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  • Talk to me about Keto
  • Premier Icon doomanic
    Full Member

    Anyone on here using keto for diet/ weight management?

    I’m just starting it and would appreciate some pointers.

    Premier Icon yourguitarhero
    Free Member

    Terrible idea.
    Just eat 1800 calories a day and be patient

    Premier Icon hols2
    Free Member

    If you don’t have a legitimate reason to deprive yourself of an entire food group — such as a crippling intolerance to gluten or sporadic, carbohydrate-induced seizing — you’ll likely struggle to embrace this new lifestyle. By struggle, I mean that you’re likely to fail in a big way.

    https://www.thrillist.com/eat/nation/is-keto-diet-bad-for-you-ketogenic-side-effects

    https://bodyforwife.com/keto-is-the-dumb****-diet-cult-du-jour-but-that-wont-last/

    Premier Icon lucky7500
    Full Member

    Just eat 1800 calories a day and be patient

    +1

    This is a good, straightforward explanation of the keto diet.

    Premier Icon darthpunk
    Free Member

    Terrible idea.
    Just eat 1800 calories a day and be patient

    Pretty much what I’ve done since April last year and I’ve lost 4 stone

    Now I enjoy going out on the bike rather than loathing every mile

    Premier Icon MTB-Idle
    Free Member

    I’ve used it twice. It’s very good for losing weight relatively fast. I have no idea of any other issues eating too many proteins/fats etc. may cause depending on your general health or any specific health issues #IANADoctor

    The weight did eventually go back on but it took over 18 months for this to happen because I could only eat about a quarter of the carbs that I used to smash down at a pre-diet mealtime.

    When you first start Keto you piss like a horse and feel very tired/lacking energy. Also as I was still cycling 4 or 5 times a week you feel exhausted as the body isn’t used to not having the carbs to burn.

    After a couple of months you adjust but I definitely lost power and it took a while to get it back.

    YMMV

    Premier Icon Lawmanmx
    Free Member

    Been living in Keto for 6yrs now, it works and it works well, much healthier than pre Keto, Just do it 🙂

    Premier Icon aphex_2k
    Free Member

    An alternative weight loss program is simple ket.

    Premier Icon martinhutch
    Full Member

    I’ve done a couple of proper goes at it, as above, very good at shedding weight quickly, and I never quite got the power back while on the diet, so use it as short-term thing rather than a lifestyle. The weight does creep back on, but that is because I’m a greedy bastard.

    Plus, I found it very hard to stay motivated given the diet restrictions – I can manage a month/six weeks, but then I need some more variety in my diet.

    Premier Icon cromolyolly
    Free Member

    If you aren’t epileptic and a child don’t bother. You probably won’t get any near actual ketosis

    https://www.popsci.com/not-in-ketosis/

    Premier Icon dakuan
    Free Member

    Just another fad quack diet. Mix in some snakeoil CBD for full effect.

    Premier Icon steve-g
    Free Member

    Me and Mrs-g do something of this nature from time to time, as mentioned above its a good way to make a noticeable difference pretty quickly – as also mentioned above its probably not going to turn into long term lifestyle choice so you’ll need to have a plan to maintain your new weight once you tuck back into the carbs.

    First few days are usually tough, then the energy levels come back and you “feel” thinner even though you aren’t due to not being bloated from carbs. You need to be imaginative with the recipes to save yourself from getting too bored of eating similar foods all the time.

    I have been on my latest run of it since new years and have gone from trousers are too tight, to trousers fit, to might need to get a waist size down in the 6 or 7 weeks that is has been so far.

    I have lost weight with the 1800 calories a day method in the past as well, both work, I just personally find it easier to apply a restriction to the types of food I eat than to the amount, its whatever works for you.

    Premier Icon tjagain
    Full Member

    When you first start Keto you piss like a horse and feel very tired/lacking energy.

    Yes thats the low blood sugar and dehydration – its the water loss that gives the initial weight loss. You will not be in ketosis anyway I bet

    Premier Icon tjagain
    Full Member

    Lawnmanmax – if you had been in ketosis for 6 years you would be dead by now.

    Premier Icon rone
    Full Member

    Some diets suit some people.

    Dad has lost five stone on this. Never kept a diet going before. He’s no longer pre-diabetic either.

    Seems a good life choice to remove/ limit sugar to me, and control insulin.

    Link it with intermittent fasting and you will see great results with your general well being.

    Some people just don’t get on with regular calorie restrictive diet.

    Why are people so hell bent on correcting other people on a diet if it works for them?

    Premier Icon Cougar
    Full Member

    As even the positive comments here suggest, the problem with any fad diet like this is that for all bar a few folk it’s unsustainable. You’ll probably lose a good bit of weight quickly – as with most diets – but you’ll put it back on again. And a potential long term effect of diet – not diet – diet – not diet is that your appetite increases.

    If you want to lose weight safely and keep it off you need a lifestyle change not a quick fix.

    Premier Icon Vinte
    Free Member

    Like most fad diets it sounds like a good way to indulge/justify an eating disorder.

    Premier Icon Hob Nob
    Free Member

    Some people just don’t get on with regular calorie restrictive diet.

    Is that not what Keto is?

    Premier Icon BruceWee
    Free Member

    If you want to lose weight safely and keep it off you need a lifestyle change not a quick fix.

    Thing is, what lifestyle change seems to mean is resigning yourself to being unsatisfied for the rest of your life. That’s something that the vast majority of people are not going to accept so trying to lose weight the ‘proper’ way is just as likely to fail as any fad diet.

    I’d say the solution for most people is to try something, see if it works, and if it doesn’t try something else.

    Premier Icon Cougar
    Full Member

    what lifestyle change seems to mean is resigning yourself to being unsatisfied for the rest of your life.

    If that’s an analogy for “not doing a 500g bar of Dairy Milk in one sitting” then you’re right.

    There’s no diet which allows you to eat what you want, as much as you want, whenever you want. That mindset is why you need to diet in the first place. There has to either be a compromise somewhere or you need to resign yourself to the idea that you’ll always be a fat knacker.

    Honestly, I’ve been impressed with the Slimming World approach that my g/f embarked on a few weeks ago. It’s all about cutting out sugar and lard, the portions they allow are huge. Iceland carry SW-branded ready meals and her first reaction when I brought some home was “wait, these are for one person?” Compared to Weight Watchers which are about two tablespoons worth of food and wouldn’t satiate a small child.

    Premier Icon BigJohn
    Full Member

    iDave FTW

    Premier Icon tjagain
    Full Member

    Why are people so hell bent on correcting other people on a diet if it works for them?

    because what youare doing is simply calorie restriction with added unhealthy high fat diet.

    Premier Icon trail_rat
    Free Member

    I’m glad tj called out the ketosis bullshit.

    Most folk are doing calorie restriction by another name. Very very very few folk are achieving ketosis . Even fewer understand what it actually is

    Premier Icon BruceWee
    Free Member

    I think there’s a dismissal of fad diets and the promotion of the idea that calories in vs calories out is the only proper way to lose weight. For one thing, it’s not as simple as that. Sure, if you ingest 2000 calories and burn 2000 calories then your weight should remain roughly the same. However, if one day you decide to eat 5000 calories you won’t end up with a 3000 calorie excess and similarly if you consume 0 calories you won’t have a 2000 calorie deficit. There will be an excess and a deficit but your body will adapt to the number of calories you consume.

    People fail to lose weight (or keep the weight off) restricting calories in the exact same way people fail to lose or keep weight off on fad diets. Not to mention the fact that everyone’s body is different and everyone’s lifestyle is different.

    That’s why I say the best thing to do is try something, see if it works, and try something else if it doesn’t.

    Premier Icon rone
    Full Member

    because what youare doing is simply calorie restriction with added unhealthy high fat diet.

    It’s that unhealthy my Dad’s cholesterol and blood sugar are right down. Right down. And 5 stone weight loss.

    You are confused – keto doesn’t mean just eat anything and everything fatty.

    It’s all about keeping insulin in touch.

    I can assure you my Pa was much unhealthier before.

    Premier Icon Cougar
    Full Member

    There will be an excess and a deficit but your body will adapt to the number of calories you consume.

    … by getting fatter or thinner. How many overweight people do you see in countries where there isn’t enough food?

    It’s the first law of thermodynamics, if you put more fuel into a system in comparison to the fuel you’re burning then it’s got to go somewhere. Of course it’s not going to make a difference in the course of one day, that’s what I was saying. There’s no magic bullet.

    And yes, agreed, it’s not quite that simple. Different people have different metabolisms, and hormone irregularities or other conditions can have a big impact. I’ve got the opposite problem, I can’t put weight on. I should probably eat more than I do.

    Premier Icon FB-ATB
    Full Member

    Found this an interesting read:

    Processed food article

    Premier Icon trail_rat
    Free Member

    Unless the op is grossly over weight with high BP and high cholesterol it’s unlikely the op will benifit as your dad did rone.

    Less so if he just flounders round the edges of keto as many folk who believe they are in a ketosis state.

    If you have a medical reason it’s been proven to help in some cases but it’s not something a healthy person needing to lose a few pounds needs. It’s much riskier than just controling your diet.

    Premier Icon DT78
    Free Member

    So I tried a similar diet, mostly meat, egg and sweet potato/beans and veg As much as I wanted, with one cheat day a week. I ate loads so hard to say it was calorie restrictive. After 3 weeks I didn’t want the cheat day. If I ate bread it tasted like cake. I didn’t notice any problems with energy levels I was still doing 100milers. I lost about a kg a week for 7 weeks down to 72kg. I stopped because my wife started to comment about me looking like a skeleton, My cholesterol was also much higher than now. I think because I had bacon virtually every day (I love bacon)

    It did facilitate some permanent changes. Eggs for breakfast no cereal, no milk. I eat potato and bread but I’d rather not. Hardly any ale or beer, gin these days. Weight wise I have crept back to roughly where I was 5 years later, but I put that mostly down to two kids and having little time to train like I used to.

    I’d say give it a go

    Premier Icon yourguitarhero
    Free Member

    I’m dropping a kilo a week eating 1800 kCals/day and not damaging my body in any way (such as raising my cholesterol). I still have the energy to weight lift, mountain bike and do long distance cycling.

    Just about to tuck into a chicken madras, rice and naan with a beer. Nightmare.

    Premier Icon doomanic
    Full Member

    I am very overweight and have high BP. My cholesterol is 4.something, low enough that the Doctor didn’t want to tell me the exact number as she’d been using potential high cholesterol as a stick to beat me with.

    I’m restricting total calories as well as carb intake. I can’t get my head round the high fat requirement of a full Keto diet (it seems counter-intuitive to me) which is why I asked for people’s experience of it.
    Today has been 2 lean bacon medallions, and egg and cheese for breakfast, some nuts, cheese and a Peperami Hot for a snack, a chicken breast with cheese and chorizo for lunch and two chicken breasts with bacon and brie for dinner. That’s under 1800 calories according to MFP (no doubt some STWers will be along shortly to tell me just how wrong MFP is). I could probably drop the mid-morning snack, but it’s been a habit for the last 3 years at work.
    Bread and potatoes is all their forms are my downfall, I could happily trough a complete tiger loaf if I wanted, so I’m trying to avoid them all together.

    Premier Icon wardee
    Free Member

    Doing keto properly is very difficult. Theres a lot of misinformation out there and a lot of people who say they are keto, but when you crunch the numbers are actually just low carb. It is an extreme diet and very hard to get right.

    I lost 7kg in about 2 weeks, before my weight stabilised at 70kg. (3kg being water stored with carbs so doesn’t really count.)

    It is notable that the successful endurance athletes that adopt this diet, increase their carb intake when exercise loads increase and when racing and only use pure keto for short periods. When exercising on keto after fat adaptation I am slower with no sprinting ability , but don’t bonk either. Adding even small amounts of carbs feels like rocket fuel.

    With strict keto as defined by Volek,I find it very difficult to consume enough fat whilst still keeping carbs and protein low, for it to be sustainable long term.

    If your calorie requirements are below 1800cal per day it becomes easier.

    It’s not just the amount of fat you have to consume, it’s the type. You need to find good sources of omega 3. Excess omega 6, for example causes a lot of digestive problems and reflux. Volek says something about avoiding excess omega 6 in his book.

    Peanut butter is often recommended in keto recipes on the net, but is extremely high in omega 6.

    I also experienced issues with electrolyte imbalance ( feels like a heart problem and cured with salt and water) with pure keto every day. Ketio makes me generally feel not quite as intelligent.

    What works better for me is like keto, but a few more carbs, typically 100g per day,and relatively high protein, say 150g a day and avoiding processed foods. So low carb and the bulk of my calories from fat, but, not keto.

    The important thing imo is to minimize anything which creates an insulin spike. Avoid processed foods, sugar and flour, and make sure you eat enough vegetables and you are pretty much there.

    My appetite is much less when I eat like this, and I can enter into ketosis by going on a long run without fuel, or fasting.

    I think occasional ketosis is a good thing, just not all the time.

    Premier Icon wardee
    Free Member

    @doomanic

    Without knowing the numbers, your menu above doesn’t sound like a keto diet to me.

    Too much protein/ not enough fat. Also keto will generally still have a lot of vegetables if done right, just not starchy ones.

    Premier Icon doomanic
    Full Member

    Like I said, I’m struggling with the concept of a high fat diet…
    Today was 26g carbs, 111g fat and 174g protein. So yes, too much protein and too little fat to be Keto.

    Premier Icon granny_ring
    Full Member

    Following.

    Premier Icon hols2
    Free Member

    I’ve got the opposite problem, I can’t put weight on. I should probably eat more than I do.

    I think if everyone chips in, we can collect enough mushroom stalks to turn you into Mr. Creosote.

    Premier Icon el_boufador
    Full Member

    For me, pretty much exactly what wardee just said, including side effects.
    In the week it try to stay low carb, high protein and fat. Weekend I slacken it off and live a little. I know definitely when I hit ketosis, acetone breath is a dead give away and is either there when in ketosis, or not.
    It definitely helps me to stay relatively trim, but as wardee said, it has downsides also.
    High fat high protein also certainly suppresses hunger for me. For this reason, as above, no carbs at breakfast (just a casein shake to ward off hunger later) egg or cottage cheese based lunch, then whatever is going for dinner.
    Works for me.

    Premier Icon yourguitarhero
    Free Member

    I think MFP is really good. You have to log everything in it though.

    If you’re using MFP and sticking to 1800, then just do that and be patient?

    Instead of all this weird food ‘science’ keto stuff, just get in a gym and lift weights as well as controlling your calorie intake. It will release hormones that make you feel good (testosterone), it’s good for your health (if you do it correctly) you’ll get stronger (track your workouts and see the numbers going up) and you will look better as the fat is coming off.

    For example, my weight is quite low (for me anyway, 84kg at 5′ 11″) as I’ve been reducing calories since new year. But I’ve taken tape measure measurements from time to time too. The last time I was this weight, my chest was an inch smaller and my waist three inches bigger. That’s the benefit of weightlifting.

    Premier Icon BruceWee
    Free Member

    If you’re using MFP and sticking to 1800, then just do that and be patient?

    Instead of all this weird food ‘science’ keto stuff, just get in a gym and lift weights as well as controlling your calorie intake.

    It’s great that it’s working for you but what you have to remember is that you are a sample size of 1. I’m also a sample size of 1 and I can tell you that calorie restriction the way you’re talking about it doesn’t work for me. I can lose weight but I’m cranky and miserable. Then the weight comes back when some inevitable life change disrupts my eating and exercise pattern.

    Personally time restriction works much better for me. I don’t have to track calories and most of the time I don’t feel hungry. It actually works better with changes in circumstances since all you have to do is not eat.

    I can’t see a keto diet working for me but it doesn’t mean that there aren’t elements that I can use. I’ve started seeking out foods that are higher in fat and I find myself feeling better since I started doing that.

    Like I said, there is no single diet that is going to work for everyone. Try stuff and see what works. And once you find something that works don’t bother trying to get the entire world to do the same thing as you. It’s not going to work for everyone.

    Premier Icon daviek
    Full Member

    A friend did it years ago and went from close to 20 stone to about 13 I think it was. He was told by the doctor/medical type person that his cholesterol was so good he’d not have managed to get it like that on medication. He’s still on it with the odd lapse but hes still in good shape.

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