why are we all arguing?

The video clearly shows a cyclist riding along, a van driver pulling out, obstructing the traffic with right of way. FAIL.
The van driver immediately tries to push cyclist off the road. FAIL. The van driver deliberately drives in the middle of the road to entice the cyclist up the inside, so he can again batter him off the road, and then throws a bottle at the cyclist!

This is not a SMIDSY, this is clearly a deliberate attempt to halt a cyclists progress on the public highway. Get that va driver arrested or something!

Why are cyclists on a cycling forum arguing about god knows what in relation to this and not supporting the cyclist?

You made an issue out of nothing by banging on his van and shouting.

More here:

UPDATED: Van driver throws juice bottle at cyclist for “not paying road tax”

Why should we automatically support the cyclist when he is giving cyclists a bad name?

?

So you'd be happy to be rammed off the road?

Jolly hockey sticks and all that?

Are you Ghandi reincarnate?

is it because the van driver was in the wrong?
We cant all be a turn the other cheek pacifist like you smee

Those arguing against obi are missing his point, you need to try being objective, remove your blinkers and use common sense.

I had to stop this morning to avoid being hit, I could have chased after the driver for an argument, I decided it wouldn't get me or anyone anywhere to do so or get upset about it (and I probably wouldn't have caught her) and my day is a lot less stressful as a result.

It has nowt to do with being a pacifist. It has to do with the realisation that people are morons and that there are a hell of a lot of things out there that can kill me on the roads.

Would I like to be rammed off the road? No.

Would I do everything in my power to avoid being rammed off the road? Yes.

Problem is the van driver thinks he got away with driving badly in the first place, I agree that the rider's reaction didn't help but looking at the video I reckon the van driver commits more than 6 separate dangerous and prosecutable offenses whereas the cyclist commits one (undertaking) almost forced to by the van driver. I'm sure if a copper saw this happening in the flesh the van driver would be in trouble.

Sadly you can't educate people like the van driver and often the 'red mist' that takes over just makes it more dangerous for the rider.

In hindsight the rider should have backed off and then reported the incident to the police, if the van driver does this once he'll do it again and the police will deal with him (hopefully).

A few years ago I was riding up a narrow hill when a white van overtook me, slowed down and shouted "Use the f**king cycle lane you c**t". I caught him up at the top of the hill where he'd pulled in and explained I would use the cycle lane once it was actually finished, even more ironically he was one of the contractor's building the cycle path! I reported him to his employer and got an apology letter back, I doubt it changed his driving habits but I bet it pi**ed him off!

The van driver pulls out, not good but leave it at that. Why even go close to undertaking. The driver could have been drunk or anything.
Van driver is the bigger nonce, but they're both playing a dangerous game regardless of blame that's no way for either of them to behave.

I begin to question why people wear head cams all the time, like that fella on the news the other week.

Edit, I agree with one point there leftboy, no point in recording bad drivers if you don't act squeeky clean yourself.

Things like that were an almost daily occurance when I lived in London, best just to leave it and take an number plate if really bad.
The guy could have just got out and battered the cyclist, you don't know who you're shouting at so best to be on the safe side.
I'm not saying eithers actions were right but it's better to let it slide.

Fair point, but I don't see this guy racing down the road, in fact he just seems to be cruising, and the van seems to be slowing, in the middle of the road, deliberately trying to knock the cyclist off.

How is that not a seriously stupid move by the van driver. If this had been me, My Switzerland persona would have been replaced by an exceeding angry austrian/german country from the 1940s!

I am not saying the cyclist is a saint, but that van driver is intent o causing bodily harm to the cyclist! How can you look past that!

This is not normal behaviour I would expect from anyone on the road.

Nowhere have i said that what the van driver did is defensible – he needs banned for what he did. My point is that it was the cyclist who escalated it.

From the video it looks to me more like the cyclist was annoyed at the driver not getting going (hence the "well go on then") and goes up the inside of the van, who then pulls back across. The cyclist should not have gone up the inside of the van and when the van pulls left it *could* have been argued to have been to give the cyclist room on the outside (though it probably wasn't). Beating on the van does nothing but enrage the driver, who then sees red and attempts to knock the cyclist off. No-one comes out shining in this video, but given the more vulnerable nature of the cyclist, you'd hope he'd remain back from the van and out of trouble.

i think the cyclist may have been out looking for that seeing as he had a helmet cam on, cant really see why you would have one on the road otherwise

I use a helmet cam on my commute, every single time. I wipe the video at each end if nothing happens, but I have it as backup of my and their actions if I get knocked off, regardless of fault. I'd have on in my car if I could. It doesn't matter if the cyclist was out looking for these things, they shouldn't happen and he's right to highlight them (if he doesn't make the situation worse with his own riding/on purpose for the video).

I am not saying the cyclist is a saint, but that van driver is intent o causing bodily harm to the cyclist! How can you look past that!

I think the whole point is you have to look past one persons bad actions and not ignore the others escalation of it, it's called seeing both sides of the story rather than being biased. Sure the driver was a dangerous, threatening menace, but the cyclist should be aware of their faults too.

OK, so not long ago a motorcyclist was making his way, hopping past cars on an A road. Not blatting past in one go, but overtaking when safe.

One car driver takes offence to being overtaken and as the motorcyclist came level, during the overtake, without warning the car driver rammed the motorcyclist, who lost control and spent a good amount of time in hospital.

The outcome was jail time for the prat in the car.

Cyclists are more agile than cars and vans, and in London, or any big city, they overtake where ever they can. Does that make them an excusable target for this kind of behaviour? NO!

If we have less of these dangerous numpties on the road, then more people would cycle, or ride motorbikes.

There is no excuse for such a lack of respect for life.

Proportion of blame is on the van driver for being an arse, agreed and his actions are clearly dangerous.
But as I said just let it go, he could be a smack head nutter 😯
Having had a lot of stuff like this happen it's better just to stop and let them go.
This probably sounds weak but I'd rather not get in a fight or knocked off.

Oh and that looks like a Yoshimura sticker on the back of the van suggesting the driver may possibly be a biker which makes his action even worse.

we all react differently to bad driving i ignore it on my commute as I will see them day after day so no point having people having a vendetta against me. However it is clear the van driver broke the law, drove very dangerously and we can be sure if the cyclists was a copper on his bike he would have driven very differently. Yest he cyclist could have avoided it by say driving a car 🙄 or nbot getting annoyed when someone tried to kill him but, whilst not fully exonerated, he was not the cause of this scenario.

Sorry officer I was slowing down looking for my turning and some cyclist tries to undertake. What I mean is the cyclist is making it dangerous just by getting involved.

I know what it's like, my commute was from Hemel Hempstead down to either Leicester Square or Saples Corner that was 'fun'
How long does it take as a cyclist before you realise that some of the time/ a lot of the time this is going to happen? We just don't count in some peoples eyes.
Edit. I drive now, not that commute and almost every one I see riding a bike (they are all cyclists) is utterly rubbish i.e pavement-road-pavement, light jumping, undertaking, no signals, wrong way in one-ways and no lights in winter. I think we don't help each other.

No junkyard, but put yourself in a car driver situation rather than a cycling situation – if someone pulls out in front and makes you slow, do you race up their arse and try to undertake, nudging their van to let them know they were doing something stupid? Or do you just yell/beep and back off, reducing it to nothing more than a slight slowing in your daily commute? Which seems the more sensible approach here? Are we not constantly complaining that car drivers are in too much of a rush and their own world, regardless of risk to others?

Why do some moron car owners believe that the car tax they pay is for the use & up keep of the roads, it is a mere stealth tax for owning a vehicle. It is your community/poll tax that pays for the up keep and gives you access to use the public highways so every person over the age of 18 pays to use the roads etc.

action dan – youre preaching to the converted here mate! It was historically named road tax, even new drivers call it road tax – it's just a convention that tends to make people assume it's to pay for roads.

suspect the van driver would have done similar to a car driver in similar situation – in the past i might have reacted and banged the back of the van but best policy is imagine hands are gaffer taped to bars

worst bit about the driving is around 49secs just after bottle thrown out – van is driving erratically down centre of road while someone with kid on tagalong is coming towards him

@action dan because I think years ago it was a road tax and it kinda stuck, much in the same way we all call our vehicles horseless carriages.

Why are cyclists on a cycling forum arguing about god knows what in relation to this and not supporting the cyclist?

Because it would be totally stupid and childish to ignore the cyclists cockups in the situation. You don't need to be ghandi to back off from someone who's pulled out on you and slowed you down a bit, you just need to put it into perspective – something I'd hope most adults could manage.

@oldgit – we still use horsepower – an anchient term replaced decades ago with better units. We still use miles, and feet and inches, despite a large chunk of the world using the scientific standard metric system.

Live and let live….just let the van go!

Sorry to keep harping on, but I would have waved that van out. The van was way over the lines already you can see that miles off, he is half commited so not being prepared to slow down shows lack of experience and to keep on going and trying to dive under…well?

whats the video titled on youtube so i can look on my phone? youtube banned at work.

Well its interesting that a lot of people have no insight into road riding, mind it is STW.
The van clearly pulls out deliberately in front of a cyclists, then trys to hit him.
Police should take action against the driver, if they did so more then it would make CYCLING safer for all.

Edit:- having watched it again its all the cyclists fault, he isn't wearing any gloves.

Its titled "Gosport" search by upload date and its the 3rd one down.

Hope the driver gets owned with bombers!

I think the rider was very restrained there. In all my cycle commuting I have never seen a driver do that kind of thing. Admittedly, the final undertake was asking for trouble.

Well its interesting that a lot of people have no insight into road riding, mind it is STW.
The van clearly pulls out deliberately in front of a cyclists, then trys to hit him.

What a stupid comment, almost as bad as "you don't pay road tax" – because STWers are all mtbers with no road experience… The van is already mostly out of the junction, he pulls out slowly and MILES in front of the bike (into a crowded bit of road) and slows the bike. A minor inconvenience there, but nothing too worrying. Everything that follows is almost without doubt because the cyclist came up his inside and banged on the van. Van is a danger to the public reacting like that, but it was triggered.

In all my cycle commuting I have never seen a driver do that kind of thing.

Probably because you dont dart up the inside and bang on vans. Or you're riding in a very quiet area, I see people doing things like that pretty much every time I ride, and I'm occasionally guilty of the darting up the inside and getting angry. This video reminded me to ride in a more central position on the road as I think the micra would have spotted the rider earlier and not just "darted" had they been further out, and the Ford was very careful but at that point the rider was being overtaken by a car and so couldn't go wide.

The van is already mostly out of the junction, he pulls out slowly and MILES in front of the bike (into a crowded bit of road) and slows the bike. A minor inconvenience there, but nothing too worrying

Are we all watching the same video? 🙄

No junkyard, but put yourself in a car driver situation rather than a cycling situation – if someone pulls out in front and makes you slow, do you race up their arse and try to undertake, nudging their van to let them know they were doing something stupid?

No I wait till the traffic stops us get out, own his van with a set of bombers and then wee in his tank. As i said we all react differently but the van driver ignores the law and doe snot give way so they start the sequence of events.

coffeeking, I see your point….sort of, but the highway code clearly states that any vehicle waiting at a junction can only pull out if they do not present themselves to cause other road users to take avoiding action. So for that reason alone, the van driver is in the wrong, compounded by his immediate attempt to block the cyclist from going up the inside, and then on to attempted manslaughter. No innocents in the video, granted, but the van driver deserves no benefit of the doubt, and a heavy sentence!

coffeking, I ride into central London, it's not that quiet. I have to say I do undertake vans if I consider it safe. I have also been known to bang on things – mainly bus drivers windows (not my proudest moment). Still, that van driver's behaviour was extraordinary.

AndyRT – I agree, van shouldn't have pulled out, but we've all done it and thought "ooop, go go go", and I'm looking at it from a legal point of view – the cyclist COULD have slowed plenty to avoid the whole thing, instead of wasting my taxes in the courts. In the first instance, to hte cyclist, it wasn't obvious that the van driver was a dangerous moron intent on killing.

It's not attempted manslaughter is it (genuine Q), its either attempted murder (intended to kill) or manslaughter (never intended to kill but did), if you can prove either. Safe to assume that knocking a bike off at 5mph probably wouldn't be intended to kill, but would be some other form of attempted assault/injury for sure.

coffeking, I ride into central London, it's not that quiet. I have to say I do undertake vans if I consider it safe. I have also been known to bang on things – mainly bus drivers windows (not my proudest moment).

Sorry, really not sure what your point is here. Undertaking moving vehicles is a very stupid move and removes your right to complain when they do something stupid (unless they are changing lanes without looking or are stationary and you're passing at a queue)

Coffeeking Vacillating eh ?
Pulls out slowly and miles in front, you need glasses boy

Edit wasnt you driving was it you should have gone to spec savers 😆

My immediate thought looking at the video is that you could see from a fair way that the van was going to pull out, so, riding defensively, I would've anticipated this, slowed a touch and avoided him, probably then passing up the inside and laughing as he was stuck in traffic…

I'd agree that the rider did escalate the situation, but the van driver had no right to then use his vehicle as a weapon… big man there… had a cab do that to me once, he ended up with a smashed drivers window and missing a side mirror as I took to his car with my d-lock… yes, I lost it, but he genuinely tried to kill me (in my mind) and I flipped! Not that proud of it, and it certainly means that the cab drivers view of cyclists was made worse… or maybe it taught him a lesson, though I doubt it!

Everything that follows is almost without doubt because the cyclist came up his inside and banged on the van

As I said the van veers left before rider hit the side of it with his hand, pretty sure this guy was already a bike hater.

Wrote this ages ago forgot to click send.

Or do you just yell/beep and back off,

There's few people would slow down and do nothig, in car or on bike, in a car I'd use the horn to let the psycho know he'd done something wrong, said psycho will hear a car horn and get the message whether he takes it on board or not is his problem. Shouting at the van driver from a bike may not have get his attention so slapping the van could be a substitute, no damage and gets drivers attention. In this case yes it escalated the situation but I've also had idiots escalate the situation when I've just shouted at a driver for their incompetence. Some people will pull the smidsy, some will ignore you, a minority will do what van driver in the vid did. I don't think just ignoring idiot drivers is the way to go, their stupidity should be pointed out to them. Mind you as soon as it did escalate I'd have stopped and retreated to pavement til nutter had got bored and moved on.

I've lost my temper like most people when my life has been endangered by a selfish driver. Its easy to be high and mighty on a forum but its frightening and the potential for serious injury when coming into contact with a car is high.
I take the view that bad driving should be challenged and I wouldnt criticise people taking reasonable direct action against drivers who commit acts that could endanger life.
I am often staggered by the "gives cyclists a bad name" apologists brigade and take the view that being "walked all over" (or driven in this case) does not get us more respect next time.
Challenging idiots and those with no consideration is more likely to make drivers think twice before engaging in the type of behaviour exhibited in this video.