Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 41 total)
  • Second opinion/what should i have done better- helping after an assault
  • Northwind
    Full Member

    Just going to type a big block of text here, feel free to ignore… And asking for a little patience/tolerance aforehand… Er, odds of the other person being on this forum seem pretty slim but obviously if you are, do what you will- report it or let me know if you want it deleted or whatever, your opinion is more important…

    Anyway. TLDR version, at a gig last night, a girl got attacked in the crowd, I didn’t witness it but helped afterwards and though I’m happy I did, and sure I did some good, I feel a bit like maybe I could have done better… What do you reckon? This is all as honest as I can make it but it was pretty confused and I might have misinterpreted some of it (as you will see, from the bits that I know I did…)

    Long version is long

    At a big gig (Biffy at the AECC), down the front- moshpits and bouncing and all very physical and joyous, but during a song I heard someone screaming over and over, sounding really panicked/hysterical. Found the person and figured out it was just the same words over and over, “he tore my tshirt”, and pointing into the mob, absolutely spaced out and white eyed, very shocked. Everyone else avoiding eye contact and just looking embarrassed.

    I misread, and thought it was a young boy, about 13 or 14, So my assumption was “first gig, doesn’t really know how it all works, aw, got his favourite tshirt ripped” sort of thing, so I stepped in to do the old-hand stuff. Other people did it for me when I was figuring it out, dusting you off after you got in deeper than you planned or discovered that what looks like 500 people bouncing in perfect unity is actually pretty much a disaster area… And I’ve done it quite often before, especially at festivals and arena shows where things can feel pretty out of hand.

    ANYWAY. I got fairly into “his” face to engage, and put a friendly arm on the shoulder and started with “Hey, you’re OK! it happens, we all take a knock sometimes at these things, don’t worry!” sort of thing, then suddenly realised I was wrong, it was a girl- tiny, but maybe late teens, maybe 20. I guess I’m pretty stupid sometimes.

    Got out of her and a bystander that some guy had grabbed her in the pit by the hair and tried to rip her tshirt off, it was ripped halfway down, and then ran off when she started screaming.

    So changed tack pretty fast, (hands off!) but carried on with it’s OK, you’re safe, he’s gone, are you hurt? Would you recognise him? Can you see him (In all honesty, I wanted to find him and **** him up, some of this was not well motivated.) Just rapidfiring questions to get reactions to get her back in the room basically, not so much talking down as just talking, it seemed the thing to do, and I think it worked. Where are your friends, sort of thing. Lots of “it’s OK, you’re not hurt, he’s gone, you’re safe, he’s not coming back”, nothing very clever, reassurances. We talked- shouted over the band- a little like this, her mostly just one word answers, but as soon as the crowd started bouncing again she was freaking again so I pretty much just told her we were getting out, and steamed us both out full speed. (I’m not big but you know, you can go fast through a crowd if you know how and you’re motivated)

    Anyway… Out of the mob at the back of the crowd, in more normal space, she calmed a little, and she wasn’t hurt. Understandably she declined my sweaty shirt (I didn’t mention, I already had it off), then I remembered I had some safety pins with me (I use them to pin up my pockets at gigs after losing car keys one time) so she got her shirt pinned together and covered up etc and straight away that soothed her a lot… I tried to get her to go to security or to medical but she didn’t want to (I understand the reasoning I think). She was calling her friends but not getting an answer, which is kind of to be expected.

    And she started to seem really uncomfortable with me, which I also totally understand, since I’m some random shirtless guy probably twice her age and way bigger than her and she’s already been attacked by some other random guy…

    So I figured, after a little while, it’s not my place to force help on her or tell her what to do. I wasn’t happy that she was in a particularly great state of mind but she wasn’t collapsing and was improving, and starting to seem embarassed which I took as a positive… Though thinking back, I’m not so sure, maybe it was just because she was so much better than she had been that I felt like that. There were a lot of people around, so when she started really pointedly telling me to go back into the crowd I thought, that’s probably the best thing to do. It felt seriously uncomfortable staying but I’m an awkward person sometimes so I don’t know if that was the right feeling- went from no time to think, to having time to overthink… I pointed her out to 2 sane looking girls nearby and asked them to keep an eye on her then went back into the crowd.

    But almost immediately I felt like i’d screwed up and just taken an easy option when it was offered, and should have stayed with her til she found her friends, or talked her into going to security, or I don’t know- watched her creepily from 20 feet away or something. Sure I was a random stranger but so was everyone else. No chance of finding her again though, I wasn’t sure where we were in the room. Not entirely sure what I’d have done if I’d known where to find her. And maybe that’s an excuse anyway.

    Soooooo. Critique and improve my intervention, STW. I’m happy I did good. I’m really glad I got involved, though obviously I wish I’d clocked the situation better initially, I’d have started differently! (Usually I can tell men and women apart!).

    But it left me feeling like I ran out on her a bit and that I didn’t finish the job. In 20 years of doing gigs I’ve got involved in a lot of messes and bailed people out and been bailed out, and I thought that’s all this was, routine stuff- but though I know this happens I’ve never seen it before… this one has spun me out a bit and I guess I really want to know, what would rock show Jesus do? If it happened again (and this is cowardly but I hope it doesn’t, it was no fun) I could do the same again and it’d be net good but I suppose I want to know what to do better

    (I did at least manage to avoid going “woah! Sorry! Thought you were a prepubescent boy!”)

    Sorry, that’s really rambly, I’m kind of figuring out my own mind here as well. I have talked to actual humans too but STW and writing is good for rambling and slower thinking.

    Stoner
    Free Member

    then I remembered I had some safety pins with me (I use them to pin up my pockets at gigs

    I love you.

    As for your actions I think you put more thought into how to be a good samaritan than I would in such a situation. I don’t think you have anything to second guess yourself about. Bravo.

    And I still love you. That’s my kind of ocd 😉

    Junkyard
    Free Member

    HArd to tell but the main thing is you did something – we can all thing of better things after an event

    Perhaps have got security yourself to make sure she was ok assuming they had female security there somewhere??

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    Kahurangi
    Full Member

    What he said 😉

    So hindsight reveals that you might have been able to play it differently, but you helped out when others wouldn’t, you read that she was maybe feeling a bit uncomfortable and didn’t force her to have you looking after her.

    Well done.

    bikebouy
    Free Member

    Nah, good call. Helped when it was needed, comfortable situation gained then got out when your services were no longer needed.

    Well done Dad.

    No, honestly, well done. Should be more folks like you around in this world.

    RustyMac
    Full Member

    Just got to the bottom of all that, can’t believe something like that happened in Aberdeen, sounds like you did the right thing though.

    davidtaylforth
    Free Member

    should of kissed her

    seosamh77
    Free Member

    you got her away from danger, best you can do, if she didn’t want help after that, not alot you could do. You were right to point her in the direction of a couple of female stangers, if she didn’t want to go to security.

    Tbh you did your best, I wouldn’t fret about it. well done.

    iainc
    Full Member

    First half ideal, once at back of crowd perhaps getting security and handing it all over may have been better with hindsight. You could then have moved on, no awkwardness and she’d have been in safe hands

    codybrennan
    Free Member

    You done good there, NW.

    BTW- you’re an awesome chap. Always thought so, reinforced this view tonight. Your instincts are good.

    seosamh77
    Free Member

    iainc – Member
    First half ideal, once at back of crowd perhaps getting security and handing it all

    bit harsh, she’s said no security, if he went to get them, she’d have dissappeared most likely.

    seosamh77
    Free Member

    iainc
    Full Member

    Yeah, fair point, wasn’t meant to be harsh

    martinhutch
    Full Member

    You did what you could, and are very much like my nan in the constant availability of safety pins and whatnot “just in case”. So thumbs up from me. 🙂

    BigButSlimmerBloke
    Free Member

    forcing help on someone who doesn’t want it can be the worst thing to do, but accepting that can be the hardest.
    imo, you did right and did what you could – well done

    Superficial
    Free Member

    It sounds like although you did the right thing, you probably appeared like exactly the person she didn’t want to be around (male, unknown to her, sweaty, half naked). So I don think there’s much more you could have done. Staying sounds like it probably would have been awkward/borderline creepy. You got her out of trouble which counts as a good deed.

    Lol @ safety pins though

    perchypanther
    Free Member

    If my teenage daughter had returned from a gig and told the same tale I would be applauding you.

    Apart from the taking your shirt off. Nice gesture, well meant but, in hindsight, perhaps not the best move.

    bearnecessities
    Full Member

    Shirt was already off by my reading.

    Still, yes, you failed at every turn and could have done everything better. 🙂

    You helped her massively and given the situation, couldn’t have acted any more effectively. Maximum man points.

    Northwind
    Full Member

    Thanks guys… This is daft but I actually got a wee bit upset typing it out, and when I spoke to other people I got a bit defensive which usually means I think I’ve done something wrong. codybrennan says my instincts are good and hopefylly they are, but let me think about things and it all goes tits up 😆 Probably just as well I ran off before I really had a chance to have thoughts. Mostly I’m bloody angry that it happened at all I think and displacing it a bit, I have a pretty naive hippy optimism about festivals and gigs maybe, like everyone’s a good guy at a gig…

    I think asking here made me realise I want to learn a bit more about how to do stuff like this properly, I work with students in a non-teaching role so it could be useful for that, and in real life maybe. Not specifically the assault side, more the “horribly upset person” stuff. Maybe i can do this through work since we have professional councillors, so, I’ll see about that and some good can come from it. I can’t first aid or anything, should see about that too, I realised I don’t like not knowing. **** all use being someone who’ll get involved if you don’t know how.

    More importantly, I don’t understand why everyone doesn’t do the safety pin thing! Punks almost got it right but were too anarchic to do up their pockets, so they all lost their keys, it’s why they were so angry. The last time I didn’t bother for a jumping-around show, I got bloody pickpocketed at brixton academy. My and a mate once planned out a line of gig trousers with reinforced zippable pockets, while drunk. Maybe Brant could make them.

    mangoridebike
    Full Member

    Well played Northwind

    And a business idea to boot 🙂

    funkmasterp
    Full Member

    You did the right thing. Calmed her down, got her out of the pit and fixed her T-shirt likes some kind of gig Magyver.

    iainc
    Full Member

    Northwind, you did a grand job. A fine line between helping and supporting and being intrusive, which is for most of us, impossible to get right. Also, the line moves between 13/14 yr olds and young adult, which again, is hard to call in many situations. Can often be rock and a hard place so your thoughts are probably normal !!

    Safety pins are genius 😀

    TimothyD
    Free Member

    As a diabetic I’ll ask if somebody wants a Jelly Baby, but I can’t think of anything you could have done better. Good work in actually stepping in to help.

    thegreatape
    Free Member

    Bearing in mind this…

    absolutely spaced out

    … then I don’t think there’s any reason to evaluate your behaviour on the basis of her reaction. You saw someone in bother and tried to help them – nothing wrong with that.

    alpin
    Free Member

    did good, OP.

    ulysse
    Free Member

    You da man!
    Tough call in that situation and we can second guess and shoulda coulda woulda after the event.

    TimothyD
    Free Member

    Keep in mind you were the ‘only’ person who stepped in to help.

    jamj1974
    Full Member

    I think you did well.

    mikewsmith
    Free Member

    Did well, bank the Karma and head on to the next job but don’t forget to replenish those safety pins

    tjagain
    Full Member

    I can’t see much more you could have done bar perhaps tell seecurity

    gordimhor
    Full Member

    You heard someone in distress and helped her Northwind. That’s to be commended.

    senorj
    Full Member

    I think that if there were more folk like you, it’d be a better world.
    Glad you didn’t find him though..

    Btw how many times has the safety pin opened in your pocket and pricked your finger?

    ebennett
    Full Member

    You did good, well done for stepping in when others wouldn’t!

    FWIW your reaction afterwards sounds pretty much the same as I have in situations like that – overanalyze, overthink, come up with some ‘perfect’ way of having handled it, and then beat yourself up because you didn’t do that!

    stevenmenmuir
    Free Member

    No wonder she chased you off, I’ve only seen you fully clothed, the thought of you topless, skinny, fag paper skinned Scots blokes should never, EVER, take their taps aff. Other than that you did good.

    bikebouy
    Free Member

    Northwinds washing line last week..

    DezB
    Free Member

    Musta ruined the bloody gig for you..!

    Only thing I’d say, is it’s security’s job to sort this kind of thing out, so maybe you should’ve made sure she spoke to them. Can’t force anything on people though, so well done for sacrificing your enjoyment to help someone else. Pretty sure I wouldn’t have, price of tickets these days!

    midlifecrashes
    Full Member

    Sounds to me like you did great by her, but left yourself wide open if she decided to turn against you or it got misinterpreted when handing over to security. Not easy to do in the heat and noise but I’d say getting her handed over to security to sort out as soon as would have been the absolute best option.

    allan23
    Free Member

    I’d probably have done similar. Apart from the T-shirt being off, no one needs to see that these days.

    With hindsight I’d have probably been wondering if I should have reported to security.

    I’d be tempted to drop a mail to the venue as they would want to know, if they get a lot of reports they can arrange security for it.

    Not something I ever thought would happen but a couple of female friends who like to go to bands have recently mentioned creepy blokes copping a feel in the crowd. One has a kick that could fell a horse and uses it.

    DezB
    Free Member

    Not something I ever thought would happen but a couple of female friends who like to go to bands have recently mentioned creepy blokes copping a feel in the crowd.

    There’s been reports of this going back years. Perves get everywhere – venues should have cctv in case of reports.

    TimothyD
    Free Member

    I’ve sometimes thought the 90’s fashion for baby doll dresses and boots (in particular) could be a useful thing for females at gigs. A girl at school kicked an errant youth in the shin so hard with her boot I heard the thud from 20 feet away. Shouldn’t be something which needs thinking about though.

    Hope the girl North Wind helped isn’t put off going to future gigs…

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