@mogrim – I used to do that with cycling, it it was usually Dorset or Wales. Good fun.

@turboferret – Streatham does that to you and you wouldn’t have looked out of place running down the street talking to the trees.

Injured.
Felt a tweak in my calf in Wednesdays club run, iced it straight after and did 5k yesterday to see how it felt and the answer was “very stiff and uncomfortable at the start, but oddly fine once it warmed up”
Time for lots of stretching, lots of calf raises and some time on the bike. The only question is if I can still knock in the odd 5k to keep up the streak.

@lunge. Bad luck there. I’ve had tight calves last few days but got away with it. At least there is the bike.

Any running podcasts that people recommend? There are millions out there and I can’t listen to them all to filter out the good’uns. Cheers.

Anyone noticed Garmin is having a few issues? 😉

Re. podcasts, I love Running Commentary, just 2 fellas going for a run and chatting, perfect for whiling away long runs. They recorded there entire London Marathon which was brilliant to listen to.

Podcasts:

Bad Boy Running – might take a bit of getting into with some in-jokes etc, but great interviews

Let’s Get Running

That Running Podcast

Marathon Talk

The Morning Shakeout

Stephen Scullion

Work, Play, Love

The Way of the Runner

Yes, I listen to quite a lot of podcasts when I run – I need to run quite a lot every week just to keep up or I get behind 😀

Went out yesterday evening, slowly building up my distance after my injury lay-off – did a hilly 4 miler at an average mile pace of 9mins (161bpm). Some way off what I was doing last year but getting there and enjoyed it.

In addition to any mentioned; Inside Running Podcast and Bob Graham Sounds

Quite a bit going on today/at the moment:

Damian Hall is close to finishing the Pennine Way – http://live.opentracking.co.uk/damianpennine20/#

Paul Wilson is aiming to be only the second person to do the Lakes 2500′ tops in one go – http://live.opentracking.co.uk/62fells20/?n=1#

Beth Pascal is currently on course to beat Jasmin Paris’ women’s Bob Graham record of 15hrs24mins set in 2016. I don’t know if she’s a tracker, last I heard she was ahead of schedule at Wasdale this afternoon. She set off at 0500 this morning so has 1hr20mins left as of writing this meaning she should be somewhere past Hindscarth or Robinson.

Looks like Damian did it. Still running at the end. Amazing. I feel a bit battered after 10 miles today. #aretheyhuman?

Oh, and thanks for the podcast recommendations. Lots to listen to!

Anyone have any experience/advice on a fibula stress fracture. A bit of google self diagnosis as I haven’t been able to see a GP (just a telephone consultation), but have had an X-ray (which was clear) and a video consult with a physio, who agreed with my “diagnosis”. The GP didn’t think a stress fracture likely unless I was running ultras or similar.
Anyway, did the damage in April and I can now walk on it with only a bit of soreness, but haven’t dared to try running. Strangely it’s mostly fine on the bike. I’ve been wearing a boot around the house since talking to the physio, which seems to have helped a lot
So when and how to start to try running without damaging it further?
I know I should get along to the physio, but that’s not particularly easy at the moment.

Beth completed in around 14:30, depending on the exact time that’s the third or fourth fastest BGR time ever! Currently the fastest three are: Killian Jornet (12:52); Billy Bland (13:53); Rob Jebb (14:30).

Those proper runners doing serious long FKTs put my little London trot into perspective!

For anyone who wants to see a slow mental and physical breakdown while running in a big circle you can do so here 😀 https://youtu.be/FdPCKMb4onc

Enjoyed the video, TF. I thought you held it together pretty well considering. Good effort.

So when and how to start to try running without damaging it further?

Usually some time after any pain has subsided. Depends on the severity sometimes they are very small (still painful) but 6 weeks is usually enough. you should have no tenderness however and no reaction to the “tap” test.

Thanks for that, still some tenderness and over 3 months now. I’m reluctant to bother the GP at this stage, they have their hands full here at the moment. It’s still going in the right direction, just painfully slowly. Just have give running more time, I’m not looking forwards to starting all over again though ☹️
Not sure what the “tap” test involves? I can probably make a guess though!

Completed my first Marathon yesterday. 3:57. Slower than I’d hoped but better than I’d feared.

I was on for a nice 3:40, but my quads utterly failed at around 35k and I was struggling to keep my HR under 170 for the last 8k.

Up until about 20k I was running at 5:10-5:15/km at HR135, but after 24k, my HR started to rise to about 160 and at about 30k my quads started to cramp. The last 7k were excruciating!

This was a virtual run of the Bath Two Tunnels Marathon which has been pushed back to 2021 and was completed on the railway path from Westerleigh to Bath and back.

Good work Daffy, that’s a good time for a first attempt, particularly as it was solo. Everything breaking at 35k/20 miles is entirely normal, as the saying goes, the second half of a marathon starts at 20 miles. The last 5 or 6 miles of a marathon are rarely pleasant, and if they are you’ve not gone hard enough for the first 20!

I had what I could consider a perfect Wednesday night yesterday.
Fairly sharp club run
A 1 mile PB in the end of run thrash (5:45 mile)
2 pints of Enville ale
2 samosas that the fella from the cricket club we share a clubhouse with had brough
An hour of watching the cricket nets in the evening sun

Every Wednesday should be spent like that.

Thanks for that, still some tenderness and over 3 months now. I’m reluctant to bother the GP at this stage, they have their hands full here at the moment. It’s still going in the right direction, just painfully slowly. Just have give running more time, I’m not looking forwards to starting all over again though ☹️
Not sure what the “tap” test involves? I can probably make a guess though!

Your guess would be right. if you have a SF then tapping the area with your finger will be very painful. SF are normally so painful that even determined runners stop running before they become a complete fracture so if you take weight off and stop any impact bearing exercise then it is unusual still to be painful 6 weeks later. I would continue to ice if the area is still sore and maybe try jogging and see if it is actually painful to run on. Would recommend doing the usual range of heel lifts over the stairs to build the muscle and even add weight if you can. try to get to 30×20 raises on each leg. Unfortunately your GP wont add much only refer you which will take ages. I had a few many years ago when running about 60-70 mpw and racing they are frustrating

@crewlie, can you get a face-to-face with a physio? I know some in my area, certainly the private ones, have started seeing people in person. You may find the cost of a visit to well worth it.
I know one in the Midlands who is highly regarded by the local running community, I’m sure others on this thread would be able to recommend someone similar in your area.

Thanks @lunge @surfer, I’ve just checked and the physio I know is now seeing patients. It can be slightly more difficult here because I’m on Arran and there aren’t any private physios on the Island, so it’s a couple of sometimes unreliable ferry journeys to get there and back. But I think that’s what I’ll get onto arranging.
It was certainly painful enough that there was no prospect of attempting to run it off, but tapping it with my finger doesn’t hurt at all now, pressing in does but less than before. I’ll try a gentle run, see how it goes, and get over to a physio.
I have been doing some calf lifts, but not enough it would seem, so they’ll be on the menu too.

Seem to have injured my hip, from my google diagnosis I think its the Iliopsoas. Not quite sure of my next steps. Its stopped me from running.

Did I read something on here about theraguns? Can’t seem to find it… missus fancies one for a few niggling muscle issues. I’d never heard of them until last week. Any good and any recommendations?

Really important one here, but can anyone tell me the difference between a jog and a run, so I don’t feel a fraud saying “run” on Strava, or selling myself short for calling it a “jog”! I’ll google it now anyway.

Anything above walking pace counts as a run in my book!

I have various levels of run:
Thrash – fast, hard, likely shorter than 10k
Run – anything that is slower than a thrash but not as slow as a…
Plod – recovery pace, but still a run and can be long
Jog – short and slow, but still running
Slog – hard, slow and with no reason for that.

According to google, anything below a 10:00/ mile is ‘jogging’ – 6:12/ km.

Not sure I agree with that, I don’t think ultra runners doing 60/70/80k at that pace would be called ‘joggers’.

I see joggers as ‘casual’ runners, they go out for a jog as much to have a natter to their mate as to get fit.

Runners take things a bit more seriously. 😀

Anyway, not much (if any) running for me this week, got 4 solid days on the bike in the west country starting Thursday so have been getting in the MTB miles (and don’t want to risk getting an injury from running days before).

My HR on a ride is nice and low now, 125 avg on a gentle spin, and even only 143 average on a fairly hard 25 miles. Was only 4 seconds slower than my PB on a climb (1:13) but crucially, my HR peaked at 187 on my pb (2 years ago), and 166 yesterday!

Nice work those that have run, and recover soon those that are injured.

The “jogging” thing is interesting and after discovering low intensity running I think I do a lot of it now, but it’s still running in my book.

What I’m about to say isn’t gloating or thinking I’m better than anyone, but running finally clicked yesterday. I’m on me hols and went on a jaunt, got lost, scratched, stung, muddy and loved it. There was a road section where I, for the first time ever, forgot I was running. I was just pedalling along at a decent enough pace and it felt just like cycling at an all day pace. Amazing feeling. Was great fun running through the wilds of Oxfordshire too and covered far more ground than walking without the hassle of dragging a bike through hedges. On the hill up to the house I felt great and gave it some beans. On Strava came in at 8 out of 63 which is a nice surprise as didn’t know it was a segment. It’s taken me 4 years to get to this point so all those starting, if I can get to this point through injury and lacking motivation, then anyone can. Get out and run/jog.

Incidentally, slow running started at 6;40/km at HR 149 a couple of months ago I can now maintain around 6:00/km for same HR. Not fast but feels like I can run all day (my legs would go first after a few hours though) and have a good chat.

I’m going to see if I am vaguely competitive over the longer stuff with some proper races. South Downs 50 miler in April which will be my qualifier (assuming I finish of course) for the Thames Path 100 in May.

The course record (5:44) for the SDW50 is held by Tom Evans, his Power of 10 is an impressive read:

2017. 3rd Marathon des Sables. 4th Eiger 101. 4th CCC 2018. 1st TCC (250k). 1st SDW50. 3rd Trail Running World Championships. 1st CCC. 2019. 3rd Western States 100.

Seems like a decent target to aim for 🙂

Its not about speed in my book.

If you are running at 10 min miling but trying to run 9 you are a runner. If you are running at 5:30 but with no aspirations then you are a jogger. It is not a derogatory term it just indicates aspiration.

I will never be a jogger as no matter how slow I now am I always want to go quicker and race those around me.

In what seems to be a bit of a theme, I had to drag myself out the door this evening. Took ages to get my stuff together and get out, really wasn’t feeling like going.

Took 15s off my 5k PB. (23.12), slowly chipping away at it. This time last year I think I was pretty happy with under 26.

Well I think my return to mountain runs was a bit premature, seem to have picked up an achilles ache which is not something I’ve had before (OK during runs but then damn sore afterwards) any tips other than rest (been avoiding agravating it further, just been sticking to bike for time being, but unsure how long to rest it)

Couple photos Mount Keen from Ballater

I will never be a jogger as no matter how slow I now am I always want to go quicker and race those around me.

Hah – that’s me. I run at a ‘bang on just about okay’ pace for a >50 yr old (between 8 and 9 min miles depending on distance) but as soon as I get home I am checking against previous runs, seeing where I did well, where I was slower than usual etc. When I was doing parkruns I would be miserable all day if I didn’t beat the previous week’s time etc.

Has anyone any experience with the MAF training system? It looks like a good way to increase ‘base’ fitness. Does the MAF test ideally have to be done on a track or do you just repeat the monthly test over the same ‘course’ ?

I found MAF did not work well at all.

If you were running on a flat athletics track in a warm location under controlled conditions, with constant heart rate (I.e. as maffetone originally trained his runners) I can see it working well, but it does not translate well to running in the real world.

The basic problem I found is that heart rate is not constant, is too difficult to measure accurately, and is affected by too many variables. It is not a reliable indicator of effort at slow speeds.

There is a lot of lag in heart rate readings. Running at a constant rate is difficult without over compensating.

Heart rate monitors only work well when you are sweating. In Scotland this needs a hard effort for large parts of the year. In the winter, Maffetone heart rate is too slow to generate enough sweat unless I deliberately overdress so that I overheat.

In cold conditions, running too slowly can make your heart rate rise as you don’t generate enough heat at low efforts. This then puts you above the maffetone limit. You then slow down a bit more to try and reduce heart rate and end up barely moving and shivering.

Drink a cup of coffee for breakfast and your heart rate spikes for a while.

If there is a hill or you have to stop and start say for a junction during a run your heart rate changes.

Running on a flat track at maffetone heart rate is actually quite a quick pace and is proper running. The same heart rates in the real world (which has more accelerations, changes in effort due to terrain etc.) result in a much slower pace and a different gait. Most people who follow maffetone end up running too slow as a result.

Maffetone training was developed for people racing frequently, but maffetone barely mentions that in his book. Racing hard generates a huge training stimulus!

I agree with most of the basic philosophy behind Maffetone and his book is an interesting read. I just found it a very unreliable way of determining training pace.

Is there a Strava STW runners club?

Went out this morning, around 10am, sweating buckets, got a best estimated 5k 24:49, previous was 26:08 two weeks ago.

I’m doing one run a week, just worked my way up to 4 miles running (bracketed by walking). A few days ago I was planning a couple of shorter faster runs instead of one longer run, but I didn’t want to this morning. Shins aching a bit after, calves better than last week (been doing calf raises). A couple of shorter/faster runs next week to mix things up perhaps?

Yes, there’s a strava group. Runners of singletrack.

The basic problem I found is that heart rate is not constant, is too difficult to measure accurately, and is affected by too many variables. It is not a reliable indicator of effort at slow speeds.

It also rises gradually over the length of a run. And personally at the start of a run I might find, say, 120BPM hard work – but once warmed up that’s a nice easy effort level.

Anyway, here’s a photo from yesterday’s run. It was a very easy 12km effort with friends up to the tallest peak in the Madrid Autonomous area, Mt. Peñalara. The peak is at 2428m and a particular highlight is the very exposed rocky ridge called Claveles.

eastcoastmike / mogrim – spectacular pics.

It was a very easy 12km effort with friends up to the tallest peak

What?!? 😃 (I’m a beginner currently managing 30 min mostly flat runs).

I got back to running this weekend after taking a week off … and found that I actually missed it – which is something of a surprise since I’ve never been much of a runner. Think I’m on the slippery slope now though … finding myself checking out running gear as well as biking gear!

5000!!