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  • Shimano Singletrack Classic Weekender: Downhill and Timing
  • Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    Last Friday saw us put on a Dry Run of the Shimano Singletrack Classic Weekender. The main focus of the day was the Downhill event.

    The course is a different course this year. It’s about 80% the same as last year’s with some alternative lines thrown in.

    This year’s Shimano Singletrack Classic Weekender is the year of the Bonus. There’ll be some time bonuses awarded to those riders who opt to undertake certain lines and obstacles on the multi-line DH course.

    Here’s one of the Matts from 18 Bikes GoPro footage from his run down the DH course last Friday…

    IMPORTANT INFORMATION ABOUT THE DH TIMING

    The Weekender is co-funded by Lancashire County Council. Due to budget cutbacks we’ve had to change our timing system.

    The bottom line is that this year’s timing system relies on humans rather than lasers.

    The start line is an automatic 5-beep countdown thingy (think Ski Sunday). It’s a 5-beeps-then-you-can-go system. The finish line is a human being stopping a clock as the rider’s front wheel crosses the line.

    So this is not going to be 1/100th second accurate. We estimate a reaction factor of +/- 2/10ths of a second.

    The timing will be sufficiently accurate in the grand scheme of things ie. a 1/10th of a second here or there isn’t going to affect where you finish in the overall combined results (DH + Trials + XC).

    But we are aware that some riders’ main ‘thing’ at the Weekender is the DH.

    If you think not having a laser-accurate system is going to impair the Weekender experience please leave a comment below.

    Or if you think it’s okay, leave a comment too. We need to gauge what people think.

    stilltortoise
    Free Member

    Still not sure if I’m coming this year but this certainly wouldn’t put me off. It gives me something else to blame if I’m no good 😉

    DrP
    Full Member

    Sometime I’m so fast, even a laser isn’t quick enough to catch me…..

    DrP

    EDIT – just watched to vid too – that course looks really good!!

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    portlyone
    Full Member

    Can I do the timing?

    PS I take bribes 😉

    nosedive
    Free Member

    human timing is fine for me, but then I will be slow so Im not really assed

    MadBillMcMad
    Full Member

    Fine by me.

    BTW. Course looks excellent.

    cp
    Full Member

    Human timing fine. Possibly doing it… just watched that video – does look great fun!!! May have to enter 🙂

    D0NK
    Full Member

    tailgunner vid is disorientating, quite wierd. If I make it to this yes human timing will be fine for me. The weather for the event will be the same as the vids, wont it? 😈

    Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    Um…

    Taff
    Free Member

    Looks like an awesome weekend. Really fancy it just don’t fancy a 5hour drive!

    fieldy
    Free Member

    The course was good, enjoyed the day. As for the manual timing…it worked well on the day so don’t see any problems!! You’ll need to keep Sonny and Andy off the beer the night before though 😀

    Ben did you keep the timings from Friday? wouldn’t mind a copy of them to embarrass a mate!! but then again he’ll probably read this anyway 😕

    By the way I was the old guy on the GT with the spesh enduro front end.

    matthew_h
    Free Member

    C+P from the article on the front page:

    Ben, you already know my feelings on this and I’m guessing that this consultation has arisen from the comments that were aired on Friday. I’ve chatted with a few people about the timing and the consensus amongst them seems to be that it is a definite negative to not have proper light-beam timing for the DH section of the Weekender and that it may even put a few of them off from entering. I think the push-button timing is fine for a bit of a doss in the park with your mates but for a proper DH race that we are paying to enter then it is not really good enough.

    I know the emphasis of the Weekender is generally relaxed but we punters are still there to race and that usually means racing each other. Bragging rights being the only real prize for the vast majority of entrants.

    If you look back through the previous years’ results, there are a large number of private battles that have been settled by well under two tenths of a second. For instance, last year’s DH winner won by only 0.17 seconds and I lost two places by a mere 0.03 of a second. These results were immediately accepted due to the accuracy of the light-beam timing but the push button timing would just not be accurate enough to separate.

    The lack of live timing and not finding out your own time until everyone else has finished is also not really that great.

    I don’t want to sound negative or obstructive and understand the cost implication of proper timing but if you’re going to run a time trial event then you need accurate timing to make it worth it for the people paying.

    The Tap timing will be more than adequate for the XC side of things as your position at the finish is the point.

    totalshell
    Full Member

    i think the whole event is run under the banner of fun not serious competition with cash fame and gurls as reward to someone who is 0.03 seconds faster..
    so for me a grandfather clock would be fine..sun dial at a push.

    Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    matthew_h – C+P reply! 🙂

    “The lack of live timing and not finding out your own time until everyone else has finished is also not really that great.”

    I’m fairly certain that on the day itself, people will be able to see their time almost instantly.

    All your other comments are fair enough and will be discussed.

    As mentioned above, it’s ultimately a cost-saving decision. We’d like to have light-beam timing as much as anyone.

    But if we do go for light-beam timing, looking at the current Weekender balance-sheet, something else will have to give (car park security, first aid).

    matthew_h
    Free Member

    If the Tap timing guys can sort the live timing and instant results thing then that is definitely a good step in the right direction.

    bigsam
    Free Member

    How will the system work with people getting over taken on their runs, ie, a rider who finishes ahead of the guy who started before him? Anyhow im sure it’ll be a great weekend 😀

    Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    Bigsam – the system is actually pretty techy clever (despite the finger-button-finish) and it can handle riders finishing out of sequence, or even not finishing at all (DNF) etc 🙂

    bigsam
    Free Member

    sounds great then, realy looking forward to it now, last year was awsome 🙂

    DaveyBoyWonder
    Free Member

    Course looks ace. Might have to go and get some practise in ASAP!

    FWIW, I raced some of the early Project Hamsterley races which had walkie talkies and stop watch timing and to be honest, it was crap. Could work it out with people stopping/overtaking etc. I know you say this is covered Ben but it really needs to be 100% watertight otherwise theres going to be a lot of pissed off people – I know I will be if I overtake someone (however likely that might be!) and my time ends up being my time + some slower rider who set off 30 seconds before me.

    What about a cheaper system. Like those freelap (?) things?

    Anyway, sure it’ll be ace. Looking forward to it. Like someone else has said, make sure that weather is booked! I’ve seen the video from last year 😯

    roberthamer
    Free Member

    Tap Timing and 100% reliable hmmmmmmmmm

    But if we do go for light-beam timing, looking at the current Weekender balance-sheet, something else will have to give (car park security, first aid).

    how about the free entries for your trade mates and the STW staff “rider” 😉

    bogs
    car park security 24hour
    first aid (day time)
    race numbers
    race timing
    tape, signs and posts
    marshals vests
    cable ties and miscelleneous bits
    uplift/downlift trailer

    what else are you paying for from entries and the LA funding?

    Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    “what else are you paying for from entries and the LA funding?”

    not a lot more things. your list is good.

    just need to add..

    water
    public liability insurance
    t-shirts
    posters/flyers
    AA signing

    these 14 things do add up though we’re afraid.

    Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    “I know you say this is covered Ben but it really needs to be 100% watertight”

    It is.

    Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    The weather is pencilled in btw 😉

    I’m sure we’ll get (some) sunshine..

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    Used Stopwatch timing for one of the winter Inners Push up races. Slight misgivings to start but the times seemed good. A little more pressure than doing a normal DH start but worked out well in the end.

    Not coming as I’m not in the country any more but wish I could. Wouldn’t put me off too much as it’s the same for everyone.

    roberthamer
    Free Member

    AA signing

    doesn’t everyone know where it is now? 😉

    posters/flyers

    I thought it was download your own like last year 😀

    are you going to do the massive sign in the quarry again?

    t-shirts

    one for everyone? they aren’t mentioned in the blurb

    anything for the marshals?
    are they working with mobiles or radio’s (do they work in a quarry full of rock?)

    I’m sure you can squeeze the budget to get proper DH timing 😀

    Ben_Haworth
    Full Member

    Posters for North West bike shops to try and get more ‘local’ riders and boost race entry numbers in a tough/competitive year for races.

    Marshall goodie bags courtesy of Shimano aye.

    Marshalls all working with radios.

    T-shirts for all racers aye. To be announced with the other Shimano news shortly.

    Maybe we can squeeze budget. The current entry numbers say ‘no’ though :-/

    roberthamer
    Free Member

    tough/competitive year for races

    the loss of some of the No-Fuss events and the collapse of the Welsh XC series and other event cancellations has been covered indepth on here hasn’t it though

    roberthamer
    Free Member

    Marshalls all working with radios

    string and cups? shout?

    totalshell
    Full Member

    seems like theres a call for spage age technology for stone age pricing.. i d rather have a t shirt than a time accurate to two tenths of a second..

    brant
    Free Member

    What’s the price difference. Perhaps a new sponsor could cover it?

    roberthamer
    Free Member

    brant – Member
    What’s the price difference. Perhaps a new sponsor could cover it

    sounds like an offer to me “El Guapo” timing 😉

    roberthamer
    Free Member

    or find a timing system on DX, they seem to sell everything

    or see if Troutie could knock something up

    D0NK
    Full Member

    Bragging rights being the only real prize for the vast majority of entrants.

    If you look back through the previous years’ results, there are a large number of private battles that have been settled by well under two tenths of a secondsounds like these people need to enter a proper downhill race and buy a skinsuit if tenths of a seconds count for bragging rights 🙂

    For most I’d have thought within a second or so is fine.

    Rik
    Free Member

    Free t-shirts for everyone

    I thought free t-shirts were a perk if you are a premier member? As your not doing discounted entry fee this year?

    Rik
    Free Member

    Got to agree with everything MatthewH is saying about the event.

    DaveyBoyWonder
    Free Member

    As longs its 100% Ben. I’ll have my pitchfork in the car ready 😉

    Oh and:

    I lost two places by a mere 0.03 of a second

    No, it sounds like two people were 0.03 seconds faster than you so you didn’t ‘lose’ the places…

    matthew_h
    Free Member

    Just seen this on the @stweekender twitter:

    “UPDATE: there will now be laser accurate timing at the Weekender. Thanks to the lovely guys at MIJ Timing :-D”

    Good stuff. Guess that keeps everyone happy. Those who want accurate timing like me and those who aren’t too bothered.

    Nice one Weekender Team.

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