chameleon78

just 1 question………………have you got kids??

I was going to write this really long boring response but couldn't be arsed lucky staff at the mag don't do that.

I guess you can't please everyone if you don't like the mag don't buy it but it works out at about 50p a week.

Any supplier offering a full refund can't be that bad really.

Oh and Shaggy any chance of a hot x bun orange juice and bog roll test just for a bit of real world balance……..

Yes, a 4 week old daughter, which probably made me feel so lucky

you serious?

if you don't like the mag, don't buy it. simple

i am and i dont and for the record, you as a cyclist wouldn;t like to be in a job where you test and ride products to do with the sport/hobby that you love doing. If you dont then you my friend need to find some different hobby/sport to do

Its all very good apologising but i know for certain if i said anything like that on a forum/twitter/facebook which defaced our companys name as well as slagging off our customers i would be at very least majorly disciplined and potentially even sacked.

Er, I don't think you mean "deafced", do you son?

And Mark is the publisher; the owner. If he wants to do a Ratner, he can.

Which I don't think he did. It's the nature of criticism that one tends only to hear the negative stuff, which is why this thread paints a worse picture than the reality probably is.

As it is, though I have been a critic in the past – and have set my reasons out ad nauseam previously – I like the feel of somewhething where the producers of the work acknowlegde there is no padding. Of course, if the standard of writing is up to scratch, I shall enjoy it, though I am not prepared to judge it by heft alone.

Blimey, I haven't had time to read the mag yet … got a bit of trolling to do on here first 😉

It's a magazine FFS!!!! To quote MBR "get out and ride"

chameleon78 – Member
Yes, a 4 week old daughter, which probably made me feel so lucky

nice one…. 8)
so concentrate on looking after your own, and dont preach to people about giving to charity.

"get out and ride"

No. Its midnight and pissing it down.

Ton – it was a suggestion not a preach

Jamie – pussy 😉

Er, I don't think you mean "deafced", do you son?

And Mark is the publisher; the owner. If he wants to do a Ratner, he can.

Which I don't think he did. It's the nature of criticism that one tends only to hear the negative stuff, which is why this thread paints a worse picture than the reality probably is.

Typo error dad but being the boss makes it worse. Does his employees now feel that they can do the same since the boss is leading by example??
The issue is that it is criticism mainly for the simple reason that previous issue(s) have seen a decline in volume ( going on references in here) yet this issue still didn't improve. My simple argument isn't about content, volume or the mag itself its simply about the means of how the owners/workers choose to express there feelings about feedback from paying customers

Yawn

you as a cyclist wouldn;t like to be in a job where you test and ride products to do with the sport/hobby that you love doing

to be honest no. to me a hobby is just that. If you painted for a living, would you want to come home and do the same again??

raddoggair..
I really don't want to get drawn into this.. BUT

you are taking issue with how a bloke is dealing with a customer..
in effect.. you are 'in a mood' cos someone is behaving in a way that you would disapprove of if you were the blokes boss… (which you're not)

OR.. you are in a mood cos you wouldn't like to be treated this way of you were the customer in question..

I'm really sorry.. BUT.. horses for courses… I walk into some bars and get a polite reception from the staff.. I walk into others and get called a prick cos my attitude isn't the type that they welcome into their establishment.. that's life.. freedom of choice etc etc etc.

your attitude is very victorian.

everyone has a bad day at work sometimes. no?

you never do yer bugger 😉

raddoggair..
I really don't want to get drawn into this.. BUT

you are taking issue with how a bloke is dealing with a customer..
in effect.. you are 'in a mood' cos someone is behaving in a way that you would disapprove of if you were the blokes boss… (which you're not)

OR.. you are in a mood cos you wouldn't like to be treated this way of you were the customer in question..

I'm really sorry.. BUT.. horses for courses… I walk into some bars and get a polite reception from the staff.. I walk into others and get called a prick cos my attitude isn't the type that they welcome into their establishment.. that's life.. freedom of choice etc etc etc.

your attitude is very victorian.

victorian.. comedy, nice one!!

i'm glad to hear though that you feel that this is acceptable to do to your custom. If Mark had sent a personal e-mail to the said customer then fair enough, answer his queries and feedback on what his expecations are. The fact of the matter he didn't, he chose to express it on the biggest cycling forum in europe ( i think ) and also via twitter.
My attitude isn't victorian, its simple common sense and decency.

For the record, when you walk into these bars where people and staff call you pricks do you return ( on a monthly basis). The answer obviously is no, because as people we expect a standard level of attitude and service. That bar would lose your custom like this mag would lose custom.

I agree with that, showing that level of contempt for customers isn't really on. If a few disgruntled middle managers on the internet upset you that much then you should try working in a call centre!

I was really thinking about canceling my subscription when the mag arrived yesterday, you just convinced me

I think this has been great; its very easy to find faults, and the net makes it easy to complain. It's often less easy for companies or individuals to defend themselves, and sometimes you just have to call people cocks.
I think Marks rant was great, and his apology was a good one too.

STW; made by real people….

Crikey.

The OP simply said in terms to understand

Last year i paid £5 for a 10oz sirlion steak. This year i paid £7 for a 8oz sirlion steak.

paying more for the same on a lot this year though..
oh wait thats not the same is it… 😆

Well i'll still buy it. Head and shoulders above what the others produce. ST is actually a mag that I can read and then re-read. I judge a mag on bath time. I can usually class ST as making my skin prune like and cold, and i aint a slow reader.

Keep up the good work guys, but just take the criticism a little more light heartedly.

If I flew off the handle like that every time someone criticized me or my guys, I'd be in fookin Jupiter's orbit.

haha you can't hide on the internet 😀
.
wish I could call my clients cocks
if I had any that were of course
they're all lovely
:waves:

aye.. maybe I'm wrong.. I'm not a businessman.. but I personally do not begrudge one or two angry outbursts about some sarky comments..

have we actually found evidence that the outbursts weren't tongue in cheek yet?
baaaahhh.. who gives a monkeys..

for the record.. you speaketh silly nonsense about what you presume me to do with regard to a 'standard level of attitude and service' in bars.

in that case my man, enjoy the beer 😛

for the record.. you speaketh silly nonsense about what you presume me to do with regard to a 'standard level of attitude and service' in bars.

this what i thought, that'd you'd frequent bars where they call you 'prick'

I'd be shocked if I walked into my local and the landlord didn't call me something a heck of a lot worse than a prick.. 🙄

I hope he's had his headset fixed by tomorrows ride too

I hope he's had his headset fixed by tomorrows ride too

you clearly have a very special landlord! 🙂

I suppose one day i should read the magazine.

Raddogair – a bit ott. man behaves like a cock then apologises. end of the matter.

The great thing about this thread is the metaphors. What with steaks, microwaves and others. Hilarious.

Someone exercised their freedom of speech. Mark responded … vociferously … (being generous) but later had the good grace to rescind his comments and apologise. Hopefully this should draw to an end a matter that (as a collection of mountain bike enthusiasts) we could best describe as internecine.

Raddogair – a bit ott. man behaves like a cock then apologises. end of the matter.

Your right TJ you prick.

Wait..

I'm sorry

We're cool then !!!

oh dear PSML @ radoggair!!!!!!

havent really sat down to read the mag yet but I agree its one I tend to sit down with after the kids go to bed with a beer and enjoy bit like a good book. TBH I think the mag is a victim of its own sucess we get excellent so often bloody brilliant seems a drop even when its miles a head of the other mags.

Let's end this thread now it's getting tres boring.

STW does fill a niche/gap nicely.

Just wish they'd be more scathing/direct sometimes on product reviews. The commencal where they swapped out the Mazz for the Fox's on the test- I'd have preferred 'what an utter pile of shit'. 8)

Plus theres a gap to report on- kit for mountain bikers on a budget.

Brit Army etc kit is designed for outdoor use right? So why dont we use it more for mountain biking? A mag recently ran a mammoth winter jacket test where the winner was over £250 FFS.

I bought a Brit Army Goretex/DPM jacket (brand new- thanks Skiprat) for £25.

Why spend £100+ on colourful pieces of shit? Not everyone earns 60k+

I wonder what would have happened if any of us had called Mark a cock?

Double standards on the STW forum? Noooooo never…..

Singletrack is by far and away the best MTB mag.
I have some suggestions which would improve it for me.

Bring back Bike Porn

Readers bikes- just pics or a little article about the bike/rider too.

Quick 1 page trail guides: A photo & a map with a loop from an STW writer or sent in by a reader.

Change Long Term tests slightly- the frames picked this year ('cept Benji's Decade) are all much of a muchness & are all going to be good so whats the point? Maybe testers could all have different brakes, BBs, forks, chains, tubeless kits etc etc & in a big end of year issue 'compare and contrast.'

Random ideas for a articles.

Old vs New-
How about testing an old Orange 5 against a new one? Or a 2002 Santa Cruz Superlight vs a 2010 model or even an old Inbred vs a newer one? I'm not talking retro vs modern but just models up to 10 years old. Would be useful to people who can't afford (or justify spending) £3000 on a new bike.

Second Hand Challenge-
2nd hand buying is not mentioned much in Singletrack. A guide would be daft but what about for a bit of fun some 'Top Gear' type challenges ie £300 to spend on a Hardtail, or £500 to spend on a FS which will then be ridden down Fort William or in the Alps or whatever.

OK so most of these suggestions are about bikes- I'm sure some of you who are more interested in riding (eugh! 🙂 could come up with ideas for articles about that-

What about 'rides in your backyard' more? I actually like those. I know 'other' mags have done these but a group photo (with names) of the locals showing STW around along with the route etc would be great.

In my view STW has to either be the mag of the people or a commercial entity. At the moment it's trying to be both, sort of like the Labour party, and it just doesn't work well. We all want the former, but the market won't support it. It's mostly our fault.

Singletrack is by far and away the best MTB mag.

+1

Recent issues aren't as interesting as those from a few years back though.