All that is happening is …well yes Mr Crow is doing an excellent job by holding the country to Ransom.

I think you need a reality check fella…….how is Bob Crow holding the country to ransom ? Or haven’t you thought about that ? …… “Facts” my dear boy, “facts”. (apologies to Harold Macmillan)

WHERE do you think the money comes from????”

You could start by getting 2.7 million people back to work, instead of just adding to the figure, that should help.

Of course full employment would dramatically increase wages – and you don’t like that do you ?

So your solution is low wages/mass unemployment. OK then, why doesn’t it work ? Why is the economy in such mess ? It wasn’t caused by high wages you know, I can assure you of that. In fact the cause is for the opposite reason.

.

I like your rant concerning taxpayers btw. Why doesn’t the self-appointed “Taxpayers Alliance” kick up a stink about executive pay ?

Directors’ pay rose 50% in past year, says IDS report

In fact the Taxpayers Alliance is very quick to defend greedy self-serving executives who award themselves massive pay rises. Here Matthew Sinclair, who is director of the Taxpayers Alliance, makes a touching defence of obscene executive pay rises :

Executive pay: don’t believe the headlines

Senior executives ……..underpaid and overtaxed. Bless’em.

Why not? Fear of sharting?

I sort of jumped on the Crowe bandwagon myself…but in his defence and a golden opportunity to abuse hora. Mind you, afterwards somebody said I was “sounding suspiciously like Elfin” which deflated me quite a bit. 😀

deadlydarcy – Member

I’d laugh but as you know Northwind, I can’t really.

Never worry, that was 3 pages ago, everyone’s forgotten. Plus most people think you were right. So fill yer boots

Because despite trying for the last thirty years a low wage economy does not deliver results

Is that why China is doing so well, and we can’t compete with them?

aracer – Member

Is that why China is doing so well, and we can’t compete with them?

Course, our economy is in every other way exactly the same as China’s, making this an excellent comparison.

Is that why China is doing so well, and we can’t compete with them?

Nice playing stupid/devil’s advocate/let’s pick an argument with the leftie/whatever it is you’re trying to do aracer.

China is doing “well” because it is selling to more affluent markets. If it had relied solely on its own internal market it would not have progressed as it has. Its recent huge growth in manufacturing has not primarily occurred because of domestic consumer consumption. And selling to “poor” countries would not have got them very far. They need consumers with large amounts of disposable income, just like we do.

And “doing well” as you very well know, is extremely relative. China’s GDP per capita is way below ours – and that of most other countries of the world.

None of which will last of course. China is now developing its own internal market, and not least because it has seen in the last few years the dangers of over reliance on exports (as well as needing to address the pressing problem of lopsided development) There will of course need to be substantial increases in wages.

Eventually China, like Japan before it, will no longer be the principle global source of cheap manufactured goods, and global capitalism will seek new labour forces to exploit – such as India. If indeed global capitalism manages to pull it off and survive its second worse crises ever – the jury’s still out on that as we have entered uncharted waters.

But the contradictions of capitalism and the paradox of overproduction and underconsumption will not go away. As long as it exists, capitalism will continue to exploit workers by demanding maximum productivity for minimum remuneration, after all it makes economic sense, does it not ? And at the same time expect them to have the means to purchase goods and services so it can exploit them as consumers too, after all consumers are vital to capitalism, are they not ?

……..boom and bust, boom and bust, big boom and bust, boom and bust, bigger boom and bust……

In hundreds of years time they will read about our epoch in their history books with incredulity.

DLR works fine without a driver

Oh dear. Another one who does not in any way fully understand how the DLR works… (bit of advice: find out what a Passenger Service Agent does…)

I sort of jumped on the Crowe bandwagon myself…but in his defence and a golden opportunity to abuse hora.

“And lastly, he pisses off people like you hora. That’s worth a few days in lieu in itself.”

Wonderful. This pleases me immensely. 😀

Mind you, afterwards somebody said I was “sounding suspiciously like Elfin” which deflated me quite a bit.

A great compliment, surely?

I like these threads. Loads of initial knee-jerking and outrage, then some actual facts and a bit of objectivness, then some mumbling and lame attempts to sidetrack the discussion to hide the initial embarrasment of being pwned, then it should run out of steam unless someone comes up with something not directly related but similar to spark off a whole new argument. 😆

To repeat, join your union! If you want to do something about every company’s “obscene” pay for senior management you have to strengthen the union WHERE YOU WORK.

TUs will never “fix” senior management pay because a) it’s none of their business and b) they’re only going to be interested in how much their members get paid. This bleating about manager pay is purely ancillary to their real interest which is (fair enough) what’s in it for them.

the only way to tackle obscene executive pay in some companies is to break the strangle hold of shareholder groups, all looking after each other. it would be down to shareholders to stop the high pay awards. Problem is the shareholders are wanting the companies they hold shares in to back them up in their executive pay deals.

Huh? If the shareholders are happy with management pay, then what’s the problem? It’s the shareholders that lose out as a result, not anyone else.

TUs will never “fix” senior management pay because a) it’s none of their business and b) they’re only going to be interested in how much their members get paid.

Not true. It is their business. And they are interested.

Compass Launches Commission on Executive Pay?

UNISON submission to the High Pay Commission