For our use case it splits the difference between a mobility scooter and a car (I think my mil driving is terrible, not age related she is just terrible but the risk is reduced with a max 28mph).

Oops.
i3 must have got its wires crossed – poor guy had only had it a few days!

I understand a full UK driving license is required to drive one here.

I would gladly drive one and I hope this (obvs many variations of) is closer to the future of individual transport in cities etc as oppose to large multi tonne EV’s produced by the usual planet killers, Audi, Land Rover, Mercedes, Ford etc.

Thanks molgrips, also looking at Ioniq due to CCS but the challenge I have is that I have no car at all currently, so need to find something available now. The range looks about the same, but the bigger battery ionics are a good bit more expensive than the leaf.

Thought about renting an EV on a monthly basis? It’s what we’re doing while we wait for our cars to be built and delivered.

http://www.on.to

Includes insurance, maintenance, recovery etc and also includes free leccy at Instavolt, BP and Shell chargers of any kind. 1000 mile limit per month but you can add mileage top ups. Monthly contract so just hand back once you found something.

Got a £50 quid voucher code off the 1st month if anyone interested in this route.

The range looks about the same, but the bigger battery ionics are a good bit more expensive than the leaf.

You are looking at buying? The range is better on the Ioniq by a bit, however Hyundais stand a good chance of being able to actually get that range, more so than other brands. We get more than the WTLP on urban or suburban driving, sometimes quite a bit more; but less on 70mph motorways. On A roads we get about the same as WTLP.

Was looking at buying / PCPing, however Larry Lambs idea of the monthly rental has just thrown me a big curveball. Currently feeling like being rushed into something, but that would buy the time to look at lease / PCP on new. Even though its more than a monthly payment on a purchase would be, it buys time for not much more than a weeks Fiat 500 rental has just cost me.

Larry – I would love to take you up on that voucher please.

I’m not quite sure how to message you though!

Thanks Molgrips – interesting to hear real world tales of range. Bumped into someone at lunch who has the exact leaf I was looking at – similar tales of better real world range in summer and slightly less (but not too bad) in winter.
The Chademo charger availability still worries me a bit. Going to try and get a drive in a Hyundai in the next couple of days

Looking at dropping £10k on a used Leaf soon

Anyone got fitted one of these bike rack only tow bars to a leaf? I see they are just a tow bar but with a lump on the ball as they are not type approved for towing.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/283596438914

Any better EVs under £10k for bike people?

Larry – I would love to take you up on that voucher please.

The code is b3c6c

Anyone can use it for the 1st months rental.

If you go ahead, then I recommend getting some rental car hire excess insurance. The Onto excesses are £1000 per claim or £500 for windscreen.

https://www.insurance4carhire.com/product-options get the annual Europe insurance.

For £47 you can claim up to £6500 in a year. Just gives you peace of mind, we are probably going to have our EV with Onto for 4/5 months so it’s worth it we think.

If Onto dont have the car you want, check everyday the stock is regularly updated and depends on when folk hand their cars back or they get new motors in the fleet.

interesting to hear real world tales of range

Yeah I haven’t done it in winter yet. The WTLP range in the Ioniq corresponds to 4.8kWh going by the advertised battery size. On a wet windy day around 13C on motorway it ended up being about 4.4, that was the worst I’ve seen. I’ll post back in 6 months 🙂

Hard to tell how much of a pain CHAdeMO will be longer term. Before Gridserve took over from Ecotricity it was an advantage, the old units all had the connector and were mostly reliable using it, while CCS was rarer and much less reliable. The initial phase of replacements has it the other way, so at most a third of connectors are CHAdeMO. Hopefully the next phases of expansion (6-12 more at each site) will keep up that sort of ratio.

Off the motorway and with other providers (Ionity apart) it’s pretty well catered for still. Instavolt, Osprey, MFG, Shell, BP and others are still putting CHAdeMO on every rapid, for now at least. The ratio of cars to chargers is much better for CHAdeMO than CCS today, and all of those are still rolling out aggressively. They’ll surely hit a point where they ratio it like Gridserve though.

I’ve just ordered a Leaf e+ regardless. I liked it more than the others I tried, the deals are really good (reviews compared to Model 3, but it’s cheaper now than most supermini EVs), spacious enough with a big boot for proper family car duties, really well built (in the UK too), and with 200+ real world miles of range it’ll be a rarity I need to rapid charge it anyway.

If you are going to get a home fast charger then consider one without a tethered lead because if you change car from CHAdeMO to a CCS later you won’t have the phaff of changing a tethered lead. I went with a tethered CCS charger because I have no intention of ever buying a CHAdeMO equipped car.

You won’t have either at home unless you’re on a V2G trial with a special unit, home charging is usually AC. I think everything new including the Leaf uses type 2 for AC charging now. Old shape Leaf is type 1.

I think most people should get tethered type 2 these days unless you think you’re likely to charge a type 1 at some point (visitors, or maybe an old Leaf as a runabout), or might need the flexibility of using a longer lead to save shuffling cars about on the drive.

Kia eNiro arrived last Friday on a 3 year lease.
Not quite as well equipped as the (now departed) L&K Yeti but we were ready for a change and this has adaptive cruise control so I’m happy (i only tend to do the long motorway drives).

Fully expecting to see 200-250miles out of it.

The Hyundai Ioniq 5 does look lovely

I was parked next to one yesterday. They are a lot larger in real life. This one was a dark matt grey. Very good looking car

I’ve been somewhat underwhelmed by the Ioniq 5 in the metal. The Mustang Mach E however is much nicer when it’s in front of you.

I don’t fancy the Mach E interior though. Just whacking a huge tablet in the middle doesn’t feel well designed to me.

Any reason, other than soul crushing dullness, why I shouldn’t buy an MG5 EV long range?

Looks interesting. To me it could suit my mother in law who may be moving close by. Good for around town but not up to visiting us.

Do they do one with 4 mile range?

Oops.
i3 must have got its wires crossed – poor guy had only had it a few days!

Someone will be along soon to remind us that you’re just scaremongering and this never ever happens in Europe and you’re making it up and something about IC cars going on fire very regularly.

Any reason, other than soul crushing dullness, why I shouldn’t buy an MG5 EV long range?

Well, the outside is dated and dull but the interior’s alright. The only other downside is 100kW charging which is quite slow for a big battery. Reviews also say it’s a bit wallowy to drive although comfy. But in fairness, it doesn’t look half bad for what is essentially the bottom of the market.

The Mustang Mach E however is much nicer when it’s in front of you.

That was top of my list, but the pesky dog put paid to that. Apparently it would be cruel to transport him in that silly little boot 🙄

You won’t have either at home unless you’re on a V2G trial with a special unit, home charging is usually AC. I think everything new including the Leaf uses type 2 for AC charging now. Old shape Leaf is type 1.

Yup you are quite right I forgot that CHAdeMO would never be used for home charging as CHAdeMO cars have a separate Type 2 socket.

Any reason, other than soul crushing dullness, why I shouldn’t buy an MG5 EV long range?

We test drove one. I’d agree it’s pretty good considering it is as molgrips said essentially the bottom of the market. My minor negatives were: I wonder whether it’s a little thirsty for what it is, but from an hour with it I couldn’t say for sure. Also weak regen braking, so I felt it kind of misses out the “one pedal driving” thing, which I like but not everyone cares about. And as an estate it’s at the small estate end of things in terms of boot space, IIRC.

Someone will be along soon to remind us that you’re just scaremongering and this never ever happens in Europe and you’re making it up and something about IC cars going on fire very regularly.

In the same way that others will be along to use it as an excuse for not buying an EV as they’re not safe…

If recent events have taught us anything at all it’s that clickbait media whips people up until tiny, almost insignificant problems are blown well out of proportion…

I wonder whether it’s a little thirsty for what it is, but from an hour with it I couldn’t say for sure

The review I saw said it was between 3.5 and 3.7 m/kWh in their test. Which isn’t terrible but isn’t great.

I don’t fancy the Mach E interior though. Just whacking a huge tablet in the middle doesn’t feel well designed to me.

This put me off a little too, but at least it has a proper dash with some instruments, some buttons and some manual control. It’s not ALL through the tablet like a Model 3. It also (to my eyes) looks better integrated with the manual wheel control etc.

I’d need a weekend test drive to see if it would work for me.

In other news, there’s a Passat-shaped saloon EV being tested by EV, expected in 2023. This would be cool.

My real sadness with EVs is that they will likely see off the Wagon (estate car). The large battery under the floor and the motors under the boot don’t really lend themselves to a very svelte architecture with a low sill and a flat floor. Only the Taycan Sport Tourismo so far looks good.

The VW Aero B, Passat sized, was an estate as a concept car and I am really interested how this turns out. The saloon version looks quite large. I expect it to be expensive though with a price 10k above the ID.4. But I think we will see Estates especially considering how popular the MG 5 has been. And I will be testing the Euro MG 5 as soon as it is here early next year.

My ideal car just does not exist yet and I think I will have to wait for 2 or 3 years until it does:

1. Mid sided Estate (Octavia, Focus size)
2. AWD (Living in Austrian Alps with snowy steepish access to home)
3. Vehicle to Home/Grid (Once or twice a year we lose power for a day or two after a storm)
4. Tow Bar

Skoda has said they will produce and Electric Octavia in a few years so this would be perfect once they have the X version.

A low profile EV require a really long wheelbase in order to get the batteries between the wheels and the motors in front of and behind the battery pack. Otherwise you have to either stack the battery/the motors or both, which is why you end up with an increased height profile and a really high boot floor. The Taycan skateboard is a good example of how it can be done but it’s 5M long and 2M wide.

mrchrispy
Full Member
Kia eNiro arrived last Friday on a 3 year lease.
Not quite as well equipped as the (now departed) L&K Yeti but we were ready for a change and this has adaptive cruise control so I’m happy (i only tend to do the long motorway drives).

Fully expecting to see 200-250miles out of it.

I’ve got the Soul same battery and drivetrain and I’m getting 260 at the moment but I’m not the most economical driver. A work colleague has the eNiro and drives a lot more sensible than me and the other week he got just over 300 on a charge. In winter with the heating on mine dropped down to 220/230 miles which is still more than enough for 99% of the journeys I do which is mainly a mix of country roads, dual carriageways, and occasional motorway.

My real sadness with EVs is that they will likely see off the Wagon (estate car). The large battery under the floor and the motors under the boot don’t really lend themselves to a very svelte architecture with a low sill and a flat floor. Only the Taycan Sport Tourismo so far looks good.

My hope is that with the flexibility of battery/motor packaging we get some variety of designs beyond skateboard style. Porsche have been talking about their “e-core” designs for electric sportscars, where you can’t be putting batteries under seats because you want them really low. Motors can be compact (the VW ID.3 one can apparently fit in a sports bag), battery modules can go anywhere.

Trouble is, the estate is dying fast even in ICE form so this is likely to be a small niche to sell to. I don’t like it, but the crossover SUV is now the default choice for most families.

Daffy
Full Member
My real sadness with EVs is that they will likely see off the Wagon (estate car). The large battery under the floor and the motors under the boot don’t really lend themselves to a very svelte architecture with a low sill and a flat floor.

Would they/could they not just stick the motors in the front & have it FWD only, to create more boot space, then spread the batteries out under the floor pan?
Or are all EVs going RWD/AWD?
I’d have thought the bit at the front where the engine used to be would be perfect for whacking a couple of motors, and they can’t get rid of that area completely because it must be needed for crash safety (crumple zones etc.)

(I am not a car designer 🙂 )

The drive train is in the front where the engine normally goes and the other gubbins needed to make it go.

Kia eNiro arrived last Friday on a 3 year lease.
Not quite as well equipped as the (now departed) L&K Yeti but we were ready for a change and this has adaptive cruise control so I’m happy (i only tend to do the long motorway drives).

Fully expecting to see 200-250miles out of it.

I’ve got the Soul same battery and drivetrain and I’m getting 260 at the moment but I’m not the most economical driver. A work colleague has the eNiro and drives a lot more sensible than me and the other week he got just over 300 on a charge

Kia Soul here and we were generally seeing 290, since then we’ve ended up leaving it in ECO with regen set to level 3 and getting nearer 310.

My wife gets less MPG than me in an ICE car but very similar miles per KW in the Soul, assume is the recuperation of all the energy she used to waste accelerating harder. I am not slow but anticipate traffic very well and tend to eke a lot of MPG out of ICE cars, this just does not seem to matter so much in an EV.

Would they/could they not just stick the motors in the front & have it FWD only, to create more boot space, then spread the batteries out under the floor pan?
Or are all EVs going RWD/AWD?
I’d have thought the bit at the front where the engine used to be would be perfect for whacking a couple of motors, and they can’t get rid of that area completely because it must be needed for crash safety (crumple zones etc.)

(I am not a car designer 🙂 )

I’d have thought this very possible. My tesla has a deep storage compartment below boot floor at the back that goes down pretty low, like spare wheel compartment low, but it doesn’t stretch far forward because of rear motor. Take out the rear motor and Bob’s your uncle.

On pure “use of space” terms I reckon a tesla S or 3 layout without rear motor could be made into a low boot floor estate.

The review I saw said it was between 3.5 and 3.7 m/kWh in their test. Which isn’t terrible but isn’t great.

About the same as my experience. I just thought a car of that size ought to be at least 10% better, which is significant in range terms. For same driving (pretty slow, generally, summer, so good conditions for good consumption) it is pretty easy to achieve the same numbers in a big heavy Model S, which has worse consumption figures than cars from the likes of Hyundai that I’d see as more direct comparisons to the MG.

Would they/could they not just stick the motors in the front & have it FWD only, to create more boot space, then spread the batteries out under the floor pan?

Well some cars do – my Hyundai is front wheel drive and has motors in the front. But the actual motor is quite small – it also has an inverter, which is big, and other gubbins like the cabin fan, heat pump, A/C, brake vacuum pump, radiator (it still has one) and a load of stuff I don’t recognise. And still quite a bit of spare space. But then, that car is also available with an ICE so has been designed with a large bonnet.

There’s still plenty of need to put things somewhere other than motors, and as said you need crumple zones. Interesting discussion though. I don’t know why they are making RWD EVs. Perhaps it’s because they want to even out the weight distribution more. The Hyundai has pretty soft springs and is comfy, but it doesn’t roll any more than a normal standard car and it turns in amazingly quickly because there’s so little weight up front.

So no huge show-stoppers for the MG which is good to hear.

Dated exterior I can live with, slowish charging won’t be a huge issue as I’ll be charging overnight at home 99% of the time.

In terms of range V load carrying ability V price it seems the best option I’ve seen so far.