What's a decent weight for a 140mm bike?

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 65 total)
  • What's a decent weight for a 140mm bike?
  • Premier Icon Brown
    Subscriber

    I’ve just built up a Saracen Ariel frame from ebay and it weights a solid tonne. 33lbs (on the bathroom scales…). It’s fantastic on the downhills in Wharncliffe, but a pig everywhere else and as it’s my only bike, that’s an issue. Doesn’t feel much fun hopping around, drags on the flats etc. I’m not sure how I can lighten it up without spending silly money either.

    What sort of weight is realistic for a bike like this? The Prophet I had a few years back felt loads lighter and more fun. I’m contemplating re-building my hardtail as it stands.

    GaryLake
    Member

    Depends on the build so need more details. I’ve got a Five that’s currently 28.5lbs but has been 32lb before, and more so because of the configuration rather than it being a case of pimp kit or not pimp kit.

    stevede
    Member

    Wheels and tyres are where you’ll feel that weight the most, I have an enduro that I sometimes use for trail bike duties and when in this role I use a set of arch ex rims on pro 2’s with conti barons as opposed to 721’s and dual ply der barons – the difference is night and day.
    The Ariels (well the old ones anyway) came with cheap finishing kit so more weight to be saved there, cranks maybe then the rest will be small weight savings which won’t be as good value.

    mikewsmith
    Member

    33 is either light or bloated depending on hoe you built it. Best way is time look for the obvious weight sometimes though something small will make it feel lighter

    Premier Icon Brown
    Subscriber

    The only original kit on it is the headset. Everything else is SLX/Revelations/Easton.

    I’ve been getting in to the whole enduro racing thing. Been doing ok on a hardtail this year and fancied a proper crack at it on a bouncy bike. This is going to be great on the descents, but useless on the flat sprints. I’ve done the Mega a couple of times on a Prophet I used to own and that felt like a better ‘all-round’ bike.

    Wheels are Hope-hubbed WTB rims (not overly hefty) with High Rollers. I don’t want to go over-light on the wheels or tyres for obvious reasons.

    Edit: Beginning to think I just need to look out for another Prophet.

    mattzzzzzz
    Member

    My Blur LT alloy is 28lbs @140mm front and back
    Its a lightish build though with crossmax STs and XTR drivetrain and brakeset
    Fox 32 vans on the front so could be built lighter with an air fork though
    Currently got 36talas and a dropper post on it plus wheelset change (pro 2s on flows)for winter has put it over 30lb
    Maybe nearer 31lb

    mildred
    Member

    Most magazines quote 30lb as a good weight. I personally think that’s bollox because there are far too many variables. For example some bikes “ride” much lighter than their weights would suggest. I have a Helius ST that weighs 34lb with air forks, air shock & trail kit, but once is switched to tubeless – it felt like it lost loads of weight. It made it very sprightly.

    Ecky-Thump
    Member

    Sounds like a perfectly reasonable weight to me.

    My Five is heavier than that at the moment mainly because of dual ply 2.5″ tyres, coil fork, dropper etc.
    I’ll be lightening it up a bit soon but wouldn’t expect to get it much less than yours at the end of it.

    My mate’s “allday XC” hardtail is pushing almost 38lbs (it’s not XC at all – just a bit lighter than his other bike!!!). XL steel frame, tough wheels, lyrics, dual plys with downhill tubes in, etc. It soon adds up.

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    I had an Ariel earlier this year so I know exactly what you mean.

    Amazing to ride on anything downhill, bloody hard work uphill. Was going to keep it as a play bike/mini DH bike but couldn’t afford the luxury.

    Did the Eastridge Gravity Enduro on mine and the course was more pedally this year, with longer sections, so not the perfect bike choice.

    GaryLake
    Member

    My Five at 28lbs is 32 Floats, x9, American Classic All Mountains with Kenda Blue Groove/Small Block 8 combo in 2.1. Not very burly and about as light as it’s going to go without throwing silly money and marginal gains at it.

    As soon as I put something like High Rollers on with a dropper post, it’s going to hit 31lb easy. I think the Five frame is a fair bit lighter than the Ariel so I don’t think you’re too far out.

    stevede
    Member

    Stans flow or arch ex rims will save you a decent bit of weight presuming your wtb rims are a decent width. Someone on here (can’t remember who) had done a season on arch ex’s including racing the mega. The flows get raced dh on the world cup circuit. Both seem an obvious option to lose weight without compromising on strength. Tyres are personal preference, depends which high rollers you have too, dual plys and/or super tacky’s (especially on the rear) will be draggy and heavy.

    Premier Icon Brown
    Subscriber

    It’s not a bike that ‘feels’ light.

    I did Eastridge on my hardtail – it was great in the twisty stuff, hopping over roots and having fun. Not sure the Ariel would be as enjoyable.

    I guess I was hoping to get a 29/30lb build with ‘normal’ bits. That way, when I stick dual plys and big brakes on it, it’ll be around 34lb.

    Maybe that’s just unrealistic without paying silly money.

    Edit: Quoted weight for the rims is the same as Stans. The tyres are single ply maxxis (double for racing) and run tubeless. I’m not prepared to go lighter with tyres. There’s a small amount of weight to be lost by switching to Stans rims, but not much.

    ojom
    Member

    If you can ride it up a local steep hill then its light enough.

    GaryLake
    Member

    Any chance of a picture so we can start pulling the spec apart for where the weight might be… Even my Orange Gyro with dropper and Hans Dampfs (tubed), bash, etc is comfortably lighter than your Ariel.

    Either that or the Bathroom scales method is so way off that it’s giving you a huge false reading.

    Premier Icon Brown
    Subscriber

    Don’t have any pictures sorry. I think the weight’s in the frame…

    Hob Nob
    Member

    I can’t imagine the frame is going to be hugely more than comparable bikes? Say for arguments sake it’s a pound more than an Orange 5, so it comes in around the 8lb mark, you can still comfortably build a bike with a frame weight like that to 30lbs without too much difficulty.

    First and foremost, ditch the dual ply tyres. You don’t need them for the Enduro’s. Worst case scenario I ran one on the back when I did the Mega & an EXO on the front & never flatted. On the Enduro’s I raced I used EXO’s front & rear & didn’t flat, and still haven’t.

    All you are doing it making the bike feel awful putting them on it.

    stevede
    Member

    List the spec, I know the cotic rocket is fairly heavy (7lbs plus) for a trail bike frame and I’ve seen peoples build come in reasonably light – 30lbs ish without compromising too much.

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    . I think the weight’s in the frame…

    Definitely.

    But because the Ariel seems to be building a reputation word-of-mouth for being such a fun play bike you should be able to sell it and get something lighter. Mine went for OK money on Pinkbike.

    I ended up with a much lighter 160mm frame.

    Premier Icon Brown
    Subscriber

    Having punctured everything bar tubeless dual plys, I’m not up for dropping them, at least not on the back.

    Spec is basically SLX 10 speed throughout, bar an XT rear mech and cassette. Revelations RP23, Easton Haven Bar, easton stem, unbranded (but light enough) post, charge saddle, Hope hubs with WTB rims (listed at 470gm) and single-ply high rollers run tubeless. These are admittedly wire-bead ones, but I find kevlar ones stretch and blow off rims when riding fast. Brakes are SLX/XT 180 front/160 rear.

    At some point, dual plys and a dropper will go on.

    As I said, maybe I’m being unrealistic trying to get a light bike without spending silly money.

    mtbtomo
    Member

    I vaguely remember the mags saying the Ariel frame was around 8lb. I had a Mongoose Khyber that weighed 33lb. That frame was ~8lb with a ~6lb fork and wheels over 2000g, plus a mix of SRAM X9/LX and Deore.

    Its attention to detail that saves weight. Tyres and wheels the best place to start to make it more sprightly but some suspension systems just feel sluggish regardless.

    Foam grips are cheap and will save 50-100g on a pair of lock on grips? It all adds up.

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    As I said, maybe I’m being unrealistic trying to get a light bike without spending silly money.

    I would agree with that tbh, you’ll just be throwing money at it otherwise.

    stumpy01
    Member

    My Stumpjumper fsr is about 28.5lbs with pedals. That is stock apart from xt crank & kcnc bar, stem & post. The kcnc bar is actually a bit heavier than the original Spesh branded one, but It is wider.

    Edit – oh and I seem to remember reading reviews of the Ariel that basically said good, but heavy.

    titusrider
    Member

    Mojo SL 26-27 lbs 🙂

    Hob Nob
    Member

    It’s probably more to do with the tyres & suspension design which makes it feel the way it does.

    I went from a 26.5lb Nomad Carbon to a Commencal Meta AM thats a gnats bollock under 30lbs & the weight makes no difference to my speed. They ride very differently though.

    PJM1974
    Member

    It depends…I invested a lot of time tinkering with spreadsheets to get a medium Marin Quad 140 down to 29lb, it rode reasonably well but the compromises resulting from the light weight made it feel a little too light and fragile for its intended purpose, especially when I already had a perfectly good 130mm xc bike for all day rides in the shed.

    To cut a long story short, I’ve now got a large Marin Quad 140 frame with Wotans and scant attention paid to saving weight, which tips the scales at 33lb and feels like it would survive the apocalypse. The lightweight bits were transplanted to my xc bike, where they belong.

    GaryLake
    Member

    Another thing is I’d say the weight of a tyre is probably less important than how fast rolling it is (on the rear). I’ve had heavier tyres feel quicker than lighter ones due entirely to the tred pattern.

    But yeah aside from that, if you can’t compromise on dual ply tyres then I think any weight saving you do manage will be utter and totally marginalised by those tyres anyway.

    glasgowdan
    Member

    Put it this way – My XC 100mm Giant Anthem is 28.5lbs, my 150mm Trek Remedy is 32lbs and both feel just right for what they do, so I’d think a 140mm bike around 30-31lbs would be perfectly suited to the riding it’s meant to do.

    Premier Icon chakaping
    Subscriber

    Mine did bob like crazy when climbing or sprinting out of the saddle.

    Combined with the weight and a very draggy rear tyre, I was almost crying when I took it on a Lakes epic.

    mafiafish
    Member

    My old prophet was 26.5 lbs (1×10) when it had xc race tyres on tubless wheels. My remedy was 28lbs with beefier forks and wheels/tyres.

    Replace the rear High Roller with an Ardent and it will seem quicker. I have a real love/hate with High Rollers on the rear, swapping it to something with less tread/weight makes it snappier IMHO…

    mikewsmith
    Member

    I’ve finally ended up at Tubeless Ardent EXO’s from HR/Minions the Dual Plys never come out unless it’s a DH race/uplift.

    If you are puncturing everything but tubeless DP tyres then maybe (please take this as intended) you need to look at your riding or at least your pressures.

    Even on single ply minions in the Lakes I only got punctures on stupid mistakes with sharp edges in the end.

    Sounds like there is not much else you can do with the weight without changing the frame. So the feel is key, is the suspension sluggish or saggy/bobbing.

    My heckler is coming in at 33lb down from 37lb by dropping the bombers to revs, tyres down to Ardent Exo and swapping cranks. That includes a dropper post EX721 wheels, slx groupset, m4 techs with 200mm floating rotors and braided hoses and a weighty nukeproof bar and heavy stem…

    My plan is to head to XM719’s lighter stem and bars.

    If your high rollers are say 2.5 ST then they’ll feel a bit sluggish on the flats.

    If you are light and ride light then you could get away with something lighter.

    33lb’s sounds like a decent (too light even?) weight for a bike thats going to get “put through its paces” though.

    I think if you wanted light weight then you’d be better off selling up and buying something light weight rather than throwing loads of cash at your current bike.

    druidh
    Member

    How much weight do you want to shed? The old £1/gramme probably still holds true.

    The Prophet I had a few years back felt loads lighter and more fun.

    Also, I think this is key.

    I dont have a clue what any of my bikes weigh, aslong as they ride well (in your case it doesnt!) then thats all that matters. People seem to get a bit to obsessed by the weight of their bike. Worrying about numbers that in reality dont mean anything, its just they’ve heard that say 33lb is heavy for a 140mm bike.

    As you say, your prophet rode light, weather it actually was is a different matter. Perhaps its time to buy one of those again?

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    It’s too heavy. Not because of the weight it actually is, that’s fine- but just because you’re finding it too heavy, by definition it must be as it’s your bike.

    But the thing is, even if you shed a couple of pounds off it, that’s not going to massively change how it rides. I did a couple of runs at innerleithen on an Ariel and it was a definate blunt instrument- you could make it lighter but it’ll cost a fair bit to make it actually light, and unless you achieve that, you’re quite likely to just make it less good at being a blunt instrument.

    b r
    Member

    Take it apart and weigh everything, then swap out stuff that is too heavy. If you ever swap the frame for something else you’ve still got light gear to put on it.

    My 140mm HT is coming in at 24lbs with pedals/crudcatches and reasonably heavy tyres.

    Premier Icon somafunk
    Subscriber

    We recently built this up for a customer – Ibis Mojo SL 140mm travel, under 25lbs, that’s a pretty decent weight.

    Or if you want a burlier frame and more travel then how about this, built up two weeks ago for a customer – Ibis Mojo HD 160mm travel, under 27lbs.

    Both bikes can be thrown down pretty much anything and you’d be hard pushed to exceed the limits of the HD

    b45her
    Member

    i deal weight is 25.9 lbs, which is conveniently what my Blur LTc weighs.

    dekadanse
    Member

    As the guys say – you can go as low as 25lb on carbon superbikes, but 27-28lb sounds a rideable compromise without breaking the bank.

    My 2011 5spot ranged from about 27.2 up to nearly 29, depending mostly on whether it was 1×9 or 2×9, and what tyres I decided to run. A set of burly alu flat bars helped to lift it to nearly 29.

    I liked it best on the lighter side of things, but the kit to get it to 27.2 was mostly a bit too light duty and didn’t last that long or needed constant TLC. The balance of decent durable kit came at about 28.2/28.5 (running 1×9).

    The Sultan I’m replacing it with has come up at 29.75 with a 140mm fork, which is a bit too porky for my liking.

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 65 total)

The topic ‘What's a decent weight for a 140mm bike?’ is closed to new replies.