suicide in young men. ( life is shit sometimes )

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  • suicide in young men. ( life is shit sometimes )
  • ton
    Member

    got a call from my son yesterday, he was in a bit of a state.
    he has been in a relationship with a girl for a couple of years. they live together with her daughter, from her previous fella, who she was married to. marriage ended before my lad got involved.
    but my lad played rugby with the ex hubby.
    anyway, the lad who was 30 committed suicide yesterday. completely out of the blue.
    he worked, he played rugby, he had his daughter every weekend or a few days in the week. he was on good terms with hie ex and with my son.
    but something must have been seriously wrong in his mind.
    such a nice lad too. so so sad that young blokes feel this is the only solution to their problems.

    swdan
    Member

    Agreed. My sister’s partner did it just before Christmas and not a day goes by I don’t think about him. We weren’t even close (either relationship or location) but I can’t help feeling I could have done something, if only to hear what he had to say. I hate that he felt he had to deal with whatever it was alone.
    As someone who’s been diagnosed with depression I know how hard it can be to talk to people but also how much it can help.
    Anyone out there in a similar position, please don’t keep it inside

    mattyfez
    Member

    So many things bloke’s don’t talk about, financial problems, not much family or friendship support network, job insecurities..

    All manageable things on thier own but when things stack up.. It’s quite easy to see how people get pushed over the edge..especially if trying to keep up apperences.

    Sorry that’s not any help to your situation but maybe he had other stuff going on that he felt was out of control.

    My condoloces.

    Premier Icon matt_outandabout
    Subscriber

    It’s crap and devastating.

    The statistics for suicide of teens to young men is frightening.

    We’ve some friends whose 15 year old committed suicide – he was a week older than our eldest. Brings it home.

    Premier Icon gnusmas
    Subscriber

    Extremely sorry to hear that, my condolences to all concerned.

    I know the feeling, too well unfortunately. The only thing keeping me in check at the moment is the kids. They’ve already lost one parent, they don’t need to go through that again. It’s unbelievably lonely at night when they are all asleep. I worry constantly about what mattyfez said, and more. Trying my best to get through each day, but it’s incredibly hard.

    1981miked
    Member

    Sorry for all involved Ton. It can get a bit lonely when you feel like that and there doesn’t appear to be any other way out. I know of a couple of young guys who have committed suicide. So sad.

    Gnusmas – you are an inspiration to us all, the way you have coped with all that has been thrown at you recently.

    I have personally had some mental health issues the last 18 months or so (although I suspect it has been underlying for years and I’m just realising the symptoms now), been to some pretty dark places but have always managed to drag myself out the hole.

    My thoughts are with all involved.

    plus one
    Member

    Awful times. Dropping like flys in society 🙁

    Lots of broken people struggling on alone.

    SiB
    Member

    Mental health problems are hard to understand, tried to snap my sister out of it for a few years. I still dont understand it but accepting it exists was a huge step forward for us both.

    Good friend hung himself when we were 11, cant really remember my thoughts back then as I’m 47 now but there was definitely a sense of confusion, why would someone so young and carefree, apparently, do that?

    Wifes old friend from school, male, ended his life a couple of years ago on the motorway.

    Acquaintance who appeared to have it all took his own life 18 months ago leaving a wife and two kids to carry on running the successful family business…..

    I still dont understand mental health but it can happen anytime to anybody so ALWAYS chat to your mates about it. Every friday round the poker table I humorously ask them all if they are OK, any issues they want to talk about and tell them if they have anything at all they need to get off their chest to get in touch with me privately ……normally met with lots of homo erotic replies! We are all married, straight and with kids in cosy suburbia in seemingly happy lives….but you NEVER know and I’ve known them all since school days. They know I’m there for them and that can, but will hopefully never come to it, save a life.

    Its so easy to chat to your mates about it…..SO DO IT!

    My brother did it last year. It was devastating to my small family and the knock on effects are terrible.

    My mum took it especially badly and I think the stress and depression made her ill. It’s her funeral today.

    aweeshoe
    Member

    @scott_mcavennie2 *hugs*

    I was the last person to speak to my dad before he killed himself. I was a teenager at the time and I’d told him to **** off. Be kind, ask and listen to those close to you

    gonefishin
    Member

    My thought are with you all. I posted something at the weekend along related lines and have a little experience with mental health issues and where dark thoughts can lead you. I also found out this morning that someone else I knew has taken her life although she did that before the cancer did so although I’m sad about it (even if she was a bit racist at times) at least I can understand why.

    I’ll be contacting old friends I’ve lost touch with this week and making sure I stay in touch.

    Premier Icon funkmasterp
    Subscriber

    The thing is that people who suffer with mental health issues can get really good at hiding it. My boss was recently diagnosed as bipolar and is doing great considering what he’s going through.

    When I opened up to him and told him that I’ve suffered with depression most of my adult life, he was genuinely shocked. I spend a lot of time putting up a front and it takes its toll. Very tiring, but you get extremely good at it. I’ve been to some truly dark places over the years and been close to doing something irreversible a few times.

    My thoughts are with anyone that is suffering.

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    That’s terrible Ton. It’s such a tragic waste.

    So many other sad stories here. Hope you’re all ok.

    What we need to have is a cultural shift in this country. We need to break the really unhealthy link between a certain form of masculinity and mental health/depression.

    It’s the 21st century, not the 19th. We should no longer be equating depression, asking for help or saying you’re struggling as some kind of admission you have failed as a man. We need to adopt the more open and supportive attitude that women seem to manage so well. This MTFU attitude needs to change because it’s killing people!

    If you’ve not seen it, there is a very unlikely champion of this. Fair play to him for trying to break this link and help people

    Premier Icon weeksy
    Subscriber

    I was at a funeral of a mate not more than 3-4 weeks ago, chucked himself of a bridge… shocked and astounded doesn’t even begin to describe it…

    It’s a bloody strange world.

    swdan
    Member

    Binners, I agree but as I’m sure you know/can imagine it can still be very difficult and take courage to say something. Last month I stood up in my team meeting, did a 10 minute session on stress, depression and my experience of it and offered my ear should anyone want to talk at any time. However, that was my third attempt as I bottled it the first two as just didn’t feel up to it. I’m glad I did it and I hope something good comes out of it but it wasn’t easy

    Premier Icon binners
    Subscriber

    That’s pretty brave of you swdan. Well done.

    I’ve suffered from depression in the past and know how lonely, debilitating and isolating it is.

    Locally a local group of blokes have set up a group for men who are feeling like this, as an outlet.

    I’m sure many people will read that link and scoff at it. And they’re the problem. I just know it has made a huge difference to the lives of one person, in particular, I know who has suffered terribly with depression over the years. And many others.

    We need to see more of this kind of thing. Because I know myself how going out on a Monday Night Pub Ride and having the piss taken out of me for a couple of hours changes things, and how much the sense of community of this place helps when you’re suffering

    We need more of this approach and a lot less MTFU

    1981miked
    Member

    Agree with all the above, I sort of half told my 2 closest friends last year and they were shocked I had gotten so low. It’s fair to say they make sure to keep pestering me with phone calls and WhatsApp messages etc. I’m not sure if they are conscious of this but it does help and I was surprised how understanding they were. I got back in to cycling again just after Christmas and it felt good to be back out.

    I haven’t been it for a while though as I am struggling for motivation just now, feel very drained and run down, my aches and pains are playing up aswell which doesn’t help. I spoke to my boss 6 weeks ago about reducing my working hours and dropping every second Friday, said I really struggled with the work load last year etc.. he made all the right noises at the time but it’s coming into silly season at my work (wheel attendant in the road tanker industry) so everybody makes the best of the dry weather. Needless to say sod all has changed, I’m still struggling with the work load, still doing 15 hour days and still waiting for an answer on my request to drop the Friday. There is enough cover across the board but the thought of a lorry parked up every second Friday obviously doesn’t sit well with him.. I don’t suppose me going off again with stress and exhaustion has even occurred to him.

    I have nothing left to give energy wise, have been on empty for months now and I sometimes wonder what people expect of me but you just have to keep on going.

    Anyway, rant over. Stay safe chaps and lasses.

    Premier Icon grahamt1980
    Subscriber

    The stats are crazy.
    A guy directly opposite us hung himself about 18 months ago.
    saw his daughters off to school then jumped out of the loft hatch. Scary.

    I have managed to arrange a mental health awareness course for all of our line managers in our dept with st john ambulance. Am hoping this will give some clues and assistance in maybe spotting some of the warning signs ahead of time

    avdave2
    Member

    I don’t know if anyone else listened to Clarke Carlisle and his wife on Radio 4’s All in the Mind last night but it’s worth listening to on catch up.

    cycl1ngjb
    Member

    At my old workplace about 18 months ago once everyone had arrived for the day they called everyone together and told us that one of my colleagues had committed suicide over the weekend (he hung himself).

    He was slightly younger than me (late 30’s), I didn’t know him that well, he seemed outwardly fine whenever I spoke to him.

    Premier Icon Esme
    Subscriber

    Sad stories. The charity PAPYRUS works to prevent young suicide, and has some useful resources on their website.

    MTB-Idle
    Member

    Sorry to hear that Ton. I have to admit I have been lucky to have zero experience of this in my 54 years until last year.

    My mate was approaching 50 and he organised for 16 of us to spend a long weekend away in Bedoin last June to celebrate. We rode the cingles du Ventoux and all agreed it was the best cycling day out ever (and I like to think I’ve had some pretty great cycling experiences).

    Three months later he left his house at around midnight (without the wife and two teenage boys knowledge) and cycled 120km down to Beachy Head and well, you can guess the rest. He even uploaded the ride to Strava before he did it.

    I’d known him about five years and on the face of it he was the happiest guy you could meet. always positive and upbeat. He had been encouraging me to return from my badly broken wrist I suffered just after Ventoux.

    Others had known him for 30+ years and still had no idea why.

    It was devastating for all who knew him.

    nicko74
    Member

    It’s awful, and for everyone who’s been affected by it, just horrible.

    One thing did jump out in the OP

    but something must have been seriously wrong in his mind.

    …not as something I disagree with, but just a thought. Maybe the view is that in order to do something like take your own life, something has to be ‘seriously wrong’ – and maybe that’s partly why nobody ever really talks about it openly. But given the numbers and prevalence and how common depression is, perhaps we’re thinking about it wrong.

    I’m struggling to articulate it, but it seems that especially for people with long-term depression, it’s less about ‘something seriously wrong’, but more about a longer-term issue combined with a short, sudden onset of dark clouds (which can occur worryingly suddenly).

    Premier Icon grahamt1980
    Subscriber

    Nicko – I totally agree, the change I think we need to make is to really understand that this is no different to any other disease. Viral infection, cancer etc and treat is a such. No one chooses to die from cancer but it happens, I would argue that if you are suffering from depression the ‘choice’ to commit suicide is not a choice at all, it is just one option as a result of the disease, much like recovery, extended illness or death can be from a lot of diseases

    Premier Icon NewRetroTom
    Subscriber

    Some really sad stories on here. Thoughts are with all those impacted, it’s never easy to deal with.

    A lot of people saying “commit suicide”.

    It was decriminalised in 1961 in England and Wales, so no crime has been committed.

    nicko74
    Member

    the change I think we need to make is to really understand that this is no different to any other disease

    It’s a huge shift though. On LinkedIn you often see platitudes about “we take mental wellbeing seriously” and the like; it’s a start of course, but only a tiny step. I’ve thought about posting more honestly and openly on there about the challenges of mental health and depression, as a way to prompt genuine discussion in my industry about it, but have held off because I’m pretty sure I’d lose business as a result – from clients not understanding and preferring to go with someone more “stable”.

    locum76
    Member

    Rant\Society is ****. We’ve no community any more. We live in bubbles isolated by distance from family and friends. Kids can’t play in the park because of all the dogshit. We work, watch telly and sleep. Nobody has free time because the cost of living is so high. Everything is set up for us to be good little consumers, earning to spend and buy. A quick giving an endorphins buzz where a cuddle used to do. Men are getting it bad now. Feminism needs to include men now and the balance of freedom and responsibility evened up./endrant

    So much sadness on this thread. So much support from forum users. You guys are awesome. OP, I hope everyone finds a way forward and upwards.

    Premier Icon Harry_the_Spider
    Subscriber

    A mate did it and my cousin did it.

    My aunt and uncle are still suffering 20+ years later.

    Premier Icon joelowden
    Subscriber

    Work colleagues’ son committed suicide last week at 20 . Absolutely devastating and totally out of the blue.

    https://theoutline.com/post/7267/living-with-passive-suicidal-ideation?zd=1&zi=ovlmognp

    This has been my life on and off for about 20 years now. I have periods where I tread water, some where I even swim. And many where it is just too tempting to stop fighting against the thoughts and events I cannot control and let the waters close over my head, just to be free from battling against my own brain and its insistence that everything I am and will be is of no consequence to anyone.

    But I have (as the article describes) flotation devices that keep my head above water, so for the moment I carry on.

    I think in reality I don’t want to die, I just want the static and the noise and the anxiety and worry to stop. But that’s modern life, so on we go..

    ton
    Member

    read all the replies on here. it is a more common thing than I ever knew.

    and if any of you blokes need someone to vent to and let off steam or just have a natter, feel free to contact me any time.

    my email is thoss20@hotmail.co.uk

    keep strong fellas, not only for your families, but moreso for yourselves.

    jimster01
    Member

    Currently going through a dark patch, had booked a couple of days off and it clashes with a BS audit, when the MD found out that my line manager had dropped a bollock it felt like payback. Was tasked with compiling a safety data sheet before I went on leave,at 4pm. Had viscous email off line manager saying that my work spaces were unsatisfactory. Basically I went into meltdown, went to work the following morning at 4am, compiled the data sheets, and sent everything else out.

    Went to the Doc’s afterwards and broke down, was issued with a sick note giving Anxiety with depression, signed off for two weeks. Went back in and was signed off again, this time for 4 weeks. Next day I received a letter from work asking for my consent to access my medical records, with veiled threats, then received a letter advising me that I’m under investigation for misuse of company email address. At the moment I am really struggling not to do something stupid. I have been on citalopram for years, but this latest episode is proving difficult to say the least

    Premier Icon NewRetroTom
    Subscriber

    Jimster, that sounds like a properly rubbish work situation. Remember though, your work life does not equal your life. Sounds like you need to find a better employer. If you can make that happen then things might start to look a whole lot brighter. Do not give up!

    Premier Icon northshoreniall
    Subscriber

    That sounds shit jimster, sorry to hear it. Take the time you need to get yourself right and forget about work for now.
    Your employer has no right access your medical records – ask for an occupational health referral, if they deem it necessary they will get consent and write to gp for info, not directly your employer.(I’m an occ health nurse)
    Do you have an employee assistance program you can access for support? Often quicker than via gp route.
    Many on here, me included, happy to speak as I think most of us have been there at some point to some degree.
    Keep posting here, amazing support available from bunch of random strangers.

    Premier Icon Nobby
    Subscriber

    The scale of the issue is frightening, I’ve had two friends take their own lives over the years, one we knew had issues but the other was a bolt from the blue – both were over 40. Since the latter, I’ve had a bit of training to try & help recognise the indicators etc but have thankfully not seen anything requiring any form of intervention as yet.

    On Easter Sunday my son & I joined up with an amazing ‘event’ organised by a football fan who has experienced his own mental health issues. It sounds simple, but a group of about 120 people walked the 12 miles or so from Selhurst Park to the Emirates with one aim – highlight mental health & give folk an opportunity to talk openly without fear. By the end the number had probably doubled.

    For those on Twitter you can search #WalkAndTalk or look up the organiser @HC15Ontour if it’s of interest.

    I have to say, there were some seriously brave people willing to be very open about their own circumstances or having had to deal with the fall out of suicide & I wish there were more opportunities like this to encourage anyone who needs help to talk to someone, anyone.

    I get the feeling our connected world is actually disconnecting us from each other….

    jimster01
    Member

    Thanks for the advise guys, we’re currently looking into finding a new job/career. The company only has 10 employees, four in Europe, three on the road in the UK. I’m the only person who deals with suppliers/stock/data sheets and all the other crap. Basically it comes down to the fact my line manager hasn’t any idea of my workload until it’s too late. If it gets too much for me as the day wears on you can’t get agency staff in in the afternoon. They have no plan B in place, BS auditor picked up on this last year.

    Premier Icon jamj1974
    Subscriber

    What we need to have is a cultural shift in this country. We need to break the really unhealthy link between a certain form of masculinity and mental health/depression.

    Our system is broken. In general, women are abused more than men and men are less able to cope. We need to change it.

    tjagain
    Member

    Although the point about men and “big boys don’t cry” is pertinent depression is endemic in our society and we need to get to the root causes.

    IMO this is the hopeless mismatch between the dreams we are sold and the reality of our lives. Take cars for one example – we are sold them as inspirational, as freedom machines and as all sorts of positive things. the reality is half your wage goes into paying for it and you spend half your life sitting in traffic getting frustrated.

    Work so hard, get your nice house in suburbia, wife, kiddies in school and all sorts of classes. Are you happy? Or is your life still unsatisfying? Or worse – work so hard and you cannot even get those things that you are told will make you happy.

    To me one of the key things is time outdoors. That and working less hours and being less aspirational towards material things and more towards the things that truly make us happy. For me this is wandering around the mountains. Hardly aspirational but boy does it clear the rubbish from y9ur mind and let you know what your real needs are.

    lowey
    Member

    Awful reading. I am still staggered by the fact that the biggest killer for men under 45 is Suicide.

    I cant really add to anything already said, but I think TJ is spot on.

    poolman
    Member

    The post above re daily whatsapp messages is spot on – a couple of friends are struggling so I send them a daily message. Someone I know far more experienced in this than me told me the only way I could get them out was to knock on their door, hold their hand and help them down the street.

    Such a shame, but you have to want to help yourself too.

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