Viewing 34 posts - 1 through 34 (of 34 total)
  • Upgrading 2013 zesty 714
  • Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Hello all,
    Not ridden in a while and looking to get my zesty back up to speed. On the following specs. https://www.thebikelist.co.uk/lapierre/zesty-714-2013

    I never got on with the forks and shock on there at the moment and always wanted to change them but never got round to it.

    Now im clueless and have no idea what decent kit it.

    Would it be a bad idea to buy a set of these? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/174772919638

    Always wanted 160mm pikes. Seems they dont really exist to buy new anymore?

    As for rear shock? Absolutely clueless, but was thinking monarch rc3 plus if it will fit which it looks like it may?

    Want to start riding a bit more aggressive stuff and start trying some downhill tracks and some bigger jumps.

    Thanks for any info

    Premier Icon RicB
    Full Member

    Before splashing that amount of money on an (sorry) obsolete 26” bike, I’d have a chat to one of the suspension specialist companies like J-Tech. They might be able to upgrade or tune what you have to give you the outcome you want.

    Shocks are tricky upgrades in that you not only need the correct length (eye to eye) and stroke but also the correct base compression and rebound tune for your frame, plus the correct fitting hardware.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    For sure that bike should never have had 32s, they were never up to much in long-travel versions, just an XC fork stretched and stretched and the Zesty was such a capable bike that it was just nonsense. And the CTD was one of the worst 32s. At least they’re not TALAS! Usually I’d agree with RicB to consider damping upgrades, but they just can’t be made suitable.

    I wouldn’t fit the Pikes either personally- it’s quite a chunk of money and they’re not that great imo. I know they’ve become the industry standard but it’s taken me a fair amount of effort and money to get mine working close to how I like them. Wish I hadn’t bothered tbf, I’ve basically thrown good money after bad and ended up with a pretty adequate performer for all my efforts.

    Only thing is, I’m not 100% sure your wheels will convert to 20mm, but if they do then I’d hunt down some old coil lyriks rc2s. They’re still fantastic forks, very heavy obviously but supple, well controlled, lots of intuitive but powerful damping control. Way better than a Pike for what you describe imo. They’re also a great used buy though- tough and reliable.

    I’d leave the shock for now. Maybe do a basic air can service, if you’re up for that, it’s cheap and it’ll help get the best from it. They were perfectly decent shocks, the CTD mode adjust isn’t brilliant though. But if you’re changing around the rest of the bike a lot, then you might find that the rear works better than you think- the fork will be basically defining the handling right now. And at the end of the day replacing shock and fork is going to be a lot of the total value of the bike.

    Maybe a longer dropper post though if you can! And hopefully it doesn’t have the stock tyres, they were an absolute joke on a 150mm bike, like the fork they just specced them to get the weight down but they’re just completely wrong. Like putting ballet slippers on a rugby prop.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Yeah I heard a few people say it wasnt really worth tuning these shocks and forks as they are basically crap regardless.

    For £450 I didn’t think was too bad if I can get another good few years use out of the bike. Also my mates both have them on their 2014 bikes and seem to get on well with them. May make £150 selling mine back on ebay looking at auctions.
    Compared to what the bike cost new I dont mind spending another grand or something to really get it to where I want it to be. Compared to buying something else. It never had a huge amount of miles on it so despite not being the cleanest, everything should be pretty low on wear and tear.

    Is there literally nothing newish for 26″ still on the market? I dont really want to go too heavy as this will still be my only bike for now so will still be using to ride trails. I will look into them though.

    The CTD never worked from new so I always assumed it was sort of faulty.

    What would a longer dropper do? Allow it to drop further out of the way? It does have the annoying sag issue where it drops a few cm when you sit on it when extended so guessing that needs a big service anyway?
    https://ibb.co/2yfSL5r This is how it looks a few hours ago, I dropped the air out of the shock its not knackered.
    And yes of course still on the original tyres. I moaned about them since I bought the bike but never did anything about them. The rear was terrible.

    What would you recommend putting on instead? I was looking at maxxis ardents with a 2.4 on the front and 2.25 on the rear, but again I have no bloody clue.

    Thanks for taking the time!

    Premier Icon timmys
    Full Member

    I had a slightly older zesty and changed the 32’s for 160 pikes. I then added a angled headset to slacken the HA and cancel out he BB raise due to the longer travel forks. Rear shock was a high volume Pushed RP23. All came together nicely, but not sure I’d be investing that money in a bike of that age now.

    If you go for it, I would just get 27.5” forks rather than 26”. I doubt you’ll notice the difference and you might be able to move them on to your next bike – unless it has proper sized wheels 😉

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    Aye, Timmys makes a good point, 650b forks can work fine with 26 inch wheels and that gives you a load more choice.

    Tyres’ll be the biggest upgrade you can possibly make on that tbf. You have XC race rubber on basically! Availability’s tricky now though, and not just for 26 inch. Ardents are decent but still fast rolling rather than high grip, which is going to be an issue for downhill trails especially coming into winter.

    Important question for you- what would you say’s the hardest sort of thing you want to do- what’s your local? People can mean a lot of different things by “downhill trails”.

    And yep, longer dropper post just means the seat drops further- which gives you much more control and safety on steeper stuff, especially if you’re pushing your limits. And getting rid of the bloody Reverb Sag will be good too. You have to be really careful to make sure it fits in your frame though (because longer drop also needs a longer overall post). Brand X’s Ascend is amazing value and it can really transform how you ride (everything else makes the bike better but a long dropper post doesn’t just improve the bike, it improves how you ride the bike)

    In 2019, I’d have definitely been saying just don’t do it. Go and buy a Calibre Bossnut or something. But in 2021, bikes are scarcer and more expensive so it’s trickier. But the thing is, even with really good quality parts on it, bikes have still come a long way since 2013

    You’re in a kind of awkward place where yep, it’s potentially a really nice bike- the basic frame is really good. But it also has a lot of weird parts on it. It’s not so much the quality, it’s just the suitability, so the whole thing is “hard charging trailbike frame with XC parts on it that make it light, but much less good as an allrounder” So you don’t just need to think about upgrades, but also appropriateness. Pretty tricky.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Yeah fair play that was my other thought, going with 27.5 forks but wasnt sure how that would mess the angles even further. What sort of effect will it have?

    Forest of Dean is local, riding the blue and red messing on the jumps etc. Keen to check the new jump area out and like I said try the downhill tracks instead of spending so much time riding uphill on trails.
    If you could recommend tires down to my local trails that would be ideal haha

    Want to get out to BPW soon as we sort of stopped riding just after it opened I think and keen to do the alps trip we always talked about.

    Ill look into the post. Im guessing the price to get mine serviced and sorted im better off just getting a new one. Dont mind buying used.

    I totally get what you mean but I think some nicer quality forks with a little more travel and a better rear shock should do me ok for what I THINK I want. If I enjoy the bigger stuff a lot more and keep at it Id be open to a used bigger bike in a year or so. Seems like a big selection on facebook etc.
    Im under no illusion I will suddenly start riding much bigger stuff straight away.

    Is buying forks used a bad idea? Seems such a mixed bag.
    Also there seems to be a million and one variations of each model. What apart from axel size do I need to check will fit?

    Premier Icon thols2
    Free Member

    If you go for it, I would just get 27.5” forks rather than 26”.

    This.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Yeah definitely on the cards. Jesus forks are expensive nowadays though.

    Seems cheaper to buy those 26″ pikes on ebay but now I’m wondering whether maybe some fox 36s be a better job or not. Again insane money new (seem about a grand?) but ebay seems to have a lot used. Is there a certain model I should be looking at?

    All seems very hit and miss whether upgrades will improve the bike or totally ruin it.

    Premier Icon maxtorque
    Full Member

    Sounds like you want to basically build my zesty:

    2013 Zesty ive had from new (was replacement frame for the 2012’s that all cracked around the BB/rear stay interface….) with 160mm pikes (650b) slackset, BDair rear shock with Spicy shuttle (160mm) 1by at the front with SRAM XX1 cranks, 11by at the back with a 50 tooth dinner plate extender.

    It’s my “do it all bike” light and efficient enough to be pedalled all day, strong and capable enough to smash out the downs at a bike park.

    Yes, slightly short and steep by modern standards (my other bike is a Mondy Dune…..) but i find it a good compromise for real world tracks and big days out in the hills. It’s done 4 years of summer holiday trips to Les Arcs, ridden over most of North wales including Snowdon and Cadir, done every track in the Peaks and most of the Lakes, and even done laps of Swinley too 🙂

    With carefull s/h buying, i don’t see why a similar build would be difficult or too expensive?

    Premier Icon timmys
    Full Member

    If buying used forks, factor in the cost of a full pro service, and if they are still good value then, then it’s probably relatively low risk.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    That’s awesome. Yes that’s pretty much exactly what I’m after.

    Unfortunately after a week or so of hunting it seems impossible to source a spicy shock shuttle so does that mean I’m stuck with the same amount of rear travel?
    What’s a slackset?

    The 650b forks don’t cause you much hassle? The trade off seems spending a huge amount of money on a 650b set or 450£ for the 26″ new pair on ebay. Its almost tempting to just go with those and say screw it.

    Chances are ill just ride it for another 4-5 years before I consider upgrades again and then I’d look at totally new bikes.

    Premier Icon maxtorque
    Full Member

    The 650b forks make no real difference and help slacken and lift the front a bit, they also give great clearance for mud guards and er, mud, when running with 26 wheels+tyres

    The Spicy shuttle is shorter, so allows the fitment of a longer travel shock which is what allows for 160mm at the back, so you’d need a shuttle AND a shock to suit, which gets expensive. IME, the extra front travel of a decent modern fork is probably the biggest gain, and i’d happily stay at 140mm on the back

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    That’s a big help thank you. If I don’t have to worry about changing shock size that’s a decent load off.

    What model pikes are you running?

    Had a little too much to drink last night and ended up buying a 2017 fox Float x2 shock in same size as mine.

    So now just to choose forks and some better tyres to start. 26″ pikes for £450 new, or a new set of 27.5 for whatever they cost, or new or used fox 36s.

    Premier Icon doomanic
    Full Member

    Tyres is easy; Maxxis Minion DHR2 on the back and DHF on the front for summer/autumn, Spesh Hillbilly, Maxxis Shorty or Schwalbe Magic Mary on the front for winter/spring.

    Personally, I’d go with the 26″ Pikes.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Thanks for the tyre recs, what sizes would you go for?

    Premier Icon doomanic
    Full Member

    26″ 😉

    Premier Icon doomanic
    Full Member

    2.3ish for all of them.

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    If you’re going to be riding FOD going into the winter I wouldn’t personally buy ardents.

    You’re going to be limited on choice by the 26” wheels – but if you can get a Magic Mary / Specialized Hillbilly / Michelin Wild Enduro you should do ok in the front.

    Rear is DHR2 for me all the way. The 2.4” version (27.5” wheelsize) is much more capable in slop then the 2.3” version. But you do pay for it with drag. In Schwalbe I guess the Big Betty is the muddier conditions option.

    I’ve found the 2.6” Magic Mary is better in proper slop than the 2.35” version. With the Hillbilly (2.6” size) it’s epic in slop – but less good on hardpack than the Magic Mary. I’ve not used the Wild Enduro yet – but got a 2.4” front to go on my full suss this winter coming.

    I wouldn’t buy the 26” fork – that’s dead money. I’d buy a boost 27.5” fork and just use a boost kit / spacers to fit your existing wheel into it. Boost gives waaaaaay more mud clearance and the 27.5” size isn’t obsolete (yet).

    I wouldn’t plough too much money into that bike on bits unless they’d be compatible with a future bike purchase tbh.

    A mate has a similar era Cannondale Jekyll and he’s recently bought a £550 Vitus Nucleus 29er hardtail – the Cannondale doesn’t get a look in regardless of what’s being ridden now. He said he took it for a ride after the Vitus and it’s terrible. New style geometry with much longer reach / slacker headangles / lower bottom brackets is a game changer.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Thanks I bought a set of minions as above advice to try for now.

    I get exactly what your saying, and today realising both brake pistons are seized so im starting to get annoyed with it all already. Local bike place suggested I just bin them but they should be serviceable no?

    Quick question, say I buy a nice new 27.5 fork now with the intention of buying a new frame in a year or 2, what are you meant to do re: cutting the steering tube!? Just pray it will fit any future frame?

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    Depends what brakes they are really. If they’re old avid juicys or Shimano then bin them. If they’re Hope / a manufacturer that is decent and sells all spares them maybe revive them.

    I’d just buy some cheapish 4 pot brakes like Sram Guide R / Guide RE or Deore 4 pots. Whatever you can find in stock at a decent price.

    If you’ve bought DHF / DHR2 they’re a decent all round set of tyres. The DHF will be out of its depth in slop quicker than the dhr2.

    Try to leave the steerer tube as long as you can – add in spacers above and below the stem rather than cutting it to a perfect fit. Have a look at new bikes and see what sort of headtube lengths they run – a lot have a lower front end than older bikes.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    They are formula r1s. Hate to bin anything if they can be serviced or repaired even to have as spares. Can’t find much info but think maybe they share the rear caliper with the RX. See a few parts including seals and pistons on one website but they won’t ship to UK for some reason.

    Ah OK so much more likely a modern frame I’d need to trim a bit more off rather than be caught short? That’s encouraging. I will check a few out and see whats what. Hoping the lbs can advise on lengths if I end up dumping the bike with them.

    Out of interest right now what do you recon the sweet spot of price vs age vs technology on frames at the moment? Still can’t Beleive the price of them nowadays after a quick look. Are there a few clear favourites from 2018/19 or there abouts?

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    You’re right, it’s the RX caliper. Formula spares tend to be pretty expensive and availability’s been tricky for a while. You might be able to just strip and clean the caliper though and get them going again. They’re another weird spec choice for a long travel bike tbh.

    Someone just posted that CRC have SRAM Guide brakes starting from £42 an end, might be worth a look. Basically if you’re having to pay someone to fix the Formulas, that’s going to add up to the price of new brakes pretty fast. But at the same time, this is kind of how it becomes a money pit.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Ive found someone with them in so ive ordered pistons and seals etc so will get them off the bike, give it a go and see how we get on.

    The bleed kit I bought specially doesnt have an adapter to fit the port on the rear caliper as its bigger than the others. Any idea what adjuster I need?

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    I think bikes from about 2018 onwards generally got more modern geometry. Some companies got on that boat a few years earlier some were later. Ideally you’d want a frame with boost rear spacing / a metric shock at the minimum if you were going to change.

    CRC have a load of Sram brakes on offer – guide t are basic ish but would do the job – the levers should be ‘flip-flop’ so you could buy 2 rears and shorten the hoses accordingly. I’d be tempted to buy the Guide RE for more power but then you’re spending more than you really need to.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Good to know thanks. After a bit of browsing I’m loving the look of the yeti sb140. There’s a lovely one used for just over 4k local to me but I don’t want to drop that at the moment.

    Think the plan is put a new or modern fork on then and and plan to buy something similar to the yeti either frame or full bike in a year or two when they drop in price a bit more.

    Think I’ve unseised the brakes will give them a go tomorrow when my pads arrive. Might not need the seal rebuild kits but will still do them whenever they turn up.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    soundb0y
    Free Member

    The bleed kit I bought specially doesnt have an adapter to fit the port on the rear caliper as its bigger than the others.

    Usually the R1X has the bleed port in the banjo and uses the same size as the master cylinder, have you got a pic?

    Premier Icon joebristol
    Full Member

    I personally wouldn’t buy a secondhand yeti frame without warranty – a lot of them have cracked – and if the sb140 has switch infinity they don’t play nicely with mud / UK conditions.

    Loads of good frames out there though.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Northwind – I found it I was being blind thanks. Done a rudimentary bleed this evening and they seem to be working again. Will bleed them again properly tomorrow when my pads arrive and see how it looks but im feeling positive.

    Joe – Ahh fair play, at least I have time to spend a while doing my research to ensure I can get exactly what I want this time. They sure look nice though.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Full Member

    Oh yeah, when bleeding these brakes if they’ve been fitted for a long time, it’s worth slightly loosening the bolts on the bar clamps, just enough to let the brakes move. Sounds daft, but the reservoir vents into the back of the brake ie against the bars, which is quite clever but if dirt’s built up over time it can seal it up and cause problems (also on some softer carbon bars)

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Thanks for the tip. Spent a bit more time on the back brake today and it all seems to be working well again in the stand. Will see how it feels when riding but Im pretty happy after the local shop told me to bin them.

    New forks turned up today. Went with some 27.5 fox 36s. Im pretty not so worried about cutting them to fit at the moment, more so to ensure they fit a future frame like I said.

    After looking about for a bit, as someone said a lot of the models I like the look of seem to be shorter head tube length than mine at 5.7″ so shouldnt be too much of an issue.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    Can anyone please tell me what this Bush or shaft is called inside the bearings in the shock shuttle?
    shuttle

    The bolt was seized in there pretty good and took a minute with the heat gun and a good whack to get out. Its left a nice burr down the inside of the shaft so guessing it wants replacing.
    Also ordered a set of 6900rs bearings as they feel rough as.

    How do you get them out when there is one pressed from each side? Tempted to just hit them out with a socket and rubber mallet but I’m pretty sure that’s just my ape brain thinking and it’s a terrible idea? I’ve got a proper press and pull kit coming tomorrow.

    I can’t find one anywhere but what are the chances of getting hold of a new shock shuttle?

    Typically my new shock doesn’t fit so need to dremel a few mill off it anyway.

    Will probably order a full bearing kit for the rest as they’ve never been changed.

    Premier Icon soundb0y
    Free Member

    0 chances of a new one. Distributor’s say nothing in stock and discontinued.

    Anyone in fabrication? Any idea what sort of money would cost to get one made?

    Someone must have one on a cracked frame sat in their garage!

    Premier Icon intheborders
    Free Member

    See a few parts including seals and pistons on one website but they won’t ship to UK for some reason.

    I can’t imagine why, can you? 😉

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