Training – The secret game – power cadence heart rate

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  • Training – The secret game – power cadence heart rate
  • Premier Icon mikewsmith
    Subscriber

    So injury dictates my riding take place in the living room.
    A few posts ago I was asking about trainer road, ended up signing up and have the power curve mapped for my trainer so doing power based workouts.

    I have confirmed that I’m not naturally a spinner and i use the gears to hit the work rates.
    My cadence sits between 70-85 (90 at a push)
    My aim for the next 4-6 weeks is to build mtn bike fitness for a 3 day race mid march (50km Day1,enduro downhill day 2 & 25km day3).
    I’m using the intermediate Build II programme from the site.

    Most of the workouts so far have been gently with 4-9 min intervals at my FTP (I think thats what its called – about 333)
    These feel good for mtb biking as it resembles singletrack/trail riding mostly (in my head)
    Any advice really should I try and up my cadence/do spinning type workouts?
    Any pointers greatfully received

    cynic-al
    Member

    Learning to spin isn’t going to ad easy on a Turbo, low resistance and gears and intervals he guess.

    I don’t think it’s that relevant for mtb racing, I’d be trying to retain strength on your upper body for that event.

    Premier Icon Pawsy_Bear
    Subscriber

    Cadence too low.

    warm up 80 – 85
    Training 90 – 100
    Interval 100+

    For MTB interval training is ideal to give you short burst speed and turbo in bad weather is a great work out. I do gym as well to increase core and upper body.
    Use your gears I set turbo to one resistance and then use gears to get HR to the correct zone. For interval that would be 90 – 100 maximum heart rate. You might be surprised at how good it is for quality training.

    Top tip – set the turbo up in front the TV 🙂 You can for steady sessions watch films. There are DVD’s MTB specific that you can also buy and they help.

    Glad to hear you’ve got a plan and the dedication to train.

    If your FTP is 333 in Jan you’ll be in top half of expert class come summer.

    richard1972
    Member

    How did you work out your FTP?

    Premier Icon njee20
    Subscriber

    If your FTP is 333 in Jan you’ll be in top half of expert class come summer.

    Agreed – that’s very high. If that’s being used as a proxy for setting the intensity I’d look at checking that.

    neilm
    Member

    If you are going to work HR into the mix, then you need to do a bit of reading, as age, weight, fitness level etc all have a bearing and your work should be designed to take your max heart rate into account. For instance, if I were to only see 90 to 100 bpm during interval work, I would effectively be doing nothing, as I typically warm up at 135.

    As a comparison, I am 54, my son is 25, our resting, working and maximum heart rates are completely different, so a programme designed for me would have him hardly breaking a sweat.

    Spinning is good to have for road riding, but again it is down to the individual to work out just how fast you want to spin, and it also takes time to train yourself. In addition, spinning fast, say over 100 to 120 is really hard on a turbo and I end up flailing around like a mad thing when I try it.

    Don’t forget warm up and warm down.

    Just to add, I had never used a turbo until this summer, when I dislocated my right shoulder in a fall. During my month off the bike, I turbo trained every other day, and although it sometimes felt like a chore, overall I enjoyed it and I’m sure it helped me maintain a degree of fitness until I was allowed to ride again.

    Premier Icon njee20
    Subscriber

    If you’ve got power I’d not worry too much about HR.

    Mbnut
    Member

    What’s the event… sounds good.

    richard1972
    Member

    An FTP of 333 watts at 95kg is ok but a 333 watt FTP at 50kg you would be world class.

    IanMunro
    Member

    I used trainer road for the first time this week and according to the test on it, my ftp is 213. Clearly I must be ill, or the fluid in the trainer is too cold, or something else other than the obvious 😀

    Premier Icon Rubber_Buccaneer
    Subscriber

    I am too ignorant to give training advice but this I believe is true. If you are using trainer road and used their test to get FTP then the actual figure doesn’t matter nor does your heart rate. Just follow your chosen plan and good luck:o)

    IanMunro
    Member

    Yup, I understand the number is somewhat arbitrary, I just wished it had chosen a slightly more flattering one 😀
    I still need to sort out the bike, as it was quickly knocked together and the saddle needs raising and the gears sorting. That’s got to be good for a least another 100watts 😀

    Shred
    Member

    Find the cadence that fits you. There are NO right numbers.

    On long rides on the road bike I usually average 70 – 75. It’s the way I pedal. I also use trainer road and really enjoy the structure to help me meet my goals, but don’t worry about the prescribed cadence too much.

    richard1972
    Member

    IanMunro are you running Di2? I hear its worth another 15watts, well worth the £1500 price tag. If you can’t strech that far, Assos socks I’ve been told can give up to 2.5 watts providing the legs are shaved!

    Premier Icon mikewsmith
    Subscriber

    ok some more info, 33 and 80kg so the 333wpower test is either a fluke or a good start.

    i’m generally low cadence and have some local elites roped into help will post the results

    IanMunro
    Member

    Just realised that I was wearing brown socks on the test. That can’t help.

    What was the test that gave you the figure of 333? Curious, that’s all

    Premier Icon njee20
    Subscriber

    You can’t fluke power. Your FTP is basically the hardest you can sustain for an hour. If its being measured accurately it is what it is. Even if its not, as long as it’s consistently inaccurate it doesn’t matter!

    How did you test it to get 333?

    Beaten by TSC!

    richard1972
    Member

    333 at 80kg give you a power to weight FTP of 4.1 watts per kilo, a good start for sure. The most common way of working out your FTP is do a 20 minute all out effort, take the average watts for the twenty minutes and times by .95. As an example if a rider did 200 watts for 20 mins his FTP would be 190 watts. Once you have this figure then you can work out your training levels. It’s also a good way of tracking improvements over time as you just do another 20 min test in 8-10 weeks and hopefully see an improvement.

    ac282
    Member

    If your ftp really is 333, then 4-9 minute intervals sound a bit short. My understanding of ftp is that it is the power you can do for an hour so you aren’t taxing your self much in the first 10 minutes anyway.

    mtbmatt
    Member

    To train FTP I’d be looking at a minimum of 8 minute intervals.
    Below that you would be different energy systems. 8 minutes pus then you are fully aerobic and at a state that is largely sustainable, hence 95% of a 20 minute interval being about the same as 1hr flat out.

    Unless you have an accurate power meter then I would take all power measurements with a pinch of salt. They might be repeatable, which is the important part but the true value might not be accurate.

    Premier Icon djflexure
    Subscriber

    Contrary to what has been stated above I would suggest that wearing white shoes gives by far the biggest increase in FTP. This may only be improved on if they are patent leather.

    (FTP of 333 is huge)

    Premier Icon mikewsmith
    Subscriber

    ok the FTP was measured using the 8 minute test on Trainer Road – 1 hr work out with 2×8 min blast sections.
    I’m averaging 220w over the hr sessions mostly. Its repeatable but not sure on accuracy, it uses the mapped power curve of the trainer to calc the effort with the garmin sensors to do wheel speed and cadence.
    Heart rate gets up in the right zones too.
    Seems like I’m heading down the right track I’ll see how the programme goes, the is mostly to sort the legs out while I can’t ride, I’m also going to the gym to try and maintain the core and strength stuff and when the plaster comes off my hand I’ll be doing more.

    Also summer is already here and drifting away in Oz 🙂
    The race is the Buller Bike Festival
    http://www.rapidascent.com.au/BikeBuller/eventdescription.aspx

    Mbnut
    Member

    Ahhh you are in Oz… that explains why I couldn’t find the event… looks good, have fun.

    Premier Icon mikewsmith
    Subscriber

    Hopefully will be, there are 4 of us going and currently 2 are off the bike injured so either lots of beer photos and cheering/crying or a great time.

    Got a few of these things in the pipeline so hopefully can kick my fitness into shape and enjoy rather than surviving.

    Mbnut
    Member

    I am aiming to do a few Enduros this year and 3 out of the 4 guys I ride with are injured… makes it hard to train hard but at least i’m in one piece.

    Premier Icon mikewsmith
    Subscriber

    yep, strangely it’s probably a good thing for my training as I can focus on actual training rather than riding. Not having the option to get out is hopefully making me a little more disciplined about it……

    Just got to find some way of keeping the upper body sorted and hope I can just drop back in to the mental game when I get there.

Viewing 28 posts - 1 through 28 (of 28 total)

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