What Boris Jonson isn't telling you about the ticket staff on the Underground

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  • What Boris Jonson isn't telling you about the ticket staff on the Underground
  • ernie_lynch
    Member

    Johnson made that pledge before the 2008 election not the 2012 one.

    Johnson personally chose to make keeping underground ticket offices open an election issue.
    And he attacked his predecessor’s record on the matter.

    At no time did he suggest that his “there is always a manned ticket office in every station” pledge only applied for the next 4 years. I was very clearly an open ended commitment.

    Of course he is perfectly entitled to change his view on the matter. But he should have informed voters that he had done so when he stood for reelection.

    So why didn’t he ?

    I think we can safely assume that he didn’t because he knew that to do so would cost him votes.
    So he chose to deliberately mislead voters instead.

    It is precisely this sort of shabby disrespect and dishonesty shown towards voters which has led to so many people having a lack of confidence in politicians and politics.

    I see no reason why it should be tolerated and I’m surprised you apparently think that it is perfectly acceptable mefty.

    Lying careerists get your blessing ?

    allthepies
    Member

    Lying careerists get your blessing ?

    Where did he lie ? Politicians make pledges/manifestos for the term following the election. Johnston seems to have made this pledge in 2008 and kept to it. Did he reiterate that pledge for the 2012 election and the subsequent term ? If so then yes he lied but I don’t believe he made that pledge for the current term.

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    If you don’t recognise dishonesty, or more importantly don’t care, then I don’t think I can help you allthepies.

    But I’ll give you a clue……“always”, as in : “there is always a manned ticket office in every station”, doesn’t mean “4 years”

    deadlydarcy
    Member

    If you don’t recognise dishonesty, or more importantly don’t care, then I don’t think I can help you allthepies.

    ๐Ÿ˜†

    +1

    allthepies
    Member

    Well I read “always a manned ticket office” as in all the time the station is open i.e. not just 1 hour from 7am to 8am on each third Monday in the month. Whereas you seem to read it as “always for all time unless I say otherwise”.

    Semantics, dontcha love it ๐Ÿ™‚

    deadlydarcy
    Member

    SemanticsInterpretation switcheroos when you’re being pwned, dontcha love it

    enfht
    Member

    Technology means the old principle of manned ticket offices no longer applies. Time moves on for everyone except Crow and his repulsive Marxist agenda.

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    Unsurprisingly you haven’t been paying attention enfht, it was the “marxist” Ken Livingstone who was closing ticket offices, and the champion of the people, Boris Johnson, who came fighting his marxist agenda on behalf of Londoners.

    Try to keep up.

    yossarian
    Member

    I’m confused now. Just who’s side is Boris on?

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    Well if you’re a Londoner he’s on YOUR side yossarian. So just vote for him.

    Actually he’s not standing again as major when this present term expires, he’s got bigger fish to fry. So quite frankly he doesn’t give a toss anymore.

    ninfan
    Member

    If you don’t recognise dishonesty, or more importantly don’t care, then I don’t think I can help you allthepies.

    But I’ll give you a clue……”always”, as in : “there is always a manned ticket office in every station”, doesn’t mean “4 years”

    And what does “four years” mean Ernie?

    Why don’t we ask your mate Ken?

    โ€œI will freeze bus and tube fares in real terms for four yearsโ€

    โ€œThere should not be any reason why fares need to rise more than in line with inflation over the next four years.โ€

    ๐Ÿ™„

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    There you go Z-11, a nice graph for you :

    Of course you will now post a graph from Boris Johnson’s propaganda machine which excludes reimbursements provided by the GLA for concessionary travel, thereby distorting the figures. You know you want to.

    But this isn’t about Livingstone, nor is it about playing around with statistics, though I’m sure you wish it was. It’s about a clear and unambiguous commitment freely made by a politician, to win himself votes, which was then clearly and unambiguously discarded when it was no longer necessary to win votes.

    And btw lies from Labour politicians are no more acceptable than lies from Tory politicians.

    ninfan
    Member

    It’s about a clear and unambiguous commitment freely made by a politician, to win himself votes, which was then clearly and unambiguously discarded when it was no longer necessary to win votes.

    Precisely what your mate Ken did then?

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/andrewgilligan/100126746/ken-livingstone-those-fares-promises-in-full/

    Even Ken admits this:

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/andrewgilligan/100119463/ken-livingstone-i-broke-my-promises-on-fares-twice/

    and he was going to do it again:

    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/mayor-misled-london-over-big-fare-rises-6666863.html

    And btw lies from Labour politicians are no more acceptable than lies from Tory politicians.

    But you still kept voting for him…

    allthepies
    Member

    ninfan wrote:

    But you still kept voting for him…

    Perhaps he just doesn’t care ? ๐Ÿ˜†

    Junkyard
    Member

    Jesus wept Zulu I have missed ernie but not your scribbling – would you like to comment on Boris and his broken pledge or just tell us you dont like [ I think the correct term here is I like to goad the lefties] Ken?

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    Let me get this straight Z-11, you are actually claiming that it is perfectly acceptable for Boris Johnson to lie because according to you (and the Daily Telegraph and Andrew Gillian) Ken Livingstone has also lied? ๐Ÿ˜€

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    But you still kept voting for him…

    Said it before, and I’ll say it again. The political system demands politicians make cast iron promises even though they all know that government is a continuous process that has to adapt. So the situation changes, unforseen events happen, and it turns out not to be possible, or not prudent to do the things they promised.

    It’s not the same thing as lying.

    ninfan
    Member

    Nope, just happily sitting back and watching you squirm your way out of trying to criticise people for “Giving lying careerists their blessing” when you’ve been doing it for decades with your own petty bourgeois revolutionary hero!

    Junkyard
    Member

    Ah level two is goading then

    Excellent

    Amusing that on a thread on Boris you are talking about Ken and accusing others of not being able to criticise certain politicians…oh the ironing

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    Ken Livingstone has a very long history of fighting to provide cheap public transport for Londoners. In 1981, at the height of Thatcher’s reign, he introduced the “Fares Fair” policy, an election manifesto promise whereby London Transport fares were reduced by 32%.

    The Tories were so incensed that the Conservative leader of Bromley Council took the GLC to court, claiming that it wasn’t fair as the underground didn’t reach as far as Bromley. The courts decided that the Fares Fair policy was illegal, even though it was an election commitment and Londoners had voted for it, and the GLC were forced to withdraw it. It seems that the democratic wishes of voters were not paramount in Thatcher’s Britain.

    Livingstone can be accused of a lot of things but not fighting to keep public transport fairs low isn’t one of them, whatever, you Z-11, the Telegraph, and Andrew Gillian, say.

    .

    Said it before, and I’ll say it again. The political system demands politicians make cast iron promises

    You are obviously not paying attention to what Ed Milliband and Ed Balls are saying, or not saying, Molgrips. They have been both been going out of their way to make it very clear they they will not make any promises, especially cast iron promises.

    ninfan
    Member

    blah… Livingstone can be accused of a lot of things but not fighting to keep public transport fairs low isn’t one of them, whatever, you Z-11, the Telegraph, and Andrew Gillian, say.

    Straw man

    The question is whether Ken broke his election promises

    By his own admission, he did break those promises, and thats exactly what you windmilled into this thread critisising Boris for!

    Something that by your own admission,

    It is precisely this sort of shabby disrespect and dishonesty shown towards voters which has led to so many people having a lack of confidence in politicians and politics.

    and that you

    see no reason why it should be tolerated

    Which you criticising others for I see as hypocritical, since you happily tolerated it yourself when Ken did it!

    Junkyard
    Member

    Ah the second goad from Zulu.

    Will it work ?

    To be clear I have no idea what Zulu considers work to mean in this context

    Anyway no one could accuse you of being a hypocritical after all that requires principles ๐Ÿ˜›

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    Z-11 why were you banned ? I can only guess that it was for arguing, it is after all the catch-all excuse which Mark uses to ban people who annoy and irritate him. And yet the weird thing is that you are, despite your name change, arguing in exactly the same way as you always have. And yet, and yet, despite that, you still haven’t been banned…….why’s that do you think ? It puzzles me greatly.

    Anyway getting back to the topic of this thread…….Ken Livinstone. I don’t need your analyses of Ken Livinstone’s record, nor that of the Daily Telegraph, or even Andrew Gillian’s. ๐Ÿ™‚

    ninfan
    Member

    I’m not arguing, I’m not goading – I’m simply calling Ernie out on being a hypocrite, because he always applies double standards with Boris threads, criticising people in the process like he has above with Mefty.

    And with that, I’m out!

    yossarian
    Member

    Flounce alert

    mefty
    Member

    I think to ascribe always as meaning sine die in the context of an election for a limited term is far too rigid, in context of an election campaign, it surely means throughout the term. Johnson doesn’t mention ticket offices in his 2012 manifesto, even when attacking Ken Livingstone, so it was hardly something he still thought was an important differentiating factor. Therefore he hasn’t in my view broken a pledge and it seems a pretty sensible decision with the realities of oyster usage.

    ernie_lynch
    Member

    ninfan – Member

    I’m not arguing, I’m not goading – I’m simply calling Ernie out on being a hypocrite, because he always applies double standards with Boris threads

    I am highly critical of Johnson I think he is a self-serving politician who doesn’t give a toss about ordinary Londoners, and why would he ? I am also critical of Livingstone, that’s why he wasn’t my first choice in the last mayoral election (my first choice was Jenny Jones) But I do think that despite being something of a careerist himself Livingstone does have genuine commitment to ordinary Londoners, and for that reason is a better choice than Johnson.

    The real hypocrisy comes from you Z-11. In all the multitude of political comments you have posted on this forum, not once, not on one single occasion, do I recall you criticising a Tory politician. They, and they alone, are above criticism ….. according to you. Whatever they do.

    And on everything single thread which is about Boris Johnson you deviate the thread onto Ken Livingstone, to protect him. I in contrast don’t deviate threads about Livingstone (of which there has been many) onto Boris Johnson.

    Junkyard
    Member

    I’m not arguing, I’m not goading

    Not even you are that unaware ….chuckles

    I’m simply calling Ernie out on being a hypocrite, because he always applies double standards with Boris threads,

    I agree with what ernie said about hypocrisy and double standards

    criticising people in the process like he has above with Mefty.

    Your defence of the weak and powerless is one of your strengths ๐Ÿ˜€

    And with that, I’m out!

    You will be missed

    for longer than one of your bans ?

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