And also, do you think there is sufficient training and understanding of media law among police officers?

I know you’re asking Munqe-chick, but I would say definitely not. What I know about police powers and photographers is as a result of looking it up on the internet, which I did a while back after seeing the same youtube clip that you linked to earlier on, and having no desire to make a prize prick of myself like they all did. I’ve never had any training or advice about such things (the only tenuously relevant exception being S44 etc Terrorism Act powers)

because some might take this as meaning they have to

some might, but most won’t

You just don’t photograph police officers on the continent do you? Italy and Spain certainly. I thought the reason for that was that their police forces were paranoid, hot-headed, amateurish and violent, and that ours was slightly different. Ach well.

There is no training with regards to media and law, you should know by now it’s all about race and diversity!! The old saying of “knowledge is power” is so true and I would not dream of doing something unless I knew that it was either correct in law or I had a duty to do it, for that very reason looking like a prized plum!

Like the video that Uplink posted!! They clearly have no idea about their powers, as the resident he should’ve just asked them to leave his land (and carried on filming) as when they refused to get off his land they became trespassers and the police would’ve looked a plum!

You can tell neither has a clue what they are talking about! Plus we would get boll**ed for standing with hands in pockets! oh and we can only take ties off with the permission of Inspector (and normally only when it’s cooking hot!).

chumps … give police force a bad name, no wonder people bit** about them.

I know there are “dodgy” coppers

I though you end up as a copper if you weren’t though enough to be a gangster. Uk is getting as bad as France. Is that fred said is true. When I see a cop in the street I change pavement just to be on the safe side. I think I’ll do that in uk as well.

There is no training with regards to media and law,

I think this is a serious problem, actually. What are the educational requirements to become a Copper, again? What qualifications do you need?

I believe that all police should at least be educated in basic law, to A-level standard. They aren’t. The actual knowledge of Law, by yer average Bobby, is woefully poor. I was arrested a while ago, and charged with a particular offence. Solicitor turns up, turns out I’d been charged under the wrong section, and therefore my arrest was invalid. RudeBoy’s outta jail…

A friend of mine was in an argument with a Copper. Copper says; ‘Oh, so you know the Law better than I do, then?’.

Her reply: ‘Yes, actually- I’m a Solicitor’. Oh dear.

But it serves the Governement’s interest, to keep Coppers ignorant. So they don’t question orders, where their actions would be unlawful.

Time for a change. I think many Babylonians would agree. The Police have a responsibility to protect Society, and uphold Law and Order. Better education would significantly enhance their ability to do so.

And we wouldn’t be witnessing stuff like in Uplink’s video clip.

I do agree with some of your points RudeBoy. Due to all the various acts of discrimination you do not have to have any specific education to become a copper. The application procedure now is so pathetic it is unbelieveable! I agree that they need a higher standard. I also agree that the training is so pathetic and we aren’t taught enough law.
I’m sitting my Sergeants exam tomorrow (After 6 months of solid studying) it is unbelievable how much they don’t teach us and a lot of it is learning as we go along!

Again I know there are facetious coppers out there and there are a lot that give us a bad name! I would never say that about knowing the law better than someone else for the very example that you have given here!

In relation to your example of you being nicked, everyone can make mistakes and if there is a small discrepancy in the charge then it can often be corrected at court. So interesting that you got off it!

I do think the police service needs a big re-think in the way they train, the application procedure and specifically WHAT training they focus on. But hey that’s another topic for dicsussion that go on into next year!!!!

Senior officers haven’t cottoned on to the perception is reality facet of modern living. A minority of corrupt/incompetent officers are doing the police service serious damage aided and abetted by the federation who will leap all over an investigative journalist who digs up confirmed dirt with libel writs.
Source here Black Flag

It is only an offence to take a picture IF you are going to use it for terrorist purposes. So paparazzi taking pics, tourists taking pics of coppers these aren’t offences, unless they are going to pass them onto terrorist organisations to use.

But ‘terrorist purposes’ will no doubt be interpreted as including journalists’ pictures of any group involved in any kind of political demonstration. ie. one of the few times when the police might want to be able to get away with bad stuff without it being splashed on the front page of the papers / on the BBC news. They don’t give a damn if anyone takes pictures of a policeman on the beat or whatever, it is policing of political demonstrations that all this is about.

It’s doubly stupid as the events they are using these powers at, typically there are also tons of police taking pictures of journalists to intimidate them. Photographers at protests and use of mobiles, the internet and news organisations to distribute the pictures quickly are one of the few things stopping police just ploughing in there and beating up random people like they are alleged to have done all the time in the good old days.

Joe

Given the fact that the recent anti-terrorist legislation has been so disgustingly misused (Icelanders aren’t terrorists, OK?) I really can’t see how such a piece of legislation would NOT be misused.

I do think the police service needs a big re-think in the way they train, the application procedure and specifically WHAT training they focus on.

I am really glad a member of Her Maj’s Finest has said that. I’ve got every respect for coppers that stand up and question the Status Quo.

I really think out police force would benefit enormously, from being better educated. Police-Community relations would surely be a lot better, and the individual Wooden-Top’s ability to deal with particular incidents and situations, would be greatly improved by increased knowledge of Law.

I may come across a negatively critical of the Police. I do have first hand experience of some shocking behaviour by individual officers, however, I will say the majority of Coppers are ok.

Being a Rozzer is a complex and difficult job. More education, and better training is needed.

But as I’ve said, having an ignorant, docile Force is perhaps of more use to our wonderful Governement…

I’d just like to add that most coppers I came across in my time as a reporter and snapper were friendly, helpful and happy to have their picture taken.

I think there are two kinds of coppers to be honest. There are happy, jovial coppers who wander around dancing with ladies dressed up at carnivals, you’re allowed to take their picture. Then there are vans full of much bigger and less humorous coppers who spend a lot of time down the gym holding big sticks who talk about how many squat thrusts they can do. You’re not allowed to take their picture.

The law just needs to make that clear.

RudeBoy I completely agree with everything your saying. It’s hard being in the police when people do criticise and normally because they have a valid reason and have had a bad/negative experience. It’s just infuriating and frustrating being on the inside when I see corrupt coppers, I see coppers that have NO clue what they are doing, are rude, ignorant and treat members of the public with disgrace but the management do NOTHING about it! The amount of times I have brought up issues with people within the force and nothing is done about it is enormously frustrating.

Redthunder; is that the new Community Support uniform?

I really can’t be bothered with all the ‘taking down my particulars’ and ‘it’s a fair cop’, ‘I’ll come quietly’ jokes. Too obvious.

Oh.

I assumed it was Munque-Chick posting her mugshot here, and not to the “Mugshots” thread ??

would be fun if I could run in heels like that!!

Thanks for all the considered replies to my original post.
Still think the legislation stinks, but nice to know that the serving Coppers who post on here seem to have a really sensible attitude & don’t see it as any kind of licence to harass.

I do a lot of street photography in Manchester and have, on occasion, asked Coppers if I could take their photo (the ‘Decisive Moment’ often needs a helping hand :-)). Only on has ever refused, but was very polite about it!

Munqe-chick, you seem to have a great approach to what I’m sure is a very frustrating job – hope the exam went well.

I had a conversation about this with an officer of the law a few weeks ago, its a shame he didn’t come across as well as you Munqe-chick.

In fact it was a very disturbing conversation. 😯

Did he do something with his truncheon to make your eyes pop out like that?

Only times I’ve ever been stopped were:

1. York station a few weeks ago – a very polite station manager asked what I was taking pictures of, so I showed him. He was fine about it and asked me to send him a CD of the pictures once photoshopped.

2. Local garden centre, taking pictures of their Christmas Lights about 9.30pm. Staff member came out and started shouting and swearing at me, threatening to call the police. I informed him in Anglo Saxon that he was welcome to as I was doing nothing illegal. Thinking about it, I think they were possibly trading outside legal hours and were a bit worried I was from the trading standards.

3. Taking long exposure night shots on the canal. Approached by irate local
convinced I was taking pictures of his bedroom window. As I was using a very wide lens, you could hardly see his house, never mind his window. Happy once I showed him he pictures.

Having a large heavy camera on a tripod to hand is always useful on such occasions!

I wonder why they don’t like being photographed?

Amsterdam’s finest?
Doughnut poisoning?

This lot didn’t seem too bothered! I did ask first though.

http://www.cosybike.co.uk/Resources/cosybikepolis.jpeg

I think there are two kinds of coppers to be honest. There are happy, jovial coppers who wander around dancing with ladies dressed up at carnivals, you’re allowed to take their picture. Then there are vans full of much bigger and less humorous coppers who spend a lot of time down the gym holding big sticks who talk about how many squat thrusts they can do. You’re not allowed to take their picture.

That’s funny, but in reality even some of the tough-nut ones like to get their picture in the paper to show their gran.