my now crying daughter before giving up and leaving. I’ve now ordered a home test kit…. But the 3yo (a determined little minx at the best of times) currently won’t consider that even. I’m not convinced I’d have succeeded if I’d tried, but I’m wishing I’d got in the car for the 6 mile journey to the nearest drive in centre, where I’d have had my daughter in familiar surroundings (the car) and without the distractions of other SELFISH F***ING IDIOTS! I chose the walk in as it was closer and had more slots/less demand…. My mistake.

The 5yo is now crying that she’ll miss school, the 3 yo is determined she won’t do the test….15 days of self isolation awaits….oh balls.

If you need to get a little’un tested, I hope you don’t have batsh1t crazy people in the test centre, and I hope your little’un doesn’t get too upset.

@cinnamon_girl
I didn’t say that, I believe everyone should be accurately educated in the risks of having the vaccine against the risks from having the virus.
eliminating the hysteria and misinformation should lead to a simple conclusion which is that the vaccine should be taken

eliminating the hysteria and misinformation should lead to a simple conclusion which is that the vaccine should be taken

It’s a generalisation currently though? What about complications with existing illness, do we have any data in that?  Mrs K is in he No camp because she has Lupus.  A bad reaction to a vaccine could be very serious for her, and the trials of that combo could take years to work through (Lupus displays very varied symptoms across individuals).  In her world she’s a better chance of everyone else taking it to avoid a C19 infection by overall reduced chance of transmission.

Yes agreed. Where medical conditions are there then consultants have that decision. My cousin will be in exactly the same place as she has sle too.
for people without medical issues then they should work on the general risk

It’s really quite simple. If you don’t have a genuine medical reason for not being vaccinated (supported by a certificate of exemption from your GP) then you either take the vaccination or self-isolate permanently.

In her world she’s a better chance of everyone else taking it to avoid a C19 infection by overall reduced chance of transmission.

Absolutely. I won’t be taking the vaccine for myself, but I absolutely will take it as soon as possible, to help stop community transmission and help people currently shielding (even if the government have issued some double speak already about them not shielding) get more of their lives back.

Can anyone link to confirm that these first generation vaccines will stop spread or just protect the person vaccinated? Genuine question that would affect my own personal decision.

Essentially it should be that by protecting the individual it should mean they don’t get infected and then are not able to pass it on.
it is possible that someone could be infected and in the short time before their immune system hopefully clears the virus they could infect someone else.
But it should reduce the numbers they could infect if not eliminate it completely.
plus if you are immune then you automatically reduce the population that can be infected. Herd immunity.

That’s the intention – if you can’t catch it then you can’t pass it on.

https://www.vaccines.gov/basics/work/protection

…and then, maybe, perhaps I can go to the pub.

I just want to be able to go out for a walk on the moors with an old crossword and a pen in my bag and then call in when it’s quiet, sit in the corner, drink my pint and then wander home.

Please.

Are you against anyone making their own informed decision?

That clearly wasn’t what he was saying.

How about you?

Please.

It’s glib to say… but you’ve earned it.

@Kryton57

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55022288

There’s hope. There may be alternatives on the way for those that can’t be vaccinated. Sorry, don’t know if that would be applicable with lupus, but best wishes anyway.

It’s glib to say… but you’ve earned it.

I know, I’m just playing to the gallery there 🙂

I do really miss it…

It’s really quite simple. If you don’t have a genuine medical reason for not being vaccinated (supported by a certificate of exemption from your GP) then you either take the vaccination or self-isolate permanently.

As much as I’d like to see that happen, it’ll never be mandatory. Luckily I reckon the vast majority of sensible, rational folks will be happy to take it.

then you either take the vaccination or self-isolate permanently.

Even the 30% -50% of folk who’re naturally immune? seems harsh

Luckily I reckon the vast majority of sensible, rational folks will be happy to take it.

As with lockdown, despite the media – and social media – fixation with the minority who don’t go along with it, the vast majority will keep doing everything they can to restrict the spread of the virus, including having the vaccine.

“naturally immune”

ROFLCOPTERS are go

@loum thanks for posting that, thats hugely encouraging for people with such issues.

Even the 30% -50% of folk who’re naturally immune? seems harsh

Say what now? Maybe I’ve missed it but how are we figuring out 30-50% are naturally immune? Being immune isn’t the same as being asymptomatic…

It’s just a stupid troll

Can anyone link to confirm that these first generation vaccines will stop spread or just protect the person vaccinated? Genuine question that would affect my own personal decision

What difference does it make either way as to why you would or wouldn’t take it?

If it helps reduce your own chances of dieing or suffering long covid then surely thats good? The whole point is to stop this disease killing people as with the flu vaccine, if everyone had the vaccine it doesn’t matter if you can still spread as everyone would have a high degree of protection and the rate of deaths would be way lower.

@cinamongirl there will be non-vaccination options for protection for people who have poor immune systems. The antibodies have already been proven highly efficacious. They’re now being tested for protection.

For the vaccines, they have not shown evidence of reduced transmission. The trials were powered only on looking at emergence of symptomatic infection. For that, and maybe other things, they are very effective. Prevention of hospital admissions would be a big outcome.

And crikey could go to the pub, safe that sars-cov-2 is not going to add to his workload. He surely deserves it. The malaria vaccine works to reduce severity of infection, it doesn’t really prevent them.

But, having said all that, I do believe that having antibodies WILL reduce transmission, it’s just not been proven so to do. That’s actually quite a tough trial and requires a different endpoint. Be thankful that severe infections were effectively eradicated.