Terrorists on a train….

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  • Terrorists on a train….
  • A typical Virgin Pendolino service from Manchester Piccadilly to London Euston can carry 550+ passengers. More than an A320 for example.
    What security is in place to prevent the hijacking of such a train by terrorists? Imagine the carnage that would result from a 120 mph collision with the buffers at Euston? And a locomotive is much easier to drive than an aircraft is to pilot.

    Sorry – I’ve been watching Strikeback and it got me thinking about terrorist plots.

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    Other people control the points though so I think if a train was hijacked it could be diverted away from the station…?

    Premier Icon bearnecessities
    Subscriber

    prevent the hijacking of such a train by terrorists?

    [guffaw]Like FirstGroup you mean?[/guffaw]

    molgrips – Member
    Other people control the points though so I think if a train was hijacked it could be diverted away from the station…?

    True, but if travelling at enough speed, it’s not staying on the rails for long.

    trail_rat
    Member

    watch the movie unstoppable.

    Muke
    Member

    Rubber dinghy rapids, bro 😉

    Premier Icon kimbers
    Subscriber

    Is Casey Ryback on the train?

    Rogan Josh
    Member

    Power cut?

    kimbers – Member
    Is Casey Ryback on the train?

    Never mind that!

    Is there a rather large cake anywhere?

    Pigface
    Member

    How would you get the train to a friendly nation?

    Premier Icon PMK2060
    Subscriber

    Pigface – terrorist don’t always plan on surviving never mind getting back to a friendly nation

    Rogan Josh – that would work!

    Okay – a diesel loco pulling a train instead.

    Houns
    Member

    Wilder and Pryor would save the day

    jon1973
    Member

    Terrorists on a train

    It wasn’t as good as Snakes on a Plane.

    yossarian
    Member

    divert it onto a conveyor belt

    Premier Icon molgrips
    Subscriber

    True, but if travelling at enough speed, it’s not staying on the rails for long.

    Yeah, but forcing a derailment would save more lives than having it smack into the sushi place, Barburrito and the Paddington Hilton at 110mph.

    Alternatively they could get some local kids to nick the signalling cable, whole thing would grind to a halt. Could be a modern version of the Railway Children 🙂

    Houns
    Member

    Oh btw the antidote is in the girls necklace

    (Spoiler for the op there)

    Simply scatter some wet leaves on the line.

    project
    Member

    network control or signal boxes on the route would need be taken control of, to stop them throwing the points and diverting the train,into sidings or accross junctions,to derail it, if it was an electric train, they would just switch off the power and allow it to coast to a stop.

    But there have been various unexplained accidents/collisions on the railways, where the driver was killed, and the controls where set, and no braking took place(names witheld to protect innocent people who died).

    The driver could also isolate the AWS and the new signalling one, so red signals wouldnt require him to cancel the alarm, one train crashed because the AWS was isolated and another reached very high speed after the warning system was tampered with and isolated by a driver recently.

    Any atempt to overspeed into a terminal station would probably triger SPAD alarms, and for the control centre to go into DIXCEL mode, eg running to the bog.

    Markie
    Member

    Alternatively they could get some local kids to nick the signalling cable, whole thing would grind to a halt. Could be a modern version of the Railway Children

    😀

    What security is in place to prevent the hijacking of such a train by terrorists?

    And there are almost 3 million Muslims in the UK !!!

    Surely it’s only a matter of time ?!!!

    Unless of course Muslims are peace-loving people who abhor terrorism. But what are the chances of that? ……. zero from what I’ve read.

    It always made me wonder why the IRA never targeted the transport infrastructure during their naughty days in the 70/80s.

    Clapham Common was a derailed train accident and that was pretty horrific.

    A couple of key road and rail viaducts would probably cause more disruption to more people and create more grumpy members of the public than blowing up shopping centres and remembrance services.

    RDL-82
    Member

    AWS and TPWS as already mentioned would stop the train in the right circumstances but can be both isolated.

    Assuming you could then somehow not get wrong routed to prevent you entering a major station you’d need to know the route so as not to speed and possibly derail.

    Are we also taking the guard out of the equation? Emergency brake in another cab will quiet happily spoil the fun as well as the passengers panicking and pulling a Pass-Com again dumping brakes until reset.

    Could get a bit tedious for them!

    Premier Icon thepurist
    Subscriber

    Any plans involving train drivers would need to get past Bob Crow first – no chance!

    Premier Icon neil the wheel
    Subscriber

    We need giant marshmallows attached to all the buffers.

    project
    Member

    The driver can usually override the pass com, as was shown happenned in the latest RAIB report, into a rail accident, it allows the driver to continue driving till he reaches a place of safety, not on a viaduct or in a tunnel.

    RDL-82
    Member

    Depends on the type of traction though as to how easy that is, but we would be getting into the realms of being fully trained, not outside the realms of possibility of course, but in that case what can you do unless the person is in some way arousing suspicion.

    Premier Icon maccruiskeen
    Subscriber

    The thing with terrorism is – you need to create terror. If you look at the underground bombings, or the madrid train bombing or whatever …. Horrible events in their own right, but not really successful as terrorism – they didn’t terrify us, the next day everyone just carried on using buses trains as usual. Thats because using trains isn’t fundamentally scary. We do lots of things every day that are more dangerous than getting on a plane but flying is still a nervy business, most people fly very rarely, it has always been a very overtly safety conscious environment where you have to rehearse the worse possible outcome with every trip. It takes very little to create terror in that context – So while ‘successful’ attacks on buses and trains have changed pretty much nothing, even thwarted attempts with planes – like a liquid explosives – have radically changed air travel

    Premier Icon darkcove
    Subscriber

    The sheer apathy of the driver would defeat them. “We are hijacking this train!” Driver “grunt” shrugs shoulders.

    Although it has to be said when somebody offers I’m out of the chair and hottailing back to the messroom on the “c” of “can we take this train drive?”

    wrightyson
    Member

    [tannoy] calling John McClane John McClane to the forum please [tannoy]

    those little hammers could prove quite lethal to an unsuspecting terrorist on a train with 500 angry, desperate people.

    brakes
    Member

    I hate it when people use jargon or acronyms when they know other people won’t know what they stand for.
    Yes, I’m looking at you project.

    Premier Icon MoreCashThanDash
    Subscriber

    I’ve always wondered how much chaos could be caused by a team of synchronised suicide truck bombers taking out strategic junctions of the M25….damage the flyovers/bridges, make the roads unusable for weeks/months while it’s repaired. The resultant gridlock would be awful. Like any other Friday night on the M25.

    Premier Icon SaxonRider
    Subscriber

    MoreCashThanDash – Member
    I’ve always wondered how much chaos could be caused by a team of synchronised suicide truck bombers taking out strategic junctions of the M25….damage the flyovers/bridges, make the roads unusable for weeks/months while it’s repaired. The resultant gridlock would be awful. Like any other Friday night on the M25.

    But, being British, we would all just queue up any way. 😐

    Premier Icon njee20
    Subscriber

    I hate it when people use jargon or acronyms when they know other people won’t know what they stand for.
    Yes, I’m looking at you project.

    Rail accident investigation branch.

    There are a massive number of practicalities as said. Easier to take charge, far harder to actually do some damage than hijacking a plane.

    enfht
    Member

    And there are almost 3 million Muslims in the UK !!!

    Surely it’s only a matter of time ?!!!

    Unless of course Muslims are peace-loving people who abhor terrorism. But what are the chances of that? ……. zero from what I’ve read.

    Only 34 Islamist attacks have been thwarted in the UK since 7/7.

    Hey, at least the Marxists aren’t at at too eh Ernest otherwise we’d be in real trouble.

    Only 34 Islamist attacks have been thwarted in the UK since 7/7.

    None of Britain’s 3 million Muslims have managed to get on to trains since 7/7 ?

    It’s stuff like that makes me realise how lucky we are.

    enfht
    Member

    OK thanks for setting the records straight on that one then.

    Tom_W1987
    Member

    Would have thought they could at least put armoured bulkheads and doors on the drivers cabin.

    It’s not that hard to derail a train though, so it won’t stop determined attackers causing a derailment.

    project
    Member

    I hate it when people use jargon or acronyms when they know other people won’t know what they stand for.
    Yes, I’m looking at you project.

    RAIB, rail accident investigation branch, investigates accidents and publishes their reports and recomenndations,

    AWS, automatic warning system that alerts drivers to colour/aspect of signal in front of them, bell and klaxon, now being changed to more electronic sounds,

    TPWS, automatic train protection system, as above but more expensive, both can be isolated by the driver,

    SPAD, signal passed at danger ,eg a red aspect,red signals control the stopping of a train before junctions, the train in front, conflicting movements by other trains, single line workng, and terminal stations and other incidents.

    Passcom, passenger comunication device, either a handle, lever button or chain, used to comunicate to the guard/driver the train needs to be stopped, the driver can over ride the alarm, but should apply the emergency brake in a station environmnet if activated, probably because someone is trapped in a door or fallen under a train.

    cybicle
    Member

    Only 34 Islamist attacks have been thwarted in the UK since 7/7.

    How do you know they were all ‘Islamist’? The actual information on offer in our media claims ’34 terror plots* were thwarted’, and there is no information as to the motivations/culture/religion of the alleged ‘plotters’, so I’m curious as to why you claim that ’34 Islamist attacks* have been thwarted’.

    *’Plot’ and ‘attack’ are different words. Quite an important point, this.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    It’s about symbolism, isn’t it? Like, the Glasgow airport attack, drive an SUV full of “bomb” into an airport. That SUV ended up being, statistically, less deadly than the average one. If you want to kill people with a big car, the best thing to do is just drive at high speed through a pedestrian precinct or mount a load of pavements but that’s just not terrorific enough- they want to attack a big western symbol.

    (I think the randomness of SUV-ramming would be scarier personally, like the american sniper fellers, nowhere’s safe. But I guess it plays less well in terrorism board meetings, everyone’s got their vanity projects.)

    cybicle
    Member

    Terrorific

    *Likes*

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