Sir! Keir! Starmer!

You make it sound idylic.

Anyhoo. 500 fire doors having to be replaced before they had even been walked through.

Cost is on NHS because they had already been accepted on completion of work.

Thats a whole lot of shit management and robbery.

“it gets worse due to cuts and stupid management”

Who makes those cuts.? The stupid managers per chance ?

Again, I answered the question so back to Starmer.

The cuts are the Tories fault. No one else

Explain.

Is that NHS funding going down, or is it management reducing spending ?

Damn, suckered.

Back to Starmer please. lol.

Well it’s good to see that the Tories have gotten a real handle on corruption in the decade they’ve had in power.

I’m voting/I vote Labour – even though it’ll likely leave me poorer in terms of tax if they get in – because I have absolutely no faith in the current bunch of Tories – if it were a Major or a Thatcher in charge, it’d be a more difficult choice, but they aren’t so it’s not.

You’re the first person I’ve ever heard say they will vote Labour because they miss Maggie.

Sigh, not because I miss her. Because she was at least competent and it would’ve been a choice based upon perceived pros and cons of policy. Rather than a choice between Mr eleventy-kids-hides-in-a-fridge and someone at least appears to know what they’re doing – if we had a general election tomorrow.

There absolutely will be people who have traditionally voted Tory who won’t be backing this current lot at the next election. Can Starmer persuade enough of them to back him, rather than not vote? It’s a tall ask, but it has to be part of his plan if he has any chance of being PM. People who would not normally be inclined to vote for a party on the left, but can see that we need a government made up of honest and capable people. Some of them can be won around. I don’t think you fall into this category Brads… but I strongly expect that is more due to the efforts of the spin doctors of the current administration to focus on culture wars than any admiration for the competence and integrity of their ministers and PM.

So you think Starmer is a better choice ?
More Maggie like ?

NHS funding not increasing with inflation

Total tory fault along with tory reorganisation wasting money. 10% of NHS spending in england wasted on tory market dogma

So you think Starmer is a better choice ?
More Maggie like ?

Obvious troll is obvious.

@kelvin

They will have a struggle in Scotland because exactly the opposite happened last time round.
Labour voters actually voted Tory.

I live in an area that has only ever been labour in my lifetime (I’m “middle aged” apparently, different thread)

Unheard off. For that to have happened, it will take some massive shift to woo then back. Starmer isn’t it.

Obvious troll is obvious.

For gods sake, be adult.

NHS funding not increasing with inflation

Total tory fault along with tory reorganisation wasting money. 10% of NHS spending in england wasted on tory market dogma

Sorry, that just sounds like dogma.

My wages haven’t increased with inflation. My standard of living has went up though.

For gods sake, be adult.

If you’ll stop trying to be a wind up merchant.

I don’t think you fall into this category Brads

You’re accusing me of cultural bias as opposed to thinking ?

Seriously ? you have to be making that up to provoke me , no ?

If you’ll stop trying to be a wind up merchant.

Does anyone else think I’m on the wind up as opposed to actually having a discussion about a politician I had high hopes for ?

Who, Thatcher?

Troll ?

Its obvious that either you are trolling or have a serious comprehension and empathy failure.

So not you then.

I am neither, but I suspect you know that but just don’t want a discussion, just a rant.

They will have a struggle in Scotland because exactly the opposite happened last time round.

I don’t think Starmer has any chance of enabling a Labour recovery in Scotland, that’s a whole problem he can’t do anything about yet, in my opinion. TJ has started another thread about that though. Join in there if you want.

a discussion about a politician I had high hopes for ?

When you say “High Hopes”, what were you hoping he would do or say?

I find him dull, but have accepted for now that he looks to have a reasonable idea about how to show that the Labour Party are ready to move into government. He’s slowly dismantling the idea (with help from his opposite number) that Labour have their heads in the cloud, and the Conservatives can be trusted with the economy and general day to day business of running the government and all that entails.

Change Labour and actually make it a viable option.
And be a powerful opposition. Someone who offered alternatives that could not be ignored.

Think Kier Hardie crossed with Jimmy Reid

Someone with a solution and the skills to put it across with integrity.

In six months? During this medical emergency? With four years ‘till an election? Right… I think he is changing Labour, and people’s opinion/view of the party, as it happens.

Back to the topic. concerted attacks all day from shadow cabinet and norther mayors on tory incompetence. Looks to me like a deliberate ramping up of attacks. good politics again. Harness the anger people feel and direct at those responsible. make the tories own the mess they have made of covid response.

In six months? During this medical emergency? With four years ‘till an election? Right</blockquo

I want details.

You obviously don’t want my opinion so best ignore my posts. Actually half bottle of wine and some home brewed porter in me so excuse any touchiness hahaha

Perhaps you should give details about what’s required, without the anti Tory blurb.

I absolutely do want your opinion, hence the questions. What do you want him to do or say? What would he have to do to start winning you over to voting Labour?

Well I stated above some of the attitude I’d like to see.
I get that it takes time, but really, up till now all he has done is been a talking head , disagreeing and offering nothing.

Question, guys.

It’s Starmer privy to all the scientific data/advice given to Johnson /Cummings regarding Covid?

In a word no

They’re running the country from Cummings summer house, half the cabinet don’t know WTF is happening on a daily basis. What makes you think they’d show Labour their workings?

Poor quality management is an issue but as for the mess its in – that is totally the tories fault

Nope, no way, you’re not getting that.

NHS is devolved in Scotland as you damn well know, it has been under SNP government control for 13 years now and whilst we see lots of roads and bridges getting cash spaffed on them we are left with substandard crap like QE Hospital and mental health care barely better than south of the border. The NHS is a bloody mess up here as well but don’t pretend we couldn’t have done anything to change that.

Nope aquirrelking

Scotland has a capped budget. the NHS is something like half of all government spending. to spend more on the NHS would have meant huge cuts elsewhere. If the scots government could raise money I will give you that but as they cannot then its totally the tories fault.

the SNP government took one huge decision that made a huge positive impact on the NHS – remove the fake internal market which took 10% of the entire NHS budget to administer

There is very little the scots government could have done beyond what they have – and the NHS in Scotland is significantly better than in england

I get that it takes time, but really, up till now all he has done is been a talking head

The Tory party has a genuinely massive majority. A talking head is pretty much Starmers only option until votes are cast.

Change Labour and actually make it a viable option.
And be a powerful opposition. Someone who offered alternatives that could not be ignored.

If you actually look at opinion polls it seems hes very much turning labour into a viable option and making back ground from the Corbyn era, remember hes got 4 years to make this ground back. A week or so ago he (Kier) was up now its neck and neck again. But thats fact rather than a sweeping generalisation.

Big presser putting the boot into Johnson and co big time with a couple of tasty soundbites – and cleverly being supportive of the right measures so he canot be accused of simply saying no and opposing everything. Very good work

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/13/keir-starmer-urges-pm-to-impose-circuit-breaker-lockdown-on-england

“Why isn’t this guy PM instead?”

I find labour just come across as trying to score political points – Corbyn did it – and now Starmer seems to do from what I’ve seen.

What we actually need opposition to be is full of proper proposals rather than just either mocking the current government or saying we need to spend more when we have a deficit rapidly going the wrong way.

Traditionally I’ve voted Tory but at the last election I voted Lib Dem in the hope there was an option inbetween labour and the tories that might try to do the right thing. Boris Johnson is a joke as PM and SKS doesn’t look a better option to me.

What we actually need opposition to be is full of proper proposals

And what do you expect to happen with the proposals?

Erm – hasn’t he just suggested a proposal, as suggested by the science?