Is that the second tied poll for voting intentions?

Starmer worried about Boris sorting out covid or Christmas might be lost…

Facile.

Is that the second tied poll for voting intentions.

Yes. (Opinium last month.)

How exciting it has become to see Labour level pegging in just two polls against these atrocities.

Is there a Seats projection for that poll?

And, if so, what would it look like excluding Scotland?

How exciting it has become to see Labour level pegging in just two polls against these atrocities.

Maybe we could get a bearded old 70’sthrowback with an allotment to get the Tory’s a 26 point lead back?

That’d be exciting, wouldn’t it?

binners, please…
We’re trying to elevate the tone.
Do join in.

Binners, we all know perfectly well that if Corbyn was getting the exact results that Starmer is, you’d be screaming blue murder. Why not give it a rest eh? He’s not leader any more. BUT HER EMAILS!

I’d always thought of Boris as a seventies throwback as well, like a bit part actor in a Carry On film. It might have been funny once upon a time to do a Benny Hill skit with footage of Boris sped up to match the frenetic music. Only now it would be more appropriate to slow the music down to a crawl to match his apathetic, turgid lethargishness.

Yes. (Opinium last month.)

How exciting it has become to see Labour level pegging in just two polls against these atrocities.

At the risk of going into Binners mode.

Considering the starting point of the last election they’re actually doing far better at this point than I expected.

But then I also didn’t think the governments handling of the pandemic would lead to some sort of overnight political epiphany. I’ve lived most of my life in Tory heartlands, the mind set  of “well, this government is shit but at least they’re not Labour” runs deep.

Can’t say as I’m seeing anyone being “excited” mind you! Who are you perceiving as such?

And, if so, what would it look like excluding Scotland?

Given how low labour are polling in Scotland I doubt there would be any significant difference as labour and tory are only going to get a couple of seats each in Scotland

And, if so, what would it look like excluding Scotland?

Given how low labour are polling in Scotland I doubt there would be any significant difference as labour and tory are only going to get a couple of seats each in Scotland

‘A New Leadership’ will be abbreviated. It sounds a bit fascist/futurist, but ‘Forward to a New Leadership’ projects professionalism, electability and a clerical revolution that will get a grip on the voters in 4 years time. That’s just what we need in a crisis of health, jobs and housing. I can’t wait.

Just saw the Marr interview

Job done in terms of refusing to be drawn on covid and Brexit but clearly evasive and highly polished spin. I can’t see how he can play it any other way so good result. But ‘im not boris’ is a very low bar

When it comes to Brexit might as well just say ‘no comment’. He was invited to side with EU on state aid but didn’t take the bait

Flashes of irritation reminded me of Corbyn, but that could just’ve been Marr needling him

It’s pretty obvious that the Tory’s only line of attack with Starmer is to try and draw him into the flag-waving culture war they’ve been stoking.

I can imagine that It’s causing some pretty serious frustration in Cummings ‘Mission Control’ that he still refuses to take the bait.

He’s rightly not getting drawn on Brexit itself, but criticising Johnson’s previously ‘oven ready’ deal, and the present shambles.

Come ‘No Deal’ in January, things are going to look very different, and with Boris and chums in full ownership of the ensuing chaos, Labour can then take a different approach

Anyone watching Annelise Dodds? I see now why Kier was so keen on her, she makes him look very exciting and charismatic. Labour need to do better than this for the second most important post in the shadow cabinet.

Come ‘No Deal’ in January, things are going to look very different, and with Boris and chums in full ownership of the ensuing chaos, Labour can then take a different approach

even with a deal there will still be a backlog & queues of lorries by mid Jan

(and now it looks like Johnsons WA reneging was just a horrendously misjudged attempt at leverage- I think johnson will be desperate to do a deal)

Labour need to do better than this for the second most important post in the shadow cabinet.

Is she any good at the chancellor work as opposed to acting exciting?
Would have thought that would be more important. We are currently suffering from having an exciting and charismatic person in charge. Turns out doesnt always overlap with competence.

Labour need to do better than this for the second most important post in the shadow cabinet.

Sober, serious man trying to build an air of competence appoints Sober, serious woman trying to build an air of competence

Maybe she could come down a zipwire, waving some flags?

Or have a Special Advisor come up with some catchy three word slogans?

He’s rightly not getting drawn on Brexit itself, but criticising Johnson’s previously ‘oven ready’ deal, and the present shambles.

I absolutely agree that the Labour leader shouldn’t be talking about Brexit itself, and am pleased that you eventually reached the same conclusion.

Maybe she could come down a zipwire, waving some flags?

He doesn’t need gimmicks, but he does need people in his shadow cabinet who people recognise and know a little about what they stand for. This goes for shadow chancellor more than any other post. I take an unhealthy interest in politics and yet I have absolutely no idea where Dodds stands on the pressing issues of the day. Assuming Boris isn’t packed off to retirement she’s going to be up against Sunak in the runup to the next election which quite frankly is going to be a no-contest.

Did you listen to his speech then? A weird one because obviously it’s not really a conference speech, so difficult to gauge

One thing that did seem to be stressed was the need for a reality intrusion in certain elements within the party and an end to the ‘we won the argument’ tosh

That can only be a good thing

I listened but it didn’t really tell me anything that could inform my vote.
I wasn’t expecting it to though and don’t see why it ever would 4 years out of the next election.

It did tell me that Labour are universally crap at getting elected though. 3 election winners in 75 years? Didn’t realise it was that bad.
I also think, that with the clear anti-nationalist agenda, they will struggle to see anything but a minority Labour government in the near future. They won’t give the SNP their independence vote and doubt they will get a coalition majority without it.

I take an unhealthy interest in politics and yet I have absolutely no idea where Dodds stands on the pressing issues of the day.

She’s written plenty… and her approach seems spot on when you read her words. But most people will see/hear her… not read her words… and she clearly is not proficient at this side of politics… so needs removing/replacing whenever it is safe to do so without it turning into a distraction in the media. Compare her with Miliband (sorry again for not voting for him) and Rayner in recent months… she may well have what it takes to run the treasury… but that isn’t where we are… Labour need to connect with the public… she can’t do that.

I didn’t listen to the speech preferring to watch the guardian live blog. From what I can see and from the reactions I think he pitched it about right.

Remeber its the folk who vote / voted tory he needs to reach by and large. Most lefties even if they think he is not radical enough will still vote labour and the other thing he really needs to do is not give the tories propaganda arm any chink in his armour – hence “being proud” of things like his peerage and his patriotism

It seems like he’s prepared to get a bit less timid and do what the Torys do… personal attacks.

He’s bang on with his point about Boris’s (lack of) character, and he’s absolutely right to make a direct comparison with his own record.

And Boris being so thin-skinned will hate this absolutely correct portrayal of him

Absolutely brutal personal attack by Keir Starmer on Boris Johnson, in his virtual conference speech now. Not just going for him over competence, but studs in on his character too. Unexpected. pic.twitter.com/UZ4sKfiECH

— Tom Newton Dunn (@tnewtondunn) September 22, 2020

she may well have what it takes to run the treasury… but that isn’t where we are… Labour need to connect with the public… she can’t do that.

This absolutely. I worry that Starmer appointed her to ensure he wouldn’t be overshadowed. I understand that but labour needs to be firing on all cylinders and shadow chancellor is too important a post to have a shrinking violent in it. It doesn’t need to be someone as aggressive as McDonnell or Brown, but they at least need to have some public presence. Dodds is completely anonymous.

I think in the current climate only the main players will get any significant airtime – so half a dozen cabinet ministers, Starmer and the leaders of the devolved parliaments. there is so much news and reaction to get from them that the news media do not need to go looking for people to get quotes from

I worry that Starmer appointed her to ensure he wouldn’t be overshadowed.

Not a worry of mine as I don’t think that would be the case at all. I do however agree that she doesn’t have what it takes publicly and needs to be quietly replaced.

The difficult bit for Starmer is going to be redefining ‘patriotism’ without putting off his Red Wall Racists that he needs back. I suspect ‘patriotism’ is usually communicated via a headbutt in their worldview.

Daz – getting away from the subject of Anneliese Dodds, what did you think of Starmers speech?

Sir Keir Starmer proclaimed himself Labour’s ‘new leadership’, in his first conference speech this morning.

But nothing could be further from reality. Sir Keir’s leadership is just more of the same old Labour.

He’s advanced Corbyn’s far-left economic plans and continually shown he doesn’t respect the views of ordinary people on crime, immigration and regaining our independence now we’ve left the EU.

Prress release from the tories – this is why Starmer simply cannot do what us lefties want – his only defense against this sort of attack is to not give a hint. Gsalling tho it is its the reality given our right wing press>

By doing what he has done in the sppech he simply makes this sort of attack look rediculous and takes all the sting out of it.

The tediously predictable response from Momentum couldn’t possibly be more tediously Momentumesque. That certainly won’t do Starmer any harm. Quite the reverse.

And, seriously…. slogans and platitudes? Good to see them addressing things with their normal understanding of irony and self-awareness 😀

Momentum not sounding delighted with Keir Starmer’s conference speech. Suspect that may actually help him tbh. pic.twitter.com/Q2BDkoywth

— Pippa Crerar (@PippaCrerar) September 22, 2020

Does anyone know which parts of his speech weren’t showing solidarity with the working class? Is Scattergood really just upset that Starmer is seeking to distance the party from the past, and making it clear that he and his choice of front bench are not in politics to be the eternal opposition?

Beats me.

Momentum have got pissy simply because they don’t have a leader who likes them.

It feels like momentum response was written before the speech.

If they really wanted to damage Starmer they should give him their full backing 🙂

I mean the Tories must just love it. The 1922 committee generally toes the party line.

Labour, well, Momentum are just a right big old help to the whole effort, aren’t they.

In amongst their usual foot-stomping tantrums, they keep gobbing off about splitting from the party and forming their own

I wish they bloody would

There’s no one single thing that would restore the credibility of the labour party more. The bearded one could march them all off into political oblivion to make placards and sign online petitions for ever more

Daz – getting away from the subject of Anneliese Dodds, what did you think of Starmers speech?

Was in a meeting this morning so not seen or read it yet hence the lack of comment. Were there any clues about policy? I get that he’s concentrating on differentiating himself from Corbyn, but at some point he’s going to have to move on and start talking about real stuff. As far as conference speeches go this is going to be the most inconsequential so he could have said anything he liked, and I don’t know why momentum felt compelled to respond.

I did see something about a personal attack on Johnson, which is a very good thing IMO. Labour have always been far too timid on this stuff, they need to get dirty, and play the tories at their own game. It’s one area where I never agreed with Corbyn and his highminded ‘no personal attacks’ pacifism.

Were there any clues about policy?

Mate, we’re in the middle of a pandemic and ploughing towards a no deal brexit, both of which are going to leave the economy in tatters and fundamentally change the nature of our society. And we’re 4 years away from an election

If there were ever a time to absolutely not commit to any specific policies, then this is the dictionary definition of it. Everything is fluid right now in a way this countries economics and politics have never been in peacetime.

and I don’t know why momentum felt compelled to respond

Because they just can’t help themselves. Its what they do. Wave their placards from the sidelines while Tweeting about it to their echo chambers

Specifying policies now would be bonkers

If there were ever a time to absolutely not commit to any specific policies, then this is the dictionary definition of it

Oh I agree, but there is room to signal a direction. Even just an affirmation of his leadership campaign promise to maintain the radical policy agenda would be enough. Climate change hasn’t gone away, inequality hasn’t gone away, our disfunctional and unfair electoral system hasn’t gone away. These all need new solutions where the tired old approach of tax and spend tinkering has failed. Even with covid and brexit, he should be able to say something about these.