Warranty issue – minimum seat post insertion

That’s your main defence then is it not? If they want you to do something specific, they need to ask you. No? The other stuff is just noise at this stage.

Yes, I’m still waiting for them to confirm where exactly I should have found this information.

I really don’t think they have a leg to stand on. There is nothing in the paperwork they provide (or should have provided), there doesn’t appear to be anything obvious on their website, (even the tuition vidoes for fitting reverbs, KS levs etc dont state this 50mm rule).

Be firm with them without being offensive and be persistent. You’ve followed their guidelines and at no point have they contacted you, issued a statement, press-release, recall etc regarding this 50mm rule.

I’d say based on all the info here you have a 3 pronged attack…

1. No documentation was provided with the frame that detailed the minimum insertion depth.

2. They sell it with OEM seatpost that would not allow you to comply with their conditions anyway.

3. It’s a crap design and they’re being shitty about it, and should be nice to their customers.

Obviously the outcome (and speed of outcome) may depend on exactly how you word all that but I think you have a pretty good case for getting a replacement.

just out of interest, how did you pay?

I like it!

Dear Mr Commencal

It’s a crap design so stop being so shitty about it, you should be nicer to your customers.

Regards
James

I think Paypal but will check.

yes that’s exactly the wording I was thinking, if they don’t cave after that then they must have hearts of stone…

🙂

I don’t know how the Credit Card thing works, or if there is a time limit but I’ve heard mention that CC gives you additional options for kicking up a fuss?

I have a commencal whinge too. Bought a meta v4 new, boxed from a bike trader on eBay (individual rather than company) and the seat tube rocker failed at the weld after 3 rides (5 hours riding tops). It took a month for them to charge me €100 for a new one after many many emails.
As it was clearly not made properly I thought they might throw me a bone and replace it FOC, I would have no issue paying if I wrapped it round a tree or sonething…

I was beginning to wonder if they’d sold on that ‘cracknfail’ trademark they bought from cannondale in the 1990s. Apparently not

I have a meta AM HT and I have a reverb 420 in, it goes way past the junction, so I hope that it stays in one piece!

Oh well, time will tell it is a 2016 model.

Direct as in direct from France? I’m thinking about EU consumer law here, but not sure how that applies in France or cross-border.

The thing is, you have rights under EU law regarding expected lifespan of products – they don’t get to make their own decisions on what’s reasonable for that (which is always the problem with a warranty).

The problem is that Comical are based in Andorra, not France…

Commencal are Andorra based, no idea what laws will be in effect there

Ah, in which case ignore that – not EU, so there’s doubtless no consumer law protecting you – I’d keep trying being reasonable with them and explaining what has been suggested on here, but I was suggesting legal, because from the sounds of things they’re not at all interested in honouring the warranty on this, and unless you have some legal route to force them to honour it, then what they say goes.

At which point the only remaining possibility I can see is a social media campaign.

Unfortunately I think you’re right.

By the sounds of things they have decided they don’t want to warranty the frame, so chances are (regardless of emails sent, threats made etc) I’m not going to persuade them to change their mind

The point is they have no reason not to warranty it other than they don’t want to.

Bit of a bummer this thread. I recently got a Meta AM 2012 off a mate, who actually got it as a warranty replacement for a snapped carbon Meta 55. He had no problems getting that replacement.

I’m a bit bigger(fatter) than him, so i’d better make sure my post is long enough!! I was gonna buy a dropper for it after christmas as well.

I got it well cheap though, so couldn’t really complain if owt went wrong!!

It shows how much a Commencal warranty is worth. I’m sure there are plenty of people on other forms of social media who’d be interested to know that.

Time for Twitter etc? Sounds like they’re being a right cunch of bunts 🙁

Depending on their response to this morning’s email (which pointed out a lot of the things brought up in this thread) that may be my next and only course of action.

Seems a bit of a twatty, childish thing to do but it’d probably make me feel better until I can find a replacement frame.

Anyway, [childish] they started it! [/childish]

Seems a bit of a twatty, childish thing to do

well, if they won’t behave like adults…

Hang on, hang on. There’s always the ‘escalate to the MD’ route to redemption if you don’t get satisfaction.

Go straight for the “Dear Max” option?

OP, in the pic you posted with the crack, how fard own did your seatpost actually go? Seems like a lot of Commie bashing going on and i just want to make sure it wasn’t an error on your part before joining in.

125mm, 35mm passed the 90mm they specify in their owners manual (that I didn’t receive).

As mentioned previously I’d like to think this is a one off and wouldn’t necessarily be worried about their frames cracking* my problem is with their attitude and how they have handled the situation.

*Googling doesn’t turn up much in the way of failures plus I bloody hope not as I’ve got a v3 sat in the shed too!

jamesfts – Member
Go straight for the “Dear Max” option?

No, you need to let the plebs further down the food chain do their bits first. Raise with customer service/warranty or whatever they’re called, if refused escalate to ‘warranty manager/customer service director, if refused escalate to MD.

If you end up at the MD, I’d email summary details then follow up by phone. Be polite, firm, persistent and organised. Have all the details to hand and a time line of what’s gone on.

DO NOT SHOUT or be rude or swear or whatever. Just keep going until they give up. In short, just pretend you’re the love child of TJ and Moly 😀

just pretend you’re the love child of TJ and Moly

*shudders*

brant – Member

The problem I have with frames of this style (which is why I prefer a bent top tube) is that this style isn’t really a dropped top tube, it’s an extended seat tube.

Worried about my On-One Fatty now, I wonder who designed it……………..

If anyone is still interested this was my email to Commencal.

Mickael

Further to our previous email could you please tell me precisely, as a consumer where I would have been informed of this “Your seatpost into the seat tube beyond its minimum 5cm below the top tube” quoted from your previous email. No documentation was provided with the frame that detailed this as the minimum insertion depth.

I’ve gone through the owners manual and have attached the relevant page to this email. The only information printed regarding the seatpost simply states that the minimum insert for a Commencal frame is 90mm – if this is indeed the case I have in fact been exceeding this amount by around 30mm – please see attached photo of my seatpost showing 120mm insert depth. As I have been running more than the required length of seatpost recommended in the manual I believe you are contractually obliged to honour the warranty.

I believe you sell the Meta HT full build with a 350mm static seatpost, to achieve the “5cm below toptube” would require 250mm inserted into the frame leaving only 10cm externally. Based on the numbers you have given me I do not understand how a rider of the recommended height (5’10”-6’2” for larger frames) can set this bike up correctly with the post you provide. I also do not understand how you have arrived at the conclusion that I mounted my seatpost incorrectly. My seatpost was well within the guidelines set out in your user manual so please explain why you are not offering to honour the warranty?

As a long standing customer of Commencal who has more recently bought 2 frames in as many years I’m extremely disappointed in how you’re handling this situation. I’ve always recommended your products to fellow riders and now feel let down and would hate for someone I’ve recommend you to be treated in the same way.

I was planning on ordering my daughter one of your balance bikes and would happily have continued through your range of children’s bikes however if this is how you treat your customers I shall be looking elsewhere for our bikes in the future.

I would really like to resolve the situation and continue to be a happy Commencal customer as I do like your bikes, however if you are not prepared to do this I feel the only thing I can do is to take advice on how to resolve this issue in a more formal manner.

I await your response.

Regards,

After waiting all day I got the following reply.

Hi James,

The insertion of the seatpost must be of 16,5cm on a frame in size L,

Have a good day,

Best regards

So aside from ignoring 99% of the email that’ll be the third different measurement they’ve given me and they STILL haven’t been able to tell me how/where I should have found this information.

I think I’ll have to get on the phone tomorrow as this is getting stupid.

It doesn’t look like great customer service to me. I can’t remember seeing many Commencals about so don’t know much about them. The only one that springs to mind is the one I mentioned in a previous thread:

Saw a youth at Whinlatter riding a Commencal. It looked quite handy, as did he. We were on the south loop at that section where the up and down cross over and there are (were?) two tiny north shore rampy things on the downhill section.

He teed himself up for the harder one with the actual proper drop at the end. He landed it beautifully, but alas his down tube and top tube both broke just behind the head tube and left him riding a unicycle and spare handlebar into the dirt.

He smacked his face up a bit and was sat there looking well dazed, confused and understandably hurt. He’d done so well, poor little mite.

He had a Commencal. Neither of my kids ever will.

HTHC

That was hardly a measured response to your well worded email. Has put me completely off buy anything from them.
Try on the phone, more difficult (but not impossible) to be that ignorant when speaking to someone rather than hiding behind a computer.

This is the sort of situation that makes you wish that there were mountain bike journalists who will investigate.

If someone from stw (for example) wrote to them and asked for an answer for publication I suspect there would be a fuller response.

have you social media’ed them? Twitter and/or facebook them with that poor response to your claim.

Well that’s a bit rough and I know how frustrated you must feel, had a similar situation with the jokers at Trek a few years ago.

But looking on the bright side, it’ll make an awesomely on-trend long and low frame for somebody if you do Brant’s first modification.

Phoning them will be on my jobs for tomorrow, I’ve asked email monkey for contact details of their warranty manager/customer service director though I’m not holding my breath and expect to be sat listening to hold music before getting repeatedly cut off.

I’ve purposely not gone to social media yet as I’d like to keep the moral high ground as long as possible or at least until they’ve give me a definitive “eff off”.

They’ve already done that repeatedly from what I can see. Extremely shoddy behaviour from Commencal and I agree with wwaswas regarding journalists.

Stw *is* social media.

You’ll get far more reads, reach, on here than twitter or Facebook.

Why not tweet the MD and founder, just to let him know how well your being treated

Tweets by maxcommencal

You could tweet him a link to this thread.

I wouldn’t hold your breath for any bike mag to take up your cause though

we could all tweet him a link 😉

I’ve tweeted @commencal about this. Very shoddy back up I think, hope it helps.

This all seems exceptionally harsh.

When owning and cracking several commencals in the past I was dealt with via Madison and Evans and had great customer service from them. So it’s a shame it’s now direct dealing only…