Thanks. Sorry should have thought to look there. Looks interesting. Keeps us posted if you get in the Beta test. (on the trainer road thread!!)

How are people getting on with their plans then? I’m still on hold with my quad/patellar tendon issue, some.naproxen has helped take the worst of it down, but got an appointment with a local sports physio tomorrow.

Hoping I can get back to it with atleast some shorter z2 turbo sessions

I’ve fallen off the waggon a little bit, some recurring back pain put me off turbo sessions (although I don’t genuinely believe turbo sessions should be bad for my back, and physio agrees).

Happily this came about just as the snow started melting and we got that brief sunny snap, so I got some good outdoor riding in. Combined with the best part of a week off, my legs were feeling great on the outdoors stuff so I’ve started trying to get my training rides done outdoors.

I’m also just losing patience with strictly controlling my zones, especially on the gravel bike where it’s just too tempting to go hard on some sections.

Weekend ride with didnthurt was a good example, lots of awesome new trails so there was no chance I was sticking to ‘endurance’ zone. Got home happy but absolutely shelled, heavy legs the next day.

Need to research Fartlek I think, can you do three or four rides a week where each ride is e.g. 20% hard/80% easy?

I’m also just losing patience with strictly controlling my zones, especially on the gravel bike where it’s just too tempting to go hard on some sections.

My coach actively encourages a bit of freedom when outdoor riding from now especially in my race discipline (mtb) on the basis there’s more to racing such as specifity and handling on the bike. At the moment I’m Z2/3 mix and he’s happy for me to “control” my pace to hit the zones where I can but not worry about variability. E.g, if I hit a longish 3% climb just sit in Z3 (by hr and rpe as I don’t have a PM on my MTB) and don’t go smashing it into threshold. If I come home with roughly 2/3rd in Z2 and 1/3 in Z3 it’s good enough, with 3-4hrs on the bike being great practise, effort and an all over body work out.

absolutely shelled, heavy legs the next day.

Which is an issue if your compromising the next days workout. Otherwise, kick back and recover.

Need to research Fartlek I think, can you do three or four rides a week where each ride is e.g. 20% hard/80% easy?

Well fartlek is really just unstructured/random structure (wait! did I just write that?) So rather than head out and do 3 sets of 4x3min efforts you just sprinkle those efforts through your ride: this fence post to the top of the hill, sprint from this bus stop to the traffic lights, that sort of thing. Use suitable Strava segments if you want. The efforts should all be of similar length & intensity and the rest of the ride should be easy, probably even a 90% easy/10% hard distribution.

I’ve enough hills of varying length around me that I can do reps on them at whatever zone/RPE/HR I’ve got planned but I might also do a ride where most is Z1 and there’s just one or two efforts of a couple of minutes in a three or four hour ride.

The efforts should all be of similar length & intensity and the rest of the ride should be easy, probably even a 90% easy/10% hard distribution.

Awesome, tomorrow’s gravel ride is planned as 6 x 2 minute hard efforts and the rest easy, sounds like I’ve got roughly the right idea…

Oh, and chasing segments is right up my street, KOM’d a random climb on Tuesday because it happened to be a good 10 minute effort (and the KOM mostly because it’s not a very nice segment and I doubt many people have taken it seriously, busy road crossing in the middle).

I have to admit my motivation is pretty low right now. It always dips a bit in the winter a little, but I’m tired from all this COVID shite, bored of doing the same loop over & over & over again, bored of the same BS on the box & precious little to look forward to. Infection rates seem to be up in area places as some are unable, it seems, to exercise some self-control. I’m doing what I’m told & limiting myself as per guidelines, but F me I’m beginning to wonder why I’m bothering…

I should be due a jab in the next 6 wks but I’ll believe it when it happens.

I’ve entered all 3 Gorrick races in April & the Vittoria MTB Marathon in July. But I’m so fing bored of everything right now..

Going pretty well here. Got myself back into the swing of doing my workouts before work rather than afterwards which gives me more time in the evening to spend with my young lad. 4x 8 min Zone 4 / 5 efforts before 7am are pretty grim though…

Recently decided to sell my powermeters (Stages x3) and get some pedal based Favero Assioma’s so I can swap between my bikes. Too much variability between multiple powermeters so figured it makes sense to use just one. One benefit of the Assioma’s is the pedal body can be swapped to SPD’s for MTBing which is ace.

Sounds like the Nationals XC Round 1 is going to be postponed and hopefully the season will kick off from round 2 in May instead. Things should be a little clearer within the next couple of weeks.

One benefit of the Assioma’s is the pedal body can be swapped to SPD’s for MTBing which is ace.

Is there an official solution sold by assioma now , or just the hack?

Just the hack although it’s as good a solution as a hack can be! I bought some Wellgo M19’s that i’ll be using for the conversion.

Training going pretty well. Consistently getting my hours in, at sensible HR/RPE and have enough variety to make it interesting. Mainly solo rides but the odd joint ride with a mate, which is the only social contact i have at the moment. Rest week this week. Am following self made Joe Friel style plan.

Have also gone back to using myfitnesspal to count the calories – have lost a few pounds as a result. I find that even when I think I’m eating healthily it’s all too easy for the calorie count to creep ever upwards (eg wife’s wonderful home baking efforts). Looking for a nice weight loss of 1 or 2 pounds a week based on daily calorie target of 1900, more if doing volume and/or intensity.

Doing some weights too although limited by 10kg dumbells. Bigger squats etc would be useful.

And yoga most mornings which seems to risk injury as much as build strength.

3 Gorrick races in April & the Vittoria MTB Marathon in July

See you there…. 🙂

Well good news for me from the physio. No mechanical issues with my knee (all ligaments, tendons etc seem fine) and suspects a bit of kneecap tracking issue due to tight outer quads, ITB and hip flexors. I do stretch, honest, but she thinks may be the concentrated turbo 5-6 days a week over the last few months has brought it to a head.

So after some rather spicy deep quads massage and kinesiology tape on my knee I’ve got a few additional stretches to do and suggested I just cycle every other day for the time being. Back in 2 weeks.

We’ve currently got a light northerly and only 2c, but dry, so I might have an hours Z2 run out before dark to celebrate 🙂

Well good news for me from the physio. No mechanical issues with my knee (all ligaments, tendons etc seem fine) and suspects a bit of kneecap tracking issue due to tight outer quads, ITB and hip flexors. I do stretch, honest, but she thinks may be the concentrated turbo 5-6 days a week over the last few months has brought it to a head.

When I had persistent and mysterious knee complaints it boiled down to increasing mileage/intensity too quickly. Sadly I confused matters by doing a lot of that mileage on a singlespeed, thus contributing to the volume of anecdotal evidence suggesting singlespeeds were bad for knees…

When I stepped back and started building up again more slowly all was good.

Yeh, well I did think I was being sensible with the plans I was doing and not doing my usual weekend rides of a good 3-4 hours that i’d normally be doing, but it would appear not!

I guess though a 1.5-2 hour turbo session even at a moderate pace is still more demanding than the road with the lack of movement, varying in pace or cadence and no free wheeling at all.

In to my 4th week of training with my new coach (although it’s only three weeks of training, the first week involved testing my 5 and 20min CP to set my zones 🤮) Really enjoying it, managed to do all the sessions although today’s was touch and go weather I did (had my covid jab yesterday and felt a bit “iffy” upon waking) I’m predominantly doing a base phase atm so mainly built around tempo/SS but already doing sessions around these zones that I haven’t done/seen before so it bodes well for the rest of the year. Everyday is a school day and all that !

I’m mostly sticking to my self made plan, it’s now into week 3 of the plan but fourth week getting back on the bike properly. During the winter I was only doing one or two rides per week but nothing structured.

I’m still waiting for the benefits to make themselves apparent but I’ll stick with the plan for another 4 week block as I definitely feel different after turbo sessions to how I normally feel after my regular rides. So I presume they are doing something beneficial.

I got my arse handed to me from 13thfloormonk at the weekend so that’s enough to keep me motivated to train 😉

I’m all over the place at present
Ended my TR sub and made my own plan in TP
Then I has second thoughts and renewed TR – so I have 2 plans now
Not using either of them.
Spent so much time in recent weeks doing online club events and races on RGT and Zwift (TTT) that fatigue becomes a problem if I add more intensity
Just had to take 2 days off to recover for the TTT tonight – which went well.
So just going with the flow for the moment

@didnthurt – back when I was running I got very slow after an injury so did hill reps one night a week, every other run was just steady endurance pace. The hill reps were done at an intensity that I was on the point of throwing up.

I’d a route up the local hill and back, about 9k. When I started I was taking 64mins. Over the first month I dropped about two minutes. By the end of the second month I’d got under the hour, just. Nothing changed for a few weeks then one day out of nowhere I did a 51min run. A straight 8min improvement “overnight”. I eventually got down to just under 49mins.

Generally the point being: it takes time for everything to kick in. That time will vary from person to person so you have to be patient, persistent and consistent.

Cheers Whitestone, I’ll keep at it with the belief that improvements will come. I got pretty fit last year just by riding a lot more so am quite excited to see what a structured plan can provide.

Ticking along nicely with mine. 5 weeks in to the Zwift beginner FTP plan with one weights session and a MTB ride a week added in. Followed it pretty closely with the exception of two missed sessions.

FTP has gone from 211w to 246w (non smart turbo). Looking on course for a 2kg drop and 40w gain in the 6 weeks which I’m very happy with.

As we approach summer I’ll look to make it more MTB specific.

I’d a route up the local hill and back, about 9k. When I started I was taking 64mins. Over the first month I dropped about two minutes. By the end of the second month I’d got under the hour, just. Nothing changed for a few weeks then one day out of nowhere I did a 51min run. A straight 8min improvement “overnight”. I eventually got down to just under 49mins.

I’m currently riding a wee wave like this, three months of relatively consistent turbo sessions, a couple of weeks inconsistency, and a fortnight of varied rides where I’ve had power on tap to PB or even KOM sections on Strava (usual caveats to KOMs apply, these aren’t exactly popular segments). Feels great!

Question is what to do now? I don’t really plan on revisiting turbo, we’re moving house and it’s already packed away, and I think I’ve done enough that if/when CX season starts to look likely, I know what I have to do and when to do it (e.g. three months out, get back on the over-unders and 30/15s!).

I think a lot of my riding for the next few months will be grabbing opportunities when I can, so I think I’ll focus on short, hard rides during the week and enjoying longer rides at the weekend. Happily I’m moving somewhere with a LOT of good climbs, in fact I will have a selection of central belt Scotland’s bests climbs more or less literally on my doorstep 😎

get back on the over-unders

Should over-under (10 x 1 min 90%/100%) feel harder than 20 mins at FTP?
What HR % would you expect to be at, at the end of the second set (10 mins 60% FTP in between the sets). I know, many variables and we’re all different. I just found the session fairly steady, after dreading it a bit.

My over-unders were 1 min @ 120% and 2 min @ 100% FTP, repeated 4 times, 3 sets, so overall was 3×12 minutes.

Obviously those figures will raise eyebrows, I never did figure out what my accurate FTP was, I think the test protocol I was doing was too hard, so I just adjusted workouts until I could just complete them and no more. Maybe my FTP should have been higher so that those numbers were more like 90% FTP ‘unders’ and 110% ‘overs’ or something.

Either way, my heart rate for the above workout seemed to hover just under threshold e.g. 168/169BPM when my threshold/20 minute heartrate was approx 171BPM, which sort of suggests that overall it was more like doing 3×12 min FTP?

Well an hour at Z2 power last night and my knee was fine and is now this morning. Going to struggle to follow the physio advice and keep off the bike today as I’m desperate to get back to it and continue the build for summer biking trips.

Hmmm…. Turra Coo 300k (2900m elevation) is 31st July. 21 weeks to build up distance and lose weight assuming knee plays ball. Tempted to pay my £5 as a commitment anyway 😱

Either way, my heart rate for the above workout seemed to hover just under threshold e.g. 168/169BPM when my threshold/20 minute heartrate was approx 171BPM, which sort of suggests that overall it was more like doing 3×12 min FTP?

What’s the max HR you’ve recorded recently, if I might be so nosey?

Indoors, 178RPM, which I think is the maximum I’ve ever really seen indoors, e.g. when I did a ramp test with a coach I maxed out at maybe 179, but that was two years ago.

My outdoors max (following the British Cycling test protocol for outdoor max HR) was 184RPM which at the time was more or less precisely 220 minus my age!

I’m into week 8 of my training plan. It’s all been on the trainer and I’m not sure how my fitness is progressing. Mostly the plan has centered around longer ride endurance. With some sweet spot workouts a couple of times a week. I did have a slip last weekend where I didn’t feel great and ended up skipping both days. Which I’m pissed off about really. I’d switched plans to reduce the load because I wasn’t recovering as well and those weekend rides were pretty mild intesity. Oh well. Hopefully the weather improves here. The snow has started melting on the trails and it’s been warmer. Usually the trails are dry enough to open around late March, early April. Looking forward to testing myself out there.

First 100k ride of 2021 was today. It was tougher than I thought it’d be, good fun though.

Back on the turbo tomorrow.

Managed to get a heart rate of 209 bpm last night on the turbo. Not sure that is a good thing though.

Blimey Didnthurt, did it hurt? I got to 189 the other day and it did hurt a bit!

Managed to get a heart rate of 209 bpm last night on the turbo.

The cardio-vascular system of an 11 year old! 😉

Strangely no it didn’t hurt. I was doing my fifth 30 second sprint during a 50 minutes zone 2/3 session on the rollers. I noticed that my heart rate was in the 190’s so kind of thought my heart monitor had malfunctioned. So as it was my last sprint I tried to max my effort and watched as my heart rate went over 200. After I saw it had hit 209!

I noticed my heart rate was higher than normal when I got on the bike, just thought it was due to fatigue from my 100km ride the day before.

I’m not planning on doing it again as I think it’s a bit dangerous.

I’ve also the strength of an eleven year old 😭

I’m coming to the end of my first 4 week of training and am a little undecided on my next 4 week block.

Would anyone like to share their plans so I can check that I’m not biting off more than I can chew.

@whitestone did you get an invite to the TR beta yet? I got mine overnight. My levels are pretty low at the moment as I have done Zwift races Tuesdays and Thursday nights which it doesn’t account for on top of the training stuff but I think a few workouts will quickly raise that up as most of the stuff I have planned is stretch or breakthrough that I know that I can complete.

Got a 90 minute threshold workout in the morning so interesting to see what happens to my adaptations.

Not had mine yet.

Currently chilled about it as I’ve a very sore knee – I think I’ve tweaked a cartilage in there, painful just to walk. Not a fan of painkillers but I took some last night to get to sleep.

I get the feeling that the AT will “hone in” on your current level of ability the more data you give it.

Hope you feeling better soon.

Was surprised to get an invite so early thought it might be a month or two.

It also tells me 114 days until Jennride. After the last year 114 days doesn’t feel that far away!

Anybody here listened to the empiricalcycling.com podcasts? Have listened to quite a few now and think they really get to the fundamentals of training and what is actually effective. Well worth a listen although technical at times 😀