The F1 Thread…

the rest of the field will have to raise their game a lot or this will the most one sided championship ever. 7 seconds lead in 2 laps after the safety car restart !!!!

It’s gotta go some to beat the MP4/4 – won all but one race in it’s season, both cars lapped the rest of the field.

Feel sorry for Williams who pretty much got stiffed by the safety car – but finally some good news for Ricciardo.

JCL – Member
Sooooooo why didnt Lewis get investigated then? Who were the Stewards this time? Ex-racing drivers or expert JCL?
I think the Stewards probably were shocked that team mates were actually really racing to think about anything. I don’t think it was crazy on Hamiltons part, just a bit much at this stage of the season.
POSTED 1 HOUR AGO #

I think both Merc drivers have known since pre season testing that the WC will be between them only, and therefore trying to assert dominance over the other from the off. It was hard, but fair, from Lewis IMO, but then he was racing his main championship rival.

It was a classic motor race, more of the same for the rest of the season please.

somehow the rule of “give the car space if they are alongside” did not apply to Lewis in this race….
Also, regarding Lewis and his 7 second lead, actually the safety car helped him immensely because he was on the older tyres and they helped him to keep them cool for a good few laps – otherwise Nico would have bridged that gap easily with or without the safety car – he could close up on Lewis at will after the safety car it was only because he didnt want to have both cars touch he never made it passed, where as Lewis was quite at ease at pushing his teammate off the track at many a corner.

Regardless , It does setup a good fight between them as they are very evenly matched and the team allow racing – otherwise it would be 1 car out front all the time winning *cough*webber*cough*

McLaren – they have the frikin Merc engine thats in the others and all they can manage is grappling after 4th/5th/6th spots, that is not McLaren, getting passed by Force India is not McLaren.

I think my launch control needs a little more work.

Superb drive by Hamilton. To keep Rosberg behind on faster tyres was very impressive. He simply out-drove and out-raced him.

pushing his teammate off the track at many a corner

what? This is either a troll or you don’t know racing…

I dunno a couple of times Rosberg was alongside and had to back out when Hamilton cut across the track.

Nah, seemed entirely fair to me.

Amazing race, loved that!

actually the safety car helped him immensely because he was on the older tyres and they helped him to keep them cool for a good few laps –

Er……….

actually the safety car helped him immensely because he was on the older tyres and they helped him to keep them cool for a good few lap

Apart from the fact that they were both racing on new tyres.

he could close up on Lewis at will after the safety car

Err, then why did Lewis pull out over a second gap with about 4 laps to go? I’ll tell you why, because the softer tyre only has a time advantage for about 4 or 5 laps and then they equalise. The TV producer stopped following the Mercs in the end because there was nothing going on as the gap was not changing.

I was really annoyed last night – I was watching it via my Virgin Tivo Box on cable and with about 8 laps to go the signal became really erratic, then suddenly it was just a lap to go so I missed the duelling between Hamilton and Rosberg! I was screaming at the set!

weve signed vettel,

Vettel would not be going to Ferrari to pick up more championships, would he?

He’d have a better company car but I think the chances of more wins would keep him at Red Bull for a while longer.

If Ferrari are doing well all the top drivers want to go there – winning for Ferrari seems to be special.

If Ferrari aren’t doing well all the top drivers want to go to Ferrari to do a Schumi – rebuild the team and win, because winning for Ferrari seems to be special.

So I don’t see the current (ongoing, multi year) dip in their fortunes as any reason why Vettel wouldn’t go there.

the gap widened because as i said, Nico decided it was not worth crashing in the OTT defending of lewis, instead he towed the team line and just let lewis win.

Good race! Plenty of action, for a change.

What I don’t like, is the safety car. The teams put a load of effort in getting the car to a particular position for a particular strategy and then someone has a ding and it messes it all up. Surely it wouldn’t be too difficult to make the cars hold relative position, +/- a second or so behind the safety car so that you don’t get the bunching and resultant problems for teams whose while strategy has gone out the window because someone else has crashed.

[quoteSurely it wouldn’t be too difficult to make the cars hold relative position, +/- a second or so behind the safety car so that you don’t get the bunching and resultant problems[/quote]
+11111111.5 I have always wondered why they don’t do that

So, my big question from this race is this: Is Vettel actually not that good after all, or was his car having problems that Ricciardo’s didn’t?

Is Vettel actually not that good after all?

Completely outshone by Ricciardo in the same car, he qualified 3rd as opposed to Vettel 11th, even Raikkonen and Alonso both in very slow cars qualified ahead of Vettel.

Like many modern drivers very fast in fast car and lucky to get a 6th place finish albeit with the help of safety car

Vettel said early on that his DRS wasn’t working.

For those saying Hamilton was OTT – should he have yielded if a RB was trying to get past? No. He’s racing for the WC – the only place he forced Rosberg out (and he did this legally, by holding the racing line) was where he knew Rosberg could safely leave the track (not sure what turn it was). The rest was just brilliant defending/racing.

the safety car so that you don’t get the bunching and resultant problems
+11111111.5 I have always wondered why they don’t do that

Because it would be dull.

Sure it might not be “fair” that you can lose a big advantage but it is exciting. Some of the best races are those where we see people out of sync with “the plan”, either due to a saftey car, rain, an issue in quali etc.

Life’s not fair, get used to it.

Nico Rosberg:

“At no time were we at risk of taking both cars out. There was always the necessary margin. It might not have looked like it on TV but there was. It was good racing.”

BBC Sport

The safety car is one of the big wild cards of Formula 1, along with things like the weather, reliability issues and Pastor Maldonado. It can make or break a race: sometimes it means the wrong car wins, other times (like this one) it shows how good a driver the winner really is

Qualifying performance so far (based on times only):

Ricciardo- 2nd, 5th, 3rd
Vettel – 13th, 2nd, 11th

Considering he’s a four time world champ, he’s not exactly storming ahead of his teammate is he?

Safety Car was great addition to yesterday race bunched everyone up and provided 12 laps of wheel to wheel racing.

Maybe F1 should be more like BTTC with success ballast and random safety cars for any old reason to bunch up the field near the end of races.

Considering he’s a four time world champ, he’s not exactly storming ahead of his teammate is he?

I’m guessing its the age old feeling comfortable with a setup/car. It could be this AND its started doubt in his mind- his motivation. Next it’ll be a sabbatical I bet. Hes overdue one after four titles.

I have to admit I’m surprised. I never thought that Ricciardo shone that much when he was at Torro Rosso, and I’d assumed that Vettel was made of stronger stuff than this. I suspect it will all change as the season progresses, but for now it is quietly satisfying to see the finger-boy getting taken down a peg or two

Yes it was a great race. I’m struggling to remember a better one since Button won from last place in Canada 2011.

Thought the racing was exciting but fair

Must same I’m impressed by Ricciardo. He could have justifiably been rather whiny about his luck so far but he has just put his head down and got on with it. He is proving himself very strongly alonside a multiple world champion.

He is proving himself very strongly alonside a multiple world champion.

Shades of team mates Hamo and Alonso?

Such a good race!

I think Vet is having a bad mojo time at the moment – like Button he’s brilliant in a brilliant car but can’t drive beyond a duff one. If he starts having doubts then he loses it. So a combination of slower car, worse engine, no drs, good new team mate etc is clouding his mind. He needs to turn the targeting computer off.

Ham and Ros were sparkling entertainment, and Ham did an impressive job with a slower set-up – he’s got the upper hand now.

Safety cars are a good ‘what if’ factor. It’s great seeing teams execute their races to a well thought out plan and then having to throw those notes away and go hell for leather at the end. If you get rid of that drama you might as well ask for a roof over the circuit to stop it raining…

I’m guessing its the age old feeling comfortable with a setup/car. It could be this AND its started doubt in his mind- his motivation. Next it’ll be a sabbatical I bet. Hes overdue one after four titles.

Highly doubtful IMO, they say vettel is obsessed by records / statistics (hence the fastest laps at the end of the race that drive the team mad). I reckon he has schumi’s 7 titles firmly in his sights.

I think we’re seeing vettel just not have the rub of the green / adapting to the new car.
A much as I’m pleased to see Ricardo doing well, I think vettel will be on top soon enough.

As much as I like the unpredictability of the weather/a pit-stop mistake etc. I don’t get the same thing with the safety car.

It just undoes certain people’s hard work and elevates other people to positions of advantage. Take Button for example yesterday. He was on the harder tyre and after the restart got overtaken by 3 cars who were on the the softer tyre who got them up to temp quicker and were able to mug him.

Yeah, I know that the weather can do the same thing to mess up strategies etc., but for me it seems different.
As soon as I see a safety car, I switch off a bit as it messes things up.
But, also having said that….some of the racing in the final laps was pretty good!

If they wanted to preserve the gaps held before a safety car they could just note the gaps recorded on the last lap or sector, then add them on again as a virtual position once they restart.

It’s not like the teams don’t have the ability to tell their drivers that they not only have to get past, but that they need to build x gap in front to take the place. The coverage would be able to report on the progress on the virtual position just as they do now on the actual timings and splits.

It could even make it quite interesting where the rebunching from the safety car means there’s additional overtaking required to make the virtual pass for position.

That said, I doubt they’d ever do it for the reasons others have suggested, but I think my suggestion would be easier and fairer than trying to get drivers to maintain gaps behind a safety car. Quite apart from the fact that they’ll extract any competitive advantage they can out of any ruling, there’s all that braking, accelerating, and swerving they do to maintain heat in the tyres and try and get a run on each upon the restart.

It just undoes certain people’s hard work and elevates other people to positions of advantage. Take Button for example yesterday. He was on the harder tyre and after the restart got overtaken by 3 cars who were on the the softer tyre who got them up to temp quicker and were able to mug him

Look at it a different way.

Rosberg knew if he followed Hamilton’s strategy he had no chance of getting the win. But there was a slim chance that if he took the harder tyre in the middle stint he could had the chance of a saftey car and his earlier decision making giving him a chance of the overtake.

It was his hard work a quick thinking that gave him the chance of the win, not the safety car. The safety car is just part of racing and without those external factors you may as well have a time trial.

They could have a switch they have to trigger (like the pit lane entry one) that restricts their speed in the event of a safety car so they maintain gaps. The speed would be set before each race to be one that is optimal for the circuit.

On Vettel/Ricciardo – remember that a lot of Vettel’s margin over Webber was (allegedly) down to his ability to exploit the extra downforce from blowing the diffuser mid corner, which is something Webber never really mastered. The rule changes this year mean that technique isn’t effective and maybe Vettel is taking time to adjust to that, or maybe he’s just not that good without it.

On adding gaps after a safety car – this used to be the way that interrupted races were run, using total aggregate race time to determine results rather than just restarting from scratch. It was as confusing as hell to watch so they dropped it, with good reason.

You lot are trying to solve a problem that no one else thinks is a problem!

When there’s an SC is that car’s job to dictate the pace of the field, especially through danger areas, and to control what’s going on. They want the pack bunched up so it’s easier to manage and go racing again.

If they had switches that dictated their speed limit and so on then there would still be racing going on, which is exactly what the SC is there to stop (although Vettel did run into the back of Webber that time…).

jfletch – Member

Look at it a different way.

Rosberg knew if he followed Hamilton’s strategy he had no chance of getting the win. But there was a slim chance that if he took the harder tyre in the middle stint he could had the chance of a saftey car and his earlier decision making giving him a chance of the overtake.

It was his hard work a quick thinking that gave him the chance of the win, not the safety car. The safety car is just part of racing and without those external factors you may as well have a time trial.

True.
Still don’t like it, but that’s probably just me. 🙂

Not sure I can think of any other ‘external factors’ where the cars are artificially bunched up.

If they had switches that dictated their speed limit and so on then there would still be racing going on

No there wouldn’t, they could only go at (say) 60mph, no quicker, no slower. They can’t race if they are all going at the identical speed.

Vettel is a fantastic driver. He excelled in the teams he was in before he joined RB.

I’m not his greatest fan, but it’s way off the mark to say he’s only good in a good car.
You might want to believe it, but it doesn’t make it so.

Cracking race, they even sounded good (possibly aided by the soundbar plus woofer admittedly)!

Only one concern – 3s a lap fast than 3rd place!? That’s got shades of Williams dominance in the early nineties. If things in the main field return to normal, and Mercedes feel the need to apply team orders, it could end up very dull

the gap widened because as i said, Nico decided it was not worth crashing in the OTT defending of lewis, instead he towed the team line and just let lewis win

Yeah right. Given that he had faster tyres (for about 5 laps) and the benefit of DRS for the whole race, he should have been able to get past Hamilton fairly easily IF he was quicker. Hamilton did nothing wrong and there were no team orders.