I shouldn’t laugh, but Florence Kate Uptons 1895 work sounds like a racist pr0n film.

Can we ban rap music while we are on?

Lots of misogyny, anti-white and anti-Asian sentiment (anti-black if you don’t consider the N word to be a term of endearment) contained in that ‘art form’.

Apart from that it’s a bit rubbish and they are still rapping about the same things they were almost 35 years ago. Money, ho’s, guns etc.

‘they’ = rappers BTW. 😉

I struggle with long sentences but just to say I had a golly as a kid and never equated it with black people at all. Still don’t.

Trail-Blazer – Member
Can we ban rap music while we are on?

Lots of misogyny, anti-white and anti-Asian sentiment (anti-black if you don’t consider the N word to be a term of endearment) contained in that ‘art form’.

Apart from that it’s a bit rubbish and they are still rapping about the same things they were almost 35 years ago. Money, ho’s, guns etc.

‘they’ = rappers BTW.

You obviously listen to a lot of hip-hop.

I think the images are pretty offensive. Fair enough they should have a place in a museum maybe, but I don’t think a school is the right place. If the school says they don’t represent the views then have them removed.

Trail blazer, any examples?

You obviously listen to a lot of hip-hop.

‘Fo shizzle. 😉 (is that racist?)

I thoguht “golly” as a word was a morph of God, as people don’t like to blaspheme, like Jeepers and Gosh. Or my new fav: Cheese and Sprinkles!

You obviously listen to a lot of hip-hop.

I’m glad someone said that in a polite way.

Can we ban rap music while we are on?

Lots of misogyny, anti-white and anti-Asian sentiment (anti-black if you don’t consider the N word to be a term of endearment) contained in that ‘art form’.

Apart from that it’s a bit rubbish and they are still rapping about the same things they were almost 35 years ago. Money, ho’s, guns etc.

I hear this description of rap music quite often and it just makes the person saying it look incredibly ignorant.

I feel sorry for your kids, fella. Unless, of course, you refrain from talking the type shit you write around this place.

😀

Apart from that it’s a bit rubbish and they are still rapping about the same things they were almost 35 years ago. Money, ho’s, guns etc.

Utter bollocks. Afrika Bambaataa, Grandmaster Flash etc were completely different to what is produced by a lot of hip hop artists today.

I had a cowboy suit, guns, holsters, kerchief and everything when I was a kid. I didn’t equate it with the wholesale slaughter of native Americans. Now I just associate it with sex games with hora and binners.

I feel sorry for your kids, fella. Unless, of course, you refrain from talking the type shit you write around this place.

I bet you folks are proud they brought you up to act like this 😉

This isn’t coherent, I’ve read it three times and it still makes no sense.

I know but if you follow the thread it is toys argument not mine. I agree its a nonsensical point that was the point

Your logic on the picture is severely flawed.

I think you mean you disagree with me but if you wish to break it down into formal logic and explain the fallacy. My argument is logical,that does not mean it is right 8)

I thoguht “golly” as a word was a morph of God, as people don’t like to blaspheme, like Jeepers and Gosh. Or my new fav: Cheese and Sprinkles!

I can understand how someone who has the misfortune to be around people who actually use those phrases can find an old mural offensive !

Junkyard – lazarus
I think all my kids need to know is the past was a bit more racist than now and we are trying to be less racist. I am not sure they need to see all examples of racism or female oppression or homophobia to get this point tbh.

I reckon kids need to know the truth about the past.

They need to know how endemic prejudice can be accepted as a normal and natural part of society.
Anything else, any ‘airbrushing of history’ is disengenuous & dangerous.

Now I just associate it with sex games with hora and binners.

😯

‘airbrushing of history’ is disengenuous & dangerous.

that mural is in a school today its the present not the past – you are talking about letting it remain in a school today not keeping an accurate record of what was in a school in the past

its not airbrushing the past its is doing something in the present.

“airbrushing” history would require painting it all white and pretending it was never there and we never had golliwogs. As others note keeping it in a gallery [ if possible] is a good compromise.

i agree we cannot pretend things did not happen in the past or air brush it but we dont need to keep it

In the 60’s they thought homosexuality was a disease that could be cured- I suspect some still do think like that still. Should I give my kids books on this or just explain that folk did this and it was wrong?

Well, you didn’t say that, did you? 😀

You said, ‘… all my kids need to know is the past was a bit more racist than now and we are trying to be less racist..’.

No mention of museums, etc.

In the 60’s they thought homosexuality was a disease that could be cured- I suspect some still do think like that still. Should I give my kids books on this or just explain that folk did this and it was wrong?

I dunno – how strongly do you feel about it?
If you’re not that fussed, then fine, you could just ‘explain that folk did this and it was wrong’.

Homophobia is sill endemic – we are one of the the most liberal countries in the worls in this respect.

You could fob them off with a book or a museum, or show them & talk through examples of how it affects millions of people thoughout the world today – how people are still routinely killed because of their sexuality.

Sticking older examples of prejudice in a museum is a denial of our humanity – it says ‘that happened in the past, but we’re better now’.
Well, we’re not.
Prejudice grows wherever ignorance thrives and if we’re not careful, it returns faster than you think.

In the 60’s they thought homosexuality was a disease that could be cured- I suspect some still do think like that still. Should I give my kids books on this or just explain that folk did this and it was wrong?

Not quite sure what point you’re trying to make there but either would be fine. It’s called education.

Junkyard –

Would you stop your children from reading Huck Finn and Tom Sawyer?

Do you think that these novels have no value as art and should be removed from schools?

IMO they were of their time and they should be used to demonstrate how things have progressed. The same for the mural. They are also great stories and I loved them as a child.

Besides, it is a mural that shows talking animals that wear clothes and drink tea FFS. It isn’t historically accurate.

The headmaster must be a shrewd cookie. Not only does he/she display art that is apparently of “historic and artistic importance” but he also creates the perfect tool for weeding out trouble-maker parents before they arrive. A double master stroke.

DD, worth opening this thread again for you post alone. Another masterstroke.

I bet you folks are proud they brought you up to act like this

They’re incredibly proud of me, for the record.

But, what way am I acting – I’m still mystified as to why I was accused of being a racist for not seeing a golli.

If you read the thread back it was you that came in with the guns blazing, as usual (your condescending edit, for example. Who the hell edits to add condescension). And what was all that shit about high ground and inner light…

I think you need to get a grip of yourself with regard to this place. I continually read posts of yours questioning the validity of other members contributions if you dislike what they write, as if what you contribute is of any worth. For the most part, you come across as an over-bearing, self-righteous fool that doesn’t appear to have the time or inclination to take others opinions on-board.

I’m always somewhat wary of the over-confident…

winston it all depends really and in general no i would not stop them but I would explain.

We have read Alice in wonderland and there is no golliwog that I recall so yes its fair to say its not accurate about anything FWIW they did not enjoy it very much.

Tom sawyer – interesting point but I dont know it well enough to comment tbh but I suspect i would be fine with it. Some racism iirc??

I am coming over more puritanical and hand wringing, wont someone think of the children than I intended. i dont want to re write the past or sterilise it all but some aspects are best to just be said rather than read – they are still young though so as they age this will change.

It’s called education

Only if they dont think its a disease at the end . I get the point but they dont need to see examples of homophobia they just need to know it happened.

I have never read Alice In Wonderland even as I child I didn’t get it. The mural strikes me as being quite beautiful and should be kept.

I thought Golly was an Enid Blyton character?

Mark Twain had characters called “Injun Joe” and “Jim” who is called a “****”. Injun Jope is also a nasty piece of work.

I get the point but they dont need to see examples of homophobia they just need to know it happened.

It very much depends on the circumstances as to whether ‘seeing’ is appropriate or relevant. Images of holocaust victims, for instance, would have considerably more impact than if children were merely told about it.

Woody I agree it depends on what it is but my kids are young so i shall not be showing them images for a number of years.

Cheers for Tom sawyer info

I’m still mystified as to why I was accused of being a racist for not seeing a golli.

I am mystified as to why you think I have done this – could you highlight the post ? Please quote me accusing you of racism- you cannot
As for the rest you dont like me fine ignore me and dont reply its your choice what you do with my posts. Lets not get personal eh

The AiW stuff is a tangent. It only comes up because various people describe the girl in the mural as an AiW like character.

Still I am sure there are plenty of equally offended heads who will be lining up to welcome Ms Neizer Rocha and her offspring to their schools. In the end, they will all be happy and in the appropriate environment.

I am mystified as to why you think I have done this – could you highlight the post ? Please quote me accusing you of racism- you cannot

Now you’re getting paranoid. There’s nothing in that statement to suggest I was referring to you. I was referring to Deadly Darcy’s input.

See, that’s what I’m talking about – you have a brainfart and can’t help yourself hitting the keyboard before engaging your rational side.

You do have one, right…

Teasel, were you on here before under a different log in?

You seem to have personal issues with Junky.
Any chance of you putting that to one side and behaving like a big boy now so we can continue with an interesting discussion?

No previous, your honour.

Nothing personal, either. Just retaliating – can’t resist sometimes.

I’ll behave like a big boy now…

*scrambles around for rolling eye emoticon*

I’ll behave like a big boy now…

Good lad.

If you behave yourself this afternoon you can have a little rant at teatime.

But, what way am I acting – I’m still mystified as to why I was accused of being a racist for not seeing a golli.

Who accused you of being a racist? That’s pretty serious stuff.

deadlydarcy – I love these threads. Brings ’em all out.

Followed by the piccie of the golli “for [my] benefit”.

Ambiguity is a wonderful thing, though, isn’t it – affords a lack of commitment…

oops…I’ll stop now…

Sorry, Rusty etc.

I hear this description of rap music quite often and it just makes the person saying it look incredibly ignorant.

Sweeping statement I guess but there are plenty of examples of misogyny and forms of racism in the work of some artists – not all.

Check out Ice Cube’s back catalogue before he sold out. Black Korea anyone? Can you say anything under the guise of irony?

What about art that depicts black people as slaves or servants? Could that be seen as offensive or an accurate depiction of how life was at that time?

Just asking – I don’t really know if the toy in the background of the picture is more symbolic? (It is a toy, right?)

@ teasel
Why would you have thought I was talking about you?

To be fair, I can’t believe your “not seeing a golliwog” was anything other than disingenuous attempt to wind JY up by implying he was being a handwringing professionally offended type because he saw a golliwog and you “didn’t”. So in case there was any ambiguity, because we can’t have that in your world (apparently), I showed you the very first picture that google images threw up for the search term “golliwog”, just so you couldn’t be in any doubt as to why people might see a golliwog where you just saw a black kid. So, no, I didn’t call you a racist, but I should have called you a bullshitter. The discussion got reasonably interesting once you left, but here you are again today continuing to insult him.

Now, if you could point out where I called you a racist…?

I already did – in the quote.

But..you’re wrong about my motivations. I genuinely did not see a golly/golli in the picture. When I first looked at it in the way the OP requested we do i.e. is this racist – it took me a while to see anything remotely racist and it wasn’t until I spotted what I stated was a black kid with an afro that I saw a possible cause. Maybe I’m thick or slow or whatever but I certainly didn’t see a golli even though I grew-up in the seventies and lived through the changes associated with this subject.

As far as JY is concerned, I have no idea what a hangwringer is so no, not attempting to prove anything, just interested as to why he saw a golli as an instant image as opposed to a black kid. I get it now – most of you see a golly; I didn’t and JY jumped on me for that, thinking I was up to something. I wasn’t – I was expressing myself, probably badly.

Anyway, if you weren’t implying I was a racist in your “brings em all out” line and it was merely something I inferred through being paranoid, please accept my apologies.

I hope that’s clear enough…

I’m happy to leave it at that. And I’m sure you need to keep your post count down. 😉

🙂

Indeed, I do. I have a few days of online ordering to do and knew it was a mistake to frequent this place of a morning/afternoon/evening.

JY jumped on me for that,

What’s actually going on, though ? The chap in question just seems to be having a good time sitting up on that ledge.

I’m obviously missing something…

POSTED 15 HOURS AGO # REPORT-POST
Junkyard – lazarus
Have you considered researching the topic first?

Is this really Jumping on you or worth all this that you have done?

Trail-Blazer – Member
Sweeping statement I guess but there are plenty of examples of misogyny and forms of racism in the work of some artists – not all.

Check out Ice Cube’s back catalogue before he sold out. Black Korea anyone? Can you say anything under the guise of irony?

So we can condemn all of punk because of Skrewdriver then?