The UK is now set to be net carbon zero by 2050. According to the CCC (Committee on Climate Change), assuming that the rest of the world follows suit, this gives us a “greater than 50% chance” of averting climate catastrophe. The government has, this year, missed 24 of its own 25 climate targets. According to the CCC’s ‘Greenhouse Development Rights’ method, the UK really needs to reach net carbon zero by 2033.

Why is the country dragging its feet? Is the climate emergency not perceived as a real or something to care about?

There is a large part of the population that currently don’t even “believe” in climate change.

Then there are those that do but think “what can I do?”

Then there are those that think, “ok, but I won’t be around by the time things go really bad.”

Add in the usual human selfishness and greed and we are pretty much screwed.

I don’t think most people will really wake up to things until their lives are directly threatened by it. Not in 50 years but in 5 days/ 5 hours. Even then many will choose to ignore it.

I console myself with the knowledge that the planet will continue with or without us. Life will endure and hopefully it evolves into a better model of sentience than humans seem to be able to attain.

We are/ were an interesting experiment in controlled chemistry though.

I care. Although clearly not quite enough to fully appreciate what I, as an individual, can do to affect what appears to be a spreadsheet exercise of counting carbon somethings.

Unless of course I further reduce my meat consumption to once a week? It’s about three times a week at the moment I suppose.

I often wonder why there isn’t a national tree planting program? Obviously, not the Laylandi weed type, but mixed indigenous species and if we’re paying farmers anyway…

I’m unable to afford to buy an electric car but don’t do that many road miles anyway and not convinced that getting rid of a perfectly useable car and replacing with a new item that has to be built would be carbon neutral or whatever anyway.

I live in rented accommodation so sticking Celotex or Kingspan to the outside of the house might not go down too well and there’s a carbon cost in producing that insulation anyway, would that eventually be offset by the small reduction in heating oil I use to heat the house? My loft is well insulated and plastic windows are fitted.

Nowadays I rarely fly from one country to another, perhaps once a year max.

What else, as an individuals can we practically do to have a positive impact on carbon offsetting/reduction? Or is it all just a numbers on a spreadsheet exercise?

The only party that would put anywhere near enough effort into it is the Green Party. Seeing that they got 2.7% of the vote then I would take that as people having it VERY low down on their priority.
It will only increase when there is direct impact combined with then being heavily sold it in the way they were heavily sold why Brexit needs to happen. Difference is, the climate actually matters…

Why is the country dragging its feet? Is the climate emergency not perceived as a real or something to care about?

No, they don’t give a shit. They’ve just voted in a govt that

missed 24 of its own 25 climate targets

Says it all.

End of thread.

Isn’t it industry that needs to change most anyway? I thought the actions of individuals was just the ‘marginal gains’ of eco-friendliness?

For us to change would cost a lot (ditch diesel SUV we were gifted by in-laws, replace with expensive electric car and £15k of solar panels) but also require us to give up almost everything we enjoy and subsist on local, seasonal produce (root veg, er… that’s it!). Hard to do when the neighbours will all be just carrying on as normal.

Would require concerted political action around the globe, so basically climate change is happening, get used to the idea.

I do, we’ve made quite a few changes, not enough though.
I ignore Christmas it is an abomination of epic proportions, grown adults buying each other landfill fodder and gorging themselves into a post festivity obesivic guilt trip, pathetic.
I await the January gym, running, weight loss threads.
DON’T EAt tHat CrAp in The FIrSt pLaCe.

Yes, enjoying ourselves is wrecking the planet, ban it I say.

You’re welcome.

I care. Although clearly not quite enough to fully appreciate what I, as an individual, can do to affect what appears to be a spreadsheet exercise of counting carbon somethings.

The thing is, unless the solution is driven by worldwide governments policy, then all of the well meaning individual acts count for **** all. I think actually voting for the green party is now worth more to future generations than all the acts of environmental protection we can make as individuals.

I REALLY care and have done as much as I can over the past year to reduce my carbon footprint. I changed roles at work to reduce my flights from ~20 a year to less than 5. Reduced my families transport fuel consumption from 17000 miles to 2630. Have replaced every bulb in the house with LED. Systematically worked my way around the house plugging drafts and properly insulating and thermal curtains. Solar panels go in in March next year along with a Powerwall and triple glazing on the front windows.

Meat consumption is low and mostly chicken and fish.

We recycle almost everything and repair where possible rather than replace and won’t buy disposable rubbish as toys, gifts etc.

We’re trying, we really are. I just wish everyone would give the same thought to it.

Our only hope really is that technology will save us

I think many people believe it will and so do nothing. Electric cars are just making people think they can buy their way forward.

It’s basically selling us more shit. We’re never going to change and we’re in for some incredibly dark times. Glad I don’t have kids to be honest… 😐

I care as a parent and bacause I feel a responsibility to less fortunate around the globe. But its all a bit paternalistic.

The election however has confirmed that at least half the population are poorly educated gullible fools, likely racist too, so I’m struggling to come up with a reason to care about them.

So I’m verging on saying sod it, the planet will reecover whatever, let humans die out.

Going vegan and stopping flying are the two most effective things we can do. Not easy, but not that difficult either.
Personally, I’ve started to commute by train and use an electric car for shorter journeys. The house is already insulated to the max and we are on 100% green energy tariff. My biggest failure is skiing holidays. Looking at ways to practically get to the alps from Scotland for a week’s trip without flying or taking 2 days in each direction.

If you ask people “Do you care about the environment?” Nearly all will reply yes.

If you were then to ask them what steps they’ve taken to back up that action, most people will reply that they recycle and “try to do their bit” , which in reality means very little.

Is the climate emergency not perceived as a real or something to care about?

Sadly the level of inconvenience it takes to reduce personal emissions is simply too high for people it seems. And business will not do anything that puts them at a competitive disadvantage unless forced to.

Isn’t it industry that needs to change most anyway?

It’s society that needs to change wholesale

This report says that to keep this target alive, the world needs to cut emissions by 7.6% every year for the next 10 years.

EU Emissions planned to be cut to 55% of 1990 level

To achieve those goals it’s going to need to be so much more than just scraping out yogurt pots and walking to the shops once a week.

The only 2 ways I can see this happening is either by mass nationalised infrastructure that is invested in heavily by government to go green, or by legislation of a combination of huge widespread tax cuts for green businesses and equally huge penalties for non green businesses and industries.

The timetable for these to be implemented globally seems woefully short, and the fact that so many people seem to be indifferent at best means I see little hope for the future.

Facing Extinction by Catherine Ingram – This blog post is a depressing read, but one I find hard to argue against

I think the enormity of the task ahead is hidden from view. It’s not “lots of people doing small things” it’s “literally everyone doing huge changes”

I found This calculator useful. I’ve entered all my details honestly enough which then made it easier to implement the low hanging fruit of changes that cost the least and have the biggest impact.

Our only hope really is that technology will save us

I think many people believe it will and so do nothing. Electric cars are just making people think they can buy their way forward.

It’s basically selling us more shit.

It really is this. I think too many people think that just around the corner is some technology that will allow for a 1:1 swap for each thing in their lives that will be “green” and that life can continue on as it does now.

Even the phrase “green” I think is misleading and should be banned unless something is actively a net positive for the environment.

A car should only be allowed to be called green if it emits a negative amount of co2.

Otherwise it’s just another thing damaging the environment, albeit slightly less than an ICE car.

We already know a sizeable proportion of the UK population think differently to a lot of people on here. In any event making the UK itself carbon neutral will be pointless unless and until we stop buying more s**t from the places in the world that are the worst polluters…!

I remember first reading about Global Warming in the New Scientist as a school child in the late 70’s, early 80’s. It seemed clear then that something drastic needed to be done, there and then. People have had a lot of time to change their behaviour. I would presume that posters on here are more enlightened than most, but we still have people who ‘have’ to commute 50 miles a day. Frequent posts asking where to fly to for a weekend break etc etc, whilst at the same time people are posting about being flooded out of their homes.
Part of the problem appears to me to be, that the people who contribute most to the problem are those most immune to the resulting consequences.

I really care, I fully recognise that there are lots of other countries doing much worse but I don’t think we can just wait until everyone is on – and then all move together slowly.  Yes we should be doing everything we can as individuals and every small thing that someone does is brilliant but more importantly we need legislation to force the bigger changes.  So I’m really a fan of any sort of action that influences change at a higher level.  That can be changing your bank if your bank is one that invests heavily in fossil fuels (and telling them why you’ve done it),  changing your power provider to a green one or using the ‘green’ supply from your current provider (even if it is more expensive – we know it will be) but more importantly take part in any public actions.   We know that politicians care more about their own chance of election that anything else so they need to see it is something the public care about or it will just be business as usual.

The numbers going around seem to suggest that it only takes 3.5% of the population to be protesting to make the change that is needed.  That has to be within reach

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20190513-it-only-takes-35-of-people-to-change-the-world

For me I think that although the numbers might be wrong, if we get to a point 8 years from now when change is irreversable then there is no way I can look at my kids and tell them I did nothing because I didn’t know,  simples.

I still think forcing everyone to work from home unless they have an absolute concrete requirement to commute in would solve a lot of society’s ills.

Not sure how you replace the social aspect though… pub?

Let’s see…

I grow most of my own vegetables
All water for the garden is rainfall capture
Eggs and meat are sourced locally
I planted 6000 trees before I lost count
Heating is by renewable wood from my own land
I work from home and drive around 2000 miles a year
I haven’t flown for work in over 10 years
I haven’t flown for myself in 14 years
I’ve bought less than a dozen bottles of water in my life
I repair rather than replace
A lot of stuff I make from scrap of things I can’t repair

Do I win the virtue signalling? Or do I have to pretend to care?

Do I win the virtue signalling? Or do I have to pretend to care?

You appear to have done both.  Good start 🙂

You appear to have done both. Good start 🙂

My motivation is purely selfish.

I’m still solidly part of the oil based economy and grateful for all the luxury it brings.

Judging by this thread, not many……

Isn’t it industry that needs to change most anyway? I thought the actions of individuals was just the ‘marginal gains’ of eco-friendliness?

This gets said a lot, but take a step back and think about it.

The oil industry will keep making petrol as long as you want it for your car.

The aluminium industry will keep making aluminium as long as you keep drinking cans.

The farming industry will keep making beef as long as you keep eating steak.

BA will keep flying as long as you keep going to meetings in person.

And so on and so forth.

Industry does not exist in a vacuum.

And your carbon footprint extends a long way past insulating your house and driving an electric car.

I still think forcing everyone to work from home unless they have an absolute concrete requirement to commute in would solve a lot of society’s ills.

My solution (to that) would be an extra 1% on income tax for both individual and company for every 10km a person lived from the place of work. But IMO that also needs a functioning housing market, that is relatively low cost and allows people to make such choices.

The solution is less people. Easily done.

One child voucher per woman. A global exchange where the vouchers can be bought and sold. Money will naturally move to people less able to cope with climate change and population will be quickly reduced.

I’ll take the cash alternative to the Nobel prize.

Many councils are going to start charging companies a substantial tax for every car parking space on their sites.

Many councils are going to start charging companies a substantial tax for every car parking space on their sites.

The final nail in the coffin for the town centre. A good time to invest in business parks though. And concrete or steel manufacture.

How is that green?

I’m wondering if a lot of the reaction is the enjoyment and belonging to a protest movement.

I work in environmental education. As a leading national organisation we’ve offered support and resources, to work with XREducation (and the two other XR school/education ‘groups’). Absolutely no interest in teaching kids in school about anything other than protest and how to protest.
They’ve some education resources, all indoor, PowerPoint or workbook. No firsthand experience of nature or climate. No actually improving thier environment, empowering the children to be the difference – only to protest.
We’ve offered lesson ideas, funding for teachmeets or pedagoo’s, training days. All in major UK cities, particularly London.

That’s through meetings with various angry people. Lots of emails.

It’s a seemingly disorganised group, looking to belong to a protest.

Yet when they hold a teachmeet, they get over 640 teachers attend in London. We and others struggle for 20!

Hmmm

According to the co2 calculator posted above, my 1 flight a year absolutely swamps all my other co2 impacts, and I think I read somewhere that 95% of flights are made by just a few percent of business travelers, so targeting them would clearly have the biggest impact.

Even if as individuals we all forgo our 1 holiday flight a year the impact will be insignificant. The answers are a mass political shift, not being left to the morality of individual choice.

Absolutely no interest in teaching kids in school about anything other than protest and how to protest.
They’ve some education resources, all indoor, PowerPoint or workbook. No firsthand experience of nature or climate. No actually improving thier environment, empowering the children to be the difference – only to protest.

@matt They are right, kind off. It would be good to connect the kids with the reasons for change, but empowering individual actions won’t do anything, apart from a personal feeling of smugness. In fact I am beginning to suspect that policy focusing on peoples individual actions is just a slight of hand to allow the politicians and their backers to make no real changes.

Noone that matters.

One child voucher per woman. A global exchange where the vouchers can be bought and sold. Money will naturally move to people less able to cope with climate change and population will be quickly reduced.

Is that not objectively xenophobic?

sn’t it industry that needs to change most anyway? I thought the actions of individuals was just the ‘marginal gains’ of eco-friendliness?

This gets said a lot, but take a step back and think about it.

The government has introduced a massive road building program, and most people can’t afford an electric car, so of course they are going to buy petrol.

The oil industry can no longer argue that climate change is not happening, so instead, they are blaming individuals, whilst at the same time lobbying government to prevent new regulations and tax.

It can’t be solved by individual actions.

Is that not objectively xenophobic?

What? Helping those that would otherwise die get the money to live and save the world at the same time.

You are right in that any real solution will be too hard and all people want to do is virtue signal.

The good news is that the problem will solve itself. People will die off eventually. Problem solved.

but empowering individual actions won’t do anything, apart from a personal feeling of smugness

So you don’t actually action anything?
All you do is protest?
I’m going to disagree with you.

This gets said a lot, but take a step back and think about it.

The oil industry will keep making petrol as long as you want it for your car.

………

The issue is that for things such as cars, society isn’t set up enough for people to not have one. It’s easier to not have a car if public transport is good, employers let you work from home, school is close etc.

These things are societal level rather than individual. Change needs to come from both the top and the bottom.

Many councils are going to start charging companies a substantial tax for every car parking space on their sites.

The final nail in the coffin for the town centre. A good time to invest in business parks though. And concrete or steel manufacture.

How is that green?

Not all business are in town centres, some are in business parks where they will be taxed too. Unless I’ve misunderstood your point how would this make it more likely to build business parks?

Not all business are in town centres, some are in business parks where they will be taxed too. Unless I’ve misunderstood your point how would this make it more likely to build business parks?

How can a council charge for parking on private property?

If they can, then fair enough. More tax. Then what, spend the new found revenue on extra jollies for the mayor to that twinned town in Brazil?

One child voucher per woman. A global exchange where the vouchers can be bought and sold. Money will naturally move to people less able to cope with climate change and population will be quickly reduced.

Vouchers will move to the rich, increasing the amount of people in rich countries , who emit the most co2 anyway.

People in poor countries will then have no children with all the problems that would bring.

So you don’t actually action anything?
All you do is protest?
I’m going to disagree with you.

Another example, if you look at the German electrify market it is about 20% domestic usage, 30% commercial and 50% industrial (I don’t know how the define the difference between commercial and industrial). And that is by cost, given the discounts available to large scale users the domestic users probably only account for 10% of the electricity used.
For individual users it would take a herculean effort, sacrifice and investment to reduce their electricity usage by 50% and is probably impossibe, but that would only result in a 5% change of electricity generation. Much better to put that investment of time, effort and even finance into affecting change at a political level which will yield much greater results,

Vouchers will move to the rich, increasing the amount of people in rich countries , who emit the most co2 anyway.

The population will hit zero very quickly. At some point no matter how hard the population tries it will be sustainable.

People in poor countries will then have no children with all the problems that would bring.

There will be no poor countries. There will be the newly rich and mobile. As opposed to dead from climate change.

What? Helping those that would otherwise die get the money to live and save the world at the same time.

Becsuse each person in the uk is using something like 5x the sustainable level of resources. The poor people youre trying to “help” by denying them the next generation of doctors, engineers, and everything else in the developing world are probably <<1.

The government has introduced a massive road building program, and most people can’t afford an electric car, so of course they are going to buy petrol.

The oil industry can no longer argue that climate change is not happening, so instead, they are blaming individuals, whilst at the same time lobbying government to prevent new regulations and tax.

Road building is short sighted I agree and government spending is easier to manipulate than the free market so should be investing to offset that not supourt the problems.

Industry on the other hand, how do you propose to stop the production of petrol? Your statement that not everyone can afford an electric car is correct. But that also means not everyone can afford the x00% increace in fuel (used indomestic heating, transport and in the production of goods dont forget) that would be required to force them out of business or to change their business model.

You cant shout at BP that they’re killing the plannet, then fill your car with petrol and go home to a centrally heated house to eat food grown with the use of tractors and fertiliser, cooked in a facrory, packaged in plastics and aluminium, then transported to the supermarket.

Becsuse each person in the uk is using something like 5x the sustainable level of resources. The poor people youre trying to “help” by denying them the next generation of doctors, engineers, and everything else in the developing world are probably <<1.

Either climate change is a problem or it isn’t. No point having more generations who are going to die from climate change.

I do have a plan B. India and Pakistan are very keen to nuke each other. That’s a quick win of a few billion plus a nuclear winter. China vs the US is plan C but that might be a bit much.