Do you want the perceived or data for actual?

I’m still riding those bikes. A 2010 Pitch, 2013 Chameleon, Trailstar LT and 2004 Norco Shore.

Perception is everyone is on a £5k XL carbon gnarpoon with a dropper that they can’t live without and 1x because a front derailleur is just too hard.

Yeah, in 5 years time most of will be too damn old and decrepit to pedal under our own steam.

OK boomer. (37yo millennial here)

Looking at passing riders on the south downs way last sunday it appears everyone rides a gravel bike. Seemed quite odd when a Stumpjumper bounced by…like seeing a Wrangler on a rally course. Where there’s trails a mid to long travel Canyon, YT or Turbo Levo.

I am still living in 2005.2005 26 inch heckler 90s marin 2005 Dh bike 1999 sunn steel xc bike and a few old but decent bmx bikes.still happy with no intentions of getting anything newer.i think the average bike would be a cotic or on one of some sort or a FS trail or enduro bike.ht bikes do not get as much love partly due to an aging membership base although this is a bit tongue in cheek.to be fair the soul,the scandal and other ht bikes are popular although many say they are too beaten up by ht bikes so I guess that depends where you ride.

It’s a broad church. In the shed I’ve got a jeffsy 27, an e-converted 29er rigid for commuting, a nostalgia Marin bear valley se single speed (well almost finished), a Saracen DJ frame to build and I really want an inspired trials bike. Borrowed a Trek Rail last weekend and it was a revelation for bike parks, so that’s also clouding my vision. Had a couple of CX bikes but sold em on as didn’t really gel.

They’ve realized that gravel bikes are the best tool for the majority of UK trails.

Possibly this. I’ve got a 2011 5 which I think Iv’e used twice this year, an old HT which I was using until I got a Spesh Sirrus & put some gravelly tyres on, now It’s all I’m using (when I ride from home) If I went up the Dales or NYM I’d probably use the 5.

Nah thats nonsense. Go to glentress or similar on a nice saturday.

Low to mid level hardtails of varying ages reign supreme. As the should because no bike offers more bang for your buck than a budget bike thats gets lots of people out there.

That probably says more about Glentress than the ‘average MTB’. In the last month or two, I’ve been to Cwmcarn and Afan a couple of times. Mid-priced full-sus was the overwhelming choice of bike in both places. Also, when I ride the local stuff here in S Wales, it’s more usual to bump into riders on very expensive bikes than cheap stuff.

And, thinking about it, when I visited Glentress a couple of years ago, I didn’t notice huge numbers of cheap hardtails. Do they congregate at the skills park or something? (As they might at Afan.)

I would say the average bike I normally see is a 3-4k 150mm+ travel full sus on my local rides. But as a caveat majority of my cycling is in Surrey lots of Yeti and Santa Cruz bikes.

Assuming the average rider focus is E E focused – e-bike or enduro

Assuming n+1 I’m going to guess the average collection as:

Full sus geometry du jour – may or may not be E-bike

Full sus circa mid last decade

Millennium hard tail – covers Souls etc

I think this is pretty spot on. Well for me any way I see myself as your average rider and I have a full sus, ht and gravel bike / commute because london roads are awful and I actually enjoy gravel rides.

From this morning at sherwood pines it’s either a mid range hardtail (possibly rentals but still plenty not) or ebikes.

Looking at passing riders on the south downs way last sunday it appears everyone rides a gravel bike.

Probably the best choice for the terrain…

10 old Blue Pig X. 26 obviously, Revelations. Upgraded to 11 speed slx recently.

I’ve got a Kona utility bike (Big Rove) in the garage too and a Bird Aeris 145 frame to build up when I have the cash.

I’m in Surrey, so lots of older money bags riders about. I reckon the brands I see out most are Santa Cruz, YT and Whyte. 130 to 160 full suss. Hardtail are about 30% from what I can see.

I don’t get the ‘gravel bikes are best for UK trails’. You could survive most stuff but even my local woods, a proper MTB will be 1000 times better

A longtravel, bikepacking, fat tyred gravel bike thats long, slack and has a cargo deck. Must also be in any material as long as it’s not carbon, but could be carbon some of the time. Travel between 0-180mm, but not adverse to 250mm on occasion. Simultaneously, Rigid forks and a hardtail.

I don’t get the ‘gravel bikes are best for UK trails’

Except that’s a strawman argument 😉

It’s normally agreed that ‘the from the door multi-surface stuff ‘we’ (we olduns) in the UK used to ride in the early 90s on rigid ATB/MTB bikes is also rideable/netter suited to gravel bikes today’

ie backroads, devent bridleways, towpaths, tracks, fire-roads, odd bit of singletrack.

When I got my first MTB I’d typically ride 8-10 miles road, towpath and bridleway to a fireroad and then possibly a loop around something tame like this:

OTOH I don’t see many if any arguing that gravel bikes are ‘best’ for the type of woodland trails/singletrack that are best ridden on mountain bikes*

Any ‘gravel bike can replace a mountain bike’ argument is only valid if you’re using your mountain bike primarily on backroads and gravel and as an allrounder everyday bike. In which case a gravel bike may be a better choice. Even then, they come in all flavours from monster-crossy+ to lightweight roadsters with 35Cs

*Not to say that no-one has ever claimed this, just that I haven’t seen it.

EDIT! 🤣 (Note to self: Read comments before commenting) 🤣

They’ve realized that gravel bikes are the best tool for the majority of UK trails.

‘Majority of UK trails’ is undefined.

When I got my first MTB I’d typically ride 8-10 miles road, towpath and bridleway to a fireroad and then possibly a loop around something tame like this:

That video just needs the music from American Flyers and then it would be perfect!

don’t forget your flannel shirt over your lycra when on your gravel bike. And wistfully look at those having fun on trails wishing you could have a go. But alas. Drop bars… but its ok because you rode there on the road slightly faster.

I assumed the average stw bike was something off bicycle pubes but tbh i think it’s probably a amix of FS bikes.

I’ve a 2010 Carrera Fury that’s really only used for quick bursts along the abandoned railway line next to us and a 26 ain’t dead BFe.

I do want a FS though as my work is hard on my knees (maintenance before you get all lewd) and for the past year or 2 rough trails do them no good a all, or im just getting soft in my old age.

don’t forget your flannel shirt over your lycra when on your gravel bike. And wistfully look at those having fun on trails wishing you could have a go. But alas. Drop bars… but its ok because you rode there on the road slightly faster.

Looks great fun to me…

don’t forget your flannel shirt over your lycra when on your gravel bike. And wistfully look at those having fun on trails wishing you could have a go. But alas. Drop bars… but its ok because you rode there on the road slightly faster.

🤣 I did have flannie and lycra in the winter! Point taken, I’m fortunate maybe in that I can also enjoy having fun on bikeparky trails. As well as the ATB (currently Longitude) I do have an aggro SS hardtail. Would switch it nowadays for a full-sus for playtime but can’t yet afford/justify it. Even though, my first love was/is exploring/cycling for cycling’s sake/being outdoors/getting places with no car involved. Before injury/ongoing rehab I’d typically ride 50-70 miles on any given Sunday exploring the wilds of Shropshire or Welsh Marches (including tooth-rattling Long-Mynd descents) before either camping overnight or embarking on the 40 mile back lanes, forests and towpaths home in the twilight/dark/starlight/pissing-rain/snow. Small (or big) adventures, getting away from it all, etc.

Now, of course, I can chuck the hardtail in the boot of the car and go have fun up the Mynd without the shirt or bib. But I’d miss out on the being out all day with, map and sandwich in pocket, not quite knowing where I’d wind up/whether need to hike-a-bike this next bit or not. It’s all fun for me, while realising that I’m possibly an oddity in being rarely bored, rigid – while always bored in a car.

“It’s normally agreed that ‘the from the door multi-surface stuff ‘we’ (we olduns) in the UK used to ride in the early 90s on rigid ATB/MTB bikes is also rideable/netter suited to gravel bikes today’“

By whom? Around Brighton we have miles of woodland singletrack, some steep, some jumpy, most of it rooty. All better on a MTB unless you’re being a masochist.

We also have the South Downs National Park, where I’ll agree a gravel bike may be better into a nasty headwinds but the rest of the time a MTB will be better whether it’s wet or dry, especially on the fast descents.

All better on a MTB unless you’re being a masochist.

But what is ‘better’? Easier, faster – even safer? Or challenging? I rode something recently on my gravel bike that was distinctly adrenaline-inducing, and which I got a great sense of achievement from cleaning. On my Jeffsy, or probably on any of my flat bar bikes it would have been relatively straightforward – but is that ‘better’?

29er short travel full-suss and hardtail. Lets call it down-country so I be bang on trend for once in my life!

Not seen a gravel bike on the trail yet. They sounds like they are popular so assume they are just avoiding me.

“It’s normally agreed that ‘the from the door multi-surface stuff ‘we’ (we olduns) in the UK used to ride in the early 90s on rigid ATB/MTB bikes is also rideable/netter suited to gravel bikes today’“

By whom?

by GCN…

NB Very tongue in cheek, but I have to agree with them….

I went out for only an hour this evening, but on a typical short 14k circuit similar terrain to what I would have done on my ATB in 1990. Estimate of surfaces:

20% urban/tarmac
35% bridleway/woodland path/short grass
35% back lanes and farm tracks, some potholes, mostly good.
10% fast B road

As it was dry I took my tourer (triple crankset, MTB gearing, 28c Marathons) and a rackpack for damsons and apple picks.

Now why would I ruin such a swift and light summer ride with a full susser? I could probably slightly improve it with a decent gravel bike. Nonetheless, this old bike flies and is a joy to ride on mixed terrain as long as it’s not modern MTB territory. The only eyebrow-raising moment that slowed me tonight was an unseen pothole descending a town street/not paying attention. Hand-built wheels ftw. It was a tooth-grinding ‘bang’ though. 35-40c here would have been better.

Around Brighton we have miles of woodland singletrack, some steep, some jumpy, most of it rooty. All better on a MTB unless you’re being a masochist.

Wait, let me check back to what I said:

Any ‘gravel bike can replace a mountain bike’ argument is only valid if you’re using your mountain bike primarily on backroads and gravel and as an allrounder everyday bike. In which case a gravel bike may be a better choice

Nope, no masochism? If Was riding on miles of steep and jumpy rooty woodland singletrack, OTOH? Well I often do, and I’d choose my hardtail (not even the rigid 29er) or else a full susser if I had one.

If I still lived in Northants then gravel bike might make more sense. But there’s a lot of the UK with proper MTBing available, even down in the south east of England.

I like how a modern hardtail can cover ground efficiently, feel connected and fun on easy trails but have the geometry and fork to keep you safe on gnarly trails. Big bouncy bikes make the easy stuff dull even if they’re not slow. I’ve seen a few people on gravel / CX bikes on our singletrack. On the smooth stuff the more skilled riders are pretty impressive but even they get foiled once it gets bumpy.

Scarily an eMTB with loads of suspension can actually be fun where a similar full-sus without a motor would be boring because of the extra speed the motor can bring.

Wait…gravel bikes are just for shit rural roads, right?!?

Take them on singletrack?! What will they think of next. 🙂

And, thinking about it, when I visited Glentress a couple of years ago…

Well, take it from me, having been there at the weekend it was rammed with folk on hardtails. Ancient 26 loaners up to mid range 29ers.

And another Pitch owner who seemed very happy to see mine 🙂

Well, take it from me, having been there at the weekend it was rammed with folk on hardtails. Ancient 26 loaners up to mid range 29ers.

I used to ride my Scale (26″ HT) there and some bits were a bit rough, but nothing that needed a FS bike.

NB May have changed over the years, eg CyB added a weird rough rock paved section right near the trail head, which I could only assume had been built to justify a FS bike as the rest of the trails were definitely HT terrain.

When I went to Coed-y-Brenin a few weeks ago it was packed pull of cheap old hardtails, only saw 2 people on Santa Cruz and a few on hired e bikes. Quite a refreshing change from bike park Peaslake.

Well, take it from me, having been there at the weekend it was rammed with folk on hardtails. Ancient 26 loaners up to mid range 29ers.

Its horses for courses though. Hang about Buzzards Best and Berm Baby Berm and yes there will be loads of hardtails. Head up to the mast and and then down the enduro trails and you will see lots of mid-travel 29ers and barely any hardtails.

Yeah, in 5 years time most of will be too damn old and decrepit to pedal under our own steam.

OK boomer. (37yo millennial here)

Latest meme* is that only those who use the word ‘boomer’ are old-fashioned enough to be ‘boomers’ 😉

*This may have changed since this morning.

Back to the thread, so is there an ‘average‘ STW ‘one bike in the garage’?

As per OP

What do you think is the new mr.average, just one bike in the garage ride on your trail and what is the cost of their bike? Has the sport become more expensive on average?

What do you think is the new mr.average, just one bike in the garage ride on your trail and what is the cost of their bike? Has the sport become more expensive on average?

C2W money hardtail/FS now the limit is more flexible. I dont think the cost of entry has increased much over inflation, when i started, the standard advice for setting a your budget for a good starter bike was 3 weeks wages, so around £900ish then (based on average salary in 2000), vs £1350 now, which is a bit more than Bossnut money.

C2W money hardtail/FS now the limit is more flexible. I dont think the cost of entry has increased much over inflation, when i started, the standard advice for setting a your budget for a good starter bike was 3 weeks wages, so around £900ish then (based on average salary in 2000), vs £1350 now, which is a bit more than Bossnut money.

Agreed, Halfords have a really good Boardman full susser for 2021 for £1k, less for a hardtail. There are 10% discount codes with BC etc and if you can get it through cycle to work its even cheaper.

Agreed, Halfords have a really good Boardman full susser for 2021 for £1k, less for a hardtail.

Interesting to see how quickly it sells out, amazing VFM.

Has the sport become more expensive on average?

No. For each individal it may have done. You’re older, richer and now you are more into it; so are your friends – you’ll spend more.
When I started I spent 600 on a used hardtail as my first “proper mtb”. I thought that was a huge amount of money. These days I’m more likely to think “only 600 more gets me up to the next spec level” or “ooh, week’s guided holiday”.

when i started, the standard advice for setting a your budget for a good starter bike was 3 weeks wages

I’ve not heard this rule before, but 3 weeks wages now gets you a far better bike than it did at any poin tin the past. The only modern issue is people who might get the “wrong” bike as there is such a vast difference between them these days, whether thats a big enduro bruiser when they are a beginner, a hardtail because they feel they must learn on one, etc.

If you don’t know what exactly you want to do, it’s hard to get that goldilocks bike with no experience.

The only modern issue is people who might get the “wrong” bike as there is such a vast difference between them these days

Not at that budget I don’t think. Things only really start to specialise once you cross the £2k RRP mark, below that everything will do a decent job of ‘mountain biking’. Obviously folk trying to get stuff on sale/NOS clouds that, but that’s why we need decent lbs’

Not at that budget I don’t think. Things only really start to specialise once you cross the £2k RRP mark, below that everything will do a decent job of ‘mountain biking’.

Good point, though I was thinking second hand when I wrote that. £1350 pre-corona got you a decent 4-5 year old bike in good working order, if a little bashed up or non-matching visually.
While the newbie will be able to distinguish between a Giant Reign and an Anthem, they might not understand quite how limiting each would be in either direction.

I’d be willing to bet that someone looking at spending £1350 on a s/h bike won’t be going in totally blind. Either they’ll have done a bit of research or have a mate (or forum full of them) guiding them a bit, rather than someone turning up at Halfords/decathlon etc saying ‘I’d like to get into MTB, work have given me a voucher for x’

I used to ride my Scale (26″ HT) there and some bits were a bit rough, but nothing that needed a FS bike.

You don’t need a FS but it’s a lot more fun for blasting down the black/red/blue from Buzzards to Peel.

Ive still got the 26″ Kona hardtail from 11 years ago, and still have as much fun on it as I did then. Faster doesnt mean more fun.