Trail running shoes don’t really have ankle support – they’re for running, not hiking!

I guess I mean something supportive, rather than light weight. I have a habit of rolling my ankle when I’m hiking or running on uneven ground.

Not a great deal of help when it comes to answering your question, but TBH I think people tend to overthink this

Of course, but nice to have some direction. I’m always conscious of going into a shop and receiving a sales pitch rather than unbiased advice so like to have a good idea of what I’m looking for first.

Do I go a bit higher and get Salamon Speedcross which seem to be well regarded (popular)?

Speedcross are OK, bit high at the back, bit floppy at the front, bit skitey on wet rock but generally OK all round. I’ve had several pairs for training/daily running and you can often pick them up very cheap. Salomon are better suited to narrow feet.

If you want something a bit firmer/lower drop I really like my Salomon Sense Pro 3 – not sure if these are still available but there seems to be a mark 4.

Not a great deal of help when it comes to answering your question, but TBH I think people tend to overthink this, when pretty much all the shoes will be fine for 95% of the time, and if you’re running in that final 5% you’ll probably have a pretty good idea of what you need.

Agreed, I’m pretty happy with comfy as a priority, plenty space in the toe box and a decent grip.

I’ve been quite happy with my cheap New Balance MT590 V4’s. They’re wearing well – 122km on them, plus they’re my ‘normal’ trainers for everyday wear.

New 10km PB for me last night, pleased with 51m47sec given it was part off road with styles/gates and part road. Given me some impetus to see if I can get to sub 50m at somepoint.

Hip is giving me problems post runs and whilst sleeping at the moment though.

I guess I mean something supportive, rather than light weight. I have a habit of rolling my ankle when I’m hiking or running on uneven ground.

I’ve not seen any running shoes that really support your ankle – it’s not really compatible with running. Even the Sauconys I’ve got at the moment (and they’re a complete panzer tank of a shoe) have limited ankle support:

IME to save your ankles you’re better off using a bosu or similar once or twice a week to build up strength.

As to a potential sales pitch, I’d just be wary of anyone insisting you need a particular type of shoe, most models are fine. Equally you don’t need to get trail shoes from a trail shoe brand, the mainstream brands like New Balance and Adidas have good stuff too. And you don’t need goretex 🙂

600km on my brooks cascadia 14’s and showing very little wear, thinking about buying a second pair to rotate them and mean I don’t have to run in wet shoes.

Building up the distances over the last 3months of being furloughed and up to 20k plus now, which considering I could only hobble 100yds down the road in January, I’m pretty happy with.

By support, I’d suggest something with a wide footprint, I felt like I was gonna roll my ankle at any minute on the mudclaws, far too narrow.

Decided I’m running too many runs at the same pace, and probably doing too many tempo runs and intervals too, ran a really slow 5 miler early doors this morning, trying to keep my HR around 130bpm, which equates to 9 minute miles.

I’m not fast by any means, but I find it hard to stick to that pace, keep finding myself drifting to a quicker pace.

…but I find it hard to stick to that pace, keep finding myself drifting to a quicker pace.

Having only started running in Dec/Jan I find I only have one pace. I’m getting quicker but I don’t find it easy to slow down. My mins/mile are all fairly consistent so it’s not like I’m starting quick and then petering out….I just can’t seem to run slower. Only reason I’d like to slow slightly is that all my runs seem to have me averaging 170bpm with a peak of 180bpm (measured on wrist with FR45)

dooos, try moving your 45 up your wrist, above wrist bone, I find it reads a bit more steady here than it does on the actual wrist joint. 170 seems awful high, not saying it’s wrong mind, we’re all different.

There’s definitely gains to be had by running slower on occasion, worth trying. I find it easier if I go for a social run with someone who’s slower, takes your mind off it a bit chatting away.

45 is already a good cm above wrist bone. I think my problem is I’m 6’7″ and I can’t maintain a decent stride and run slow, just feels like shuffling.

Aye, I feel a bit like that too, and I’m 5″ shorter than you!

I’m 6ft 3in and at 6:00-6:30 /km pace I can hold 165 cadence fairly easily. Trail running, even on mellow stuff helps as you have to take shorter steps over roots/rocks etc.

On a long slow run I try and keep my HR below 150, a recent 6.2k at 6:08 /km pace was 149bpm average, if I can get that down to the low 140’s on a 6:20 /km longer run I’ll be happy.

One thing about heart rate is it’s very personal, so make sure you aren’t comparing yourself to others, as even 2 people the same fitness, age, weight etc running the same pace can have wildly different heart rates.

My heart rate will drop to 30 overnight, averaged 111 for a 21km easy run this morning at 4:49/km but was about 167 as I was balls-out for a 2×2 mile session yesterday. I hit 181 towards the end on a 5 mile TT a few weeks ago where I was really flying, but very rarely see above 170 even on hard efforts.

200k run in June. Left myself with 21km to do last night so did a half marathon. Found some good hills Carshalton way, easy zone 2 for 18k, then saw I might nip under 2 hours so upped the pace for end. Really enjoyed the fast running!

1:57 for half, longest run of 22km, didn’t stop, toes hurt – my curse.

toes hurt – my curse

Check how you lace your shoes – I use the second lacing pattern on the following link to lock down the heel, stops my foot sliding forwards particularly on downhills:

LPT: How to lace your running shoes from LifeProTips

@mogrim Thanks. Yep, I use that system. The shoes are big with lots of space at the front and I lock in pretty tight, to the point where it hurts the top of my foot then back off a bit. These new shoes are MUCH better and I can live with it, even though I have to wear toe protectors. It’s the third toe that seems to get it. I have very squared off feet that aren’t foot shaped. I’ll keep experimenting.

Another 10k today, that’s 2 in a row…

Slow one today, wanted to keep my HR in the low 140’s.

6:41 /km pace, 140 average HR. Result! 1:06 time vs my 59 min 10k the other day, but 13 bpm less average.

Ben Nevis race now cancelled so the only thing I’ve got left is the OMM at the end of October! Hoping it can go ahead as you can distance from everyone bar your partner in that!

Right then, talk spikes to me.
The local track is back open and there is also an outside chance we’ll get a Cross Country season too so it’s another excuse to buy a pair of shoes.
I’ve not bought a pair for 20 years and I’m looking for a pair for XC first and foremost that’ll also do the job for the occasional track session.
2 questions:
1, Anything I should look for or avoid?
2, What length spikes are people running? I think I used to run 9mm on the track, does that sound about right? Longer for XC I guess?

@Spin, had a look at the SHR calendar at work today, meall nan tarmachan on 3rd October could be a goer I reckon, fingers crossed….

Signed up for the virtual Race to the Stones 100k. 1 week to do it. 16.5km this morning and just back from 10k. Had a knee problem come back at weekend but keeping it slow – it hurts but manageable. 74km to go…

At the ridiculous end of things …

Sabrina Verjee is attempting all the Wainrights in one go, certainly for the female record, possibly outright. Live tracking here – https://live.opentracking.co.uk/sabs0720/# She hasn’t had a nap yet!

Struggling to get motivated here – I manage a couple of runs then the weather changes and I don’t go out for 10 days+ and feel like I am back at the bottom again. It hasn’t helped by being laid off for several weeks with a broken rib and the one event I had planned being cancelled (Great North Run).

So after yet another break in my normal routine (15 days without running) I got out again last night – just three miles at 9 min mile pace (I did the GNR at that pace last year) and feeling it a bit today but I am determined to get back out again on Thursday and build up my stamina. It is frustrating as I always enjoy it when I am out there running but finding the motivation difficult to come by this year – what can I do to improve this?

Nothing can really improve motivation, it’s up to you really. I’ve only been doing 18-20 miles a week for the last couple of months, but I’ve been doing a lot more biking and now we’re allowed to travel for hillwalking, that probably won’t go up much.

I do find that the more I run, the better I run, and the more motivated I am, probably through fear of losing fitness.

I always enjoy it when I am out there running but finding the motivation difficult to come by this year – what can I do to improve this?

It’s a difficult year – otherwise I’d suggest either joining a club (not sure how possible that is in the UK with social distancing etc.) or signing up for another race (which will quite possibly be cancelled…)

One suggestion I’ve seen but not tried is writing the session on a calendar on the wall. Makes you feel obliged to go out. Another that I have tried (and it works) is to download a plan and try to follow it. The idea here is that you’re not just “going out for a run” but actually doing a planned session. But it’s definitely a weird year, and if you’re doing other exercise instead I wouldn’t beat yourself up about it!

I’d echo the above from Mogrim, @johndoh.
Clubs are a great way to meet new people, push yourself and generally have some purpose to your runs. You’ll have at least 2, likely 3 club runs per week and they can add some interest and structure into your running. I joined one at the start of the year after years of procrastinating and it’s been great, I love doing 2 runs a week where you have to thrash yourself to stay with the fast boys and girls, but plenty just go with a slower group and have a chat. Most clubs are back at it in the UK, albeit with some restrictions/precautions.

Re. challenges/goals, setting yourself a few that are unrelated to any event you may or may not do happen. It could be a certain number of miles per week, it could be the number of times you run per week, or it could be a time over a certain distance or course. Having something to aim at is vital.

Looking to explore your local area can help too. Have a look on OS Maps or GoogleMaps, find a path a suitable distance away and go explore it. I know my local area so much better now I run than when I didn’t.

And finally, build habit. Pick maybe 4 days per week and a time that suits and commit to running on those days. You can add structure to that as well, Sunday long run, Monday easy recovery miles, Wednesday intervals, Friday tempo run, that kind of thing.

I found that run commuting was an excellent method of getting my runs in – although obviously not suitable for everyone, especially when most people are currently working from home. 6:20am, out the door and a very steady 8km to the railway station, 4pm leave the office and run 19km home. Not only was I getting a run in, but I was getting home at the same time, so there was a practical purpose. Currently virtually every run has a net zero vector starting and finishing at home, so it’s just as easy to turn the 4:55am alarm off and stay in bed.

Before a marathon build I’ll put every session in my Outlook calendar so that I know what I’m doing each day.

Also I’d say the Strava Heatmap is a great resource, although that may be behind a partial paywall now. If I’m travelling to somewhere new I’ll always map out a few runs with the help of the Heatmap to see where is popular, and thus should be runnable. It’s fine to just use Ordnance Survey but that won’t tell you whether a marked footpath is in fact horribly overgrown or knee-deep mud and thus everyone avoids it.

But it’s definitely a weird year, and if you’re doing other exercise instead I wouldn’t beat yourself up about it!

Err, yeah, that other exercise bit LOL! TBF, I have got out on my bike more than I did last year (when I trained exclusively for the GNR) but my normal three times a week spin classes haven’t happened since before Christmas (plumbing issue at my local Pure Gym meant it closed in early December and was just about due to re-open when lockdown happened). And of course parkruns haven’t restarted yet and that was my normal Saturday run.

@lunge – xc spikes and track spikes are pretty different. Track spikes weigh absolutely nothing and are pretty minimal, of course there are different track spikes for different disciplines too to confuse the situation.
XC spikes often have some grip on the rear foot although this is minimal compared to a trail shoe, they often also have a small midsole with a little bit of cushioning although not much. They often weigh a bit more than track spikes and are a bit more solidly constructed (thicker material with less weight saving).
I don’t tend to do much track work and if I do I often wear a racing flat (Adidas Takumi) but do have some adizero spikes as I picked them up for about a tenner so though why not. I have got some xc spikes which I also got relatively cheaply and are great when the going gets boggy. For spike length, usually it’s about as long as you can get away with if it’s really boggy and less so if its not as boggy – I’ve possibly got 13mm in at the moment. For the track, as i don’t do enough I don’t really know but I would say probably about 6mm currently although I’ve no idea if that’s a standard length or just because that’s what came with the shoes.

You could get away with XC spikes on the track but it would be less good the other way around.

Looking for some advice on a target 10k time please. I’m following a 12 week programme from the ‘faster road racing’ book but unsure of how to target my goal ‘race’.

First time I’ve followed a more ‘advanced’ program, its higher mileage and more quality sessions than the Garmin plan I followed for the GNR (25k ish p/w in total).

In the plan there are some 5k race attempts built into the workout, would the best method be to take the time of a latter one of these, double it and add a bit on?

would the best method be to take the time of a latter one of these, double it and add a bit on?

That would be a pretty simple way of calculating it – you aren’t going to fatigue that much over 10k.

As a start point, double your 5k time and add a minute, that’ll give you just under 10 seconds per mile to play with.
Adjust up or down depending on how scary that number looks.

Bit of a change of scene since I last posted on this thread – me and my running buddy Esther have relocated nearly 600 miles north to Speyside and have the benefit of Ben Rinnes right on our doorstep! Already been accused of “cheating” as she wears a harness on the uphills! My ‘flat’ 10k circuit is around the forest at the end of the road and involved 200m of elevation. Will slowly build up the distances and hopefully some longer days out in the Cairngorms beckon.

On the subject of shoes with ankle support, I’ve just found that mine do a good job of inflaming my achilles on uphills so I’m sticking with ‘shoes’ for a bit.

Setting targets is the best motivation for me; weekly goals, run distance, trying to keep HR under a certain level on a run, or hitting a certain pace.

12k run tonight, which is my longest ever (by 0.5km) at 6:04 /km pace, avg HR of 149. Well happy with that. Managed to do the 10k bang on 1hr too!

My legs, however, are not. Gonna feel it tomorrow, no injury – just proper muscle fatigue.

Good work ta11pau1, there’s few feelings I like more than nicely fatigued legs, it means you know you’ve put a shift in.

Well done, all. Tough to get motivated and targets do help. 50km of my 200km done. 10 mile trail run with some fellow runners who have offered support. I realise this is a normal week for many,
But it’s a lot for me – previous record 57km. ITB playing up on right knee – very painful run this morning and only managed 6.5km. Will break out the old knee strap tomorrow – it’s not a cure but should get me through.

Nice one dovebiker – I was brought up (mainly) in Craigellachie and my folks stay in Aberlour. Long since moved away but I miss the area.

Good run last night – only short intervals, 5×1′, but starting to recover some of the pace I lost during lockdown. It helped that the temperature had dropped a bit compared to the previous run, too.