Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 64 total)
  • The honeymoon is over, time to apologise…
  • toys19
    Member

    OK I want to apologise to those of you I have clashed with over the Tories, teej et al. I gave them a chance and they have now fianlly pissed me off and made me feel sick. You can rest assured that I will not be showing a pro tory bias unless they change their ways. Many of you will be assured that they never will.
    So who to love next?

    Camerons Position on tough sentencing..

    Premier Icon DaRC_L
    Subscriber

    Sarah Palin? 😯

    McHamish
    Member

    No one really gives a s**t.

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    They’ve just returned to their standard default position. Foaming at the mouth and looking like wild-eyed lunatics.

    Next we can expect a raft of headline grabbing but totally ineffectual and mind-numbingly ill-conceived laws, apparently drafted by a 2 year old ADD

    Meanwhile, as the prisons will now be full of people jailed for text messaging, there’ll be no room for rapists and murderers who will probably get community service orders instead

    So blindingly obvious to anyone whose IQ struggles into double figures. Clearly this discounts most members of the Tory front bench πŸ™„

    Edukator
    Member

    Jeeez, best not visit the UK again. Having stated on STW a few months back that only a revolution would change anything in the UK I can expect to be arrested on surfacing from the tunnel and sent down for four years.

    camo16
    Member

    Don’t give up hope. There is a solution.

    Politics without political parties.

    Think about it.

    Our lives are configurable in almost every respect except politics.

    Case in point: how would you react if Chain Reaction told you your only choice was a blue hybrid or a red single speed (well, there’s a yellow unicycle somewhere out back, too, but no-one’s wanted that since the 30s)?

    Truth is, we’ve been sold a lie for generations. The lie is this:

    You must be left wing or right wing. Therefore you must be a red or a blue (or ride a yellow unicycle that nobody wants and which, to be honest, is falling to pieces).

    If you’re a leftie, you hate Mr. Right. And vice versa. Reds and blues. Toffs and oiks. It’s all a bit schoolyard, isn’t it?

    By reducing political possibilities to two (and a bit) bulk offers, we actually have very little choice – and less choice that’s actually worth having.

    The solution is to devise a political system that sees beyond wings and, like Ronnie Wood, only sees the whole bird.

    Here’s my idea:

    The No Parties Party
    Tough on Political Parties. Tough on the cause of political parties.

    Let the revolution commence.

    uplink
    Member

    OK I want to apologise to those of you I have clashed with over the Tories, teej et al. I gave them a chance and they have now fianlly pissed me off and made me feel sick.

    I wouldn’t concern yourself too much, I suspect if the other lot were in it would make no discernible difference to most ordinary folk.

    The headlines may well be different but the reality wouldn’t

    I suspect if the other lot were in it would make no discernible difference to most ordinary folk.

    Hardly the most convincing argument I’ve heard as to why Tory policies are the best.

    uplink
    Member

    Hardly the most convincing argument I’ve heard as to why Tory policies are best

    They certainly aren’t I never have and never will vote for them but the other lot are so far to the right these days, there’s hardly a difference

    yunki
    Member

    So who to love next?

    Hippies fool!

    Premier Icon oldnpastit
    Subscriber

    So, are the Tories setting these harsh sentences, or the courts?

    I thought the judiciary was supposed to be independent?

    Premier Icon kimbers
    Subscriber

    its ‘back to basics’ innit,
    the stnadard torry mantra when they have no clue how to deal with the common folk of the land

    sobriety
    Member

    the other lot are so far to the right these days, there’s hardly a difference

    Which is the problem with the political system in this country, that and the fact that it’s seriously expensive to start up a new party, especially with the number of candidates that you need to field to stand a chance in the FPTP system…

    camo16
    Member

    Worth pointing out that in the early 1950s the Conservatives had almost 3 million members (now they have just 250,000) and Labour had more than 1 million (166,000 today).

    I’ve never spoken to anyone who admitted to being part of the 250,000 or the 166,000. Anyone on here carry one of them red or blue cards?

    clubber
    Member

    I know a small number of people in each camp. I stick by my mantras of not trusting anyone who’s involved in politics and reckoning that only people who don’t want to be in politics should be allowed to be politicians as nothing I’ve seen of them has come close to changing my mind.

    camo16
    Member

    Thanks clubber – so there are some lurking about then?

    I’m of the opinion that British politics is a modern-day tragedy. Agree that politicians are almost uniformly goat-humpers. But these goat-humpers affect every element of our day-to-day lives… A time’s gotta come when a better, non goat-humping approach wins the day… I hope.

    uplink
    Member

    Anyone on here carry one of them red or blue cards

    I suppose lots [me included] are associated members of the Labour Party

    brooess
    Member

    camo16 has it. When we start thinking for ourselves and stop viewing everything in life through whichever of the 2 party lenses suits our own upbringing/values/prejudices/blindspots/biases/ambitions then maybe we’ll all be a bit more empowered,thoughtful and a bit happier.

    I’ve seen several old friend entirely miss all the opportunities they had to live a fulfilled life because of their political views, it blinded them to all the good stuff and the ability to accept other people as they are.

    Oh and maybe look at our own actions instead of blaming politicians for everything. Do you really think the people you meet who are happy and fulfilled change when the party they don’t agree with comes into power?

    top tip: read the newspaper that suits your politics and then read one which opposes them. And see the difference in the ‘facts’ you’re being fed… you’ll feel better for it…

    toys19
    Member

    reckoning that only people who don’t want to be in politics should be allowed to be politicians

    I agree, same with cops, anyone who wants to be acop should be excluded from doing so.

    Politics and cops should be like jury service, pass an intelligence test and then be forced to serve for a period of time…

    camo16
    Member

    Exactly, brooess.

    Party politics is a great deception in my view. It narrows our thought processes and streamlines attitudes into aggregated blocks, which are labelled accordingly as ‘left’ and ‘right’. Everyone follows suit and, as sheep, repeat the phraseology with pride.

    I don’t want to be left or right. I want life in this country to improve. And that’s where the political party model falls on its backside.

    Ages ago I was going to write an article about this – but was convinced by well wishers that it would be a total waste of time, because nobody would read it.

    These were my issues with our system then. I described them as Seven Deadly Sins:

    1. Tribalism – political Parties and the agglomeration of democracy
    2. Sleight of Hand – the representative democracy that doesn’t represent and isn’t democratic
    3. Grandee-ism – Parliamentary abuses and interaction with the electorate and media
    4. Mendacity – the utility of lying your ass off
    5. Amateurism – public servants (Prime Ministers, Cabinet Members and Back Benchers) with no competence to govern, other than the ability to orate (wow) and a history or law degree
    6. Quick-fix-ism – the expediency of short-term solutions and the problems that beset long-term decision-making in the UK
    7. Thinking β€˜Big – the globalising political direction; which organisations/agencies make the decisions; the disenfranchising of local political democracy/taxation

    Not a best-seller perhaps…

    ourkidsam
    Member

    YES camo & Brooess. I was thinking just yesterday that all parliamentary candidates should be independent, an end to party politics.

    Write that article

    sobriety
    Member

    I’d read it, and I reckon I’d agree with a great deal of it.

    brooess
    Member

    Unfortunately Camo16 what you describe are all the weaknesses/limitations of humans in groups, when power becomes available, and are essentially the human condition. Corporates are the same IME, as are the organised religions. The same mistakes have been made time and time again throughout history…

    You’ll find that all the solutions you think of to these problems are all the things your parents, grandparents, ‘nice’ people, the best of your school teachers, ancient proverbs etc have been telling you for years.

    I’ve come to the conclusion that all I can do is live the best life I can within the framework of the society I find myself in. And if I can help other people do the same, then that’s enough really.

    Oh and when you meet the manipulators, psychos, insecure and selfish types, run very fast in the opposite direction. but when you find nice, generous, nice people, stick to them like glue…

    I was thinking just yesterday that all parliamentary candidates should be independent, an end to party politics.

    You can vote for independents right now you know – they aren’t excluded from elections.

    People don’t vote for political parties because they have to, they do it because they want to.

    Every election has its fair share of loony independent candidates.

    camo16
    Member

    You can vote for independents right now you know – they aren’t excluded from elections.

    People don’t vote for political parties because they have to, they do it because they want to.

    Every election has its fair share of loony independent candidates.

    Do people really vote for political parties because they want to? I mean, some might but I’ve never spoken to one who did…

    The argument I hear most often is “I hate the Tories/Labour, but I don’t want to see that other lot in power.”

    In other words, it’s the-best-of-a-bad-lot option.

    Independents lose from the start because nobody believes they can win (so the majority of those who would vote for said Independent do the above), or, even if they think the Independent can win, the victory is purely local and has a negligible effect on a national scene.

    Also, some of the independents probably aren’t loonies. Many of candidates representing the orthodoxy are.

    wrecker
    Member

    I vote for camo16.

    camo16
    Member

    PS: thanks to ourkidsam and sobriety. Someday I may write the article. And politics in this country will change forever.

    Wrecker, thanks for the vote. I won’t let you down – until I become PM, after which I will probably pull your pants down. Sorry, but that’s human nature. Power corrupts. Come to me, power baby… come to me.

    uplink
    Member

    Do people really vote for political parties because they want to? I mean, some might but I’ve never spoken to one who did..

    If you’ve never met someone who’s a member of a political party or spoken to anyone that voted for who they want, then maybe writing about party politics isn’t for you?

    brooess
    Member

    Pragmatically if you didn’t have parties (and party whips) creating voting blocks you’d struggle to get any laws passed.
    You;d never get 600+ people to agree
    have you ever tried getting 12 friends to agree on a restaurant bill?

    I read some research a few years ago which said the big change from the early to late 20th century in politics was in the early years, no-one trusted politicians but they did defer to them (and authority generally). In the later years (post-Punk?) they still didn’t trust them, but no longer deferred.
    so kind of same old same old tbh

    camo16
    Member

    Good point, uplink. Think I’ll stick to chatting on the forum and generally making a nuisance of myself…

    Maybe I talk to the wrong people. Some of them come from a bad background. Many have no suitable father figures…

    Are you one of the right people? Do you believe in a political party? If so, why?

    Independents lose from the start because nobody believes they can win

    Er no, independents can win if enough people vote for them, and sometimes they do. The reason independents rarely win is that generally no one wants to vote for them.

    some of the independents probably aren’t loonies

    And Carlsberg is only probably the best lager in the world.

    uplink
    Member

    Do you believe in a political party? If so, why?

    Not any more, they kicked what enthusiasm I had out of me a long time ago

    Premier Icon cynic-al
    Subscriber

    You didn’t piss me off but I accept the apology.

    I thought this was to be about “classifieds-gate”

    tops 5
    Member

    Phew!! read the title and thought you were gonna tell us your Covert is sh1t! πŸ™‚

    wrecker
    Member

    Wrecker, thanks for the vote. I won’t let you down – until I become PM, after which I will probably pull your pants down

    Sounds alright actually. πŸ˜€

    druidh
    Member

    Two parties? Try moving to Scotland. At least there’s a credible left-of-centre alternative.

    Premier Icon cynic-al
    Subscriber

    There is?

    theboatman
    Member

    Hmmm, the Tories get into power and then act like Tories, not much surprise really.
    I think you should apologies to yourself for wasting precious time involved in totally pointless debate on here.

    b1galus
    Member

    Two parties? Try moving to Scotland. At least there’s a credible left-of-centre alternative.
    Traditionally the Scottish labour party was also left of centre but now that it is run from englandshire it must toe the party line sadly , however i reckon eck is daein’ a grand job

    Edukator – Member

    Jeeez, best not visit the UK again. Having stated on STW a few months back that only a revolution would change anything in the UK I can expect to be arrested on surfacing from the tunnel and sent down for four years.

    The way i read that it sounded like you were just going to walk through. Apparently getting on the train with a ticket and ID/passport helps. πŸ˜€

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 64 total)

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