SB66 vs Rocket which one

Home Forum Bike Forum SB66 vs Rocket which one

Viewing 45 posts - 1 through 45 (of 47 total)
  • SB66 vs Rocket which one
  • Premier Icon ndg
    Subscriber

    I’ve done the rounds, demo’d 11 different bikes including the Cotic today and it’s between these two. They both pedal up well and descend better, but I can’t separate them in my mind. Price difference isn’t a big issue – there are 2012 yeti’s available for a little more than the Cotic.

    Does any one have longer term experience of the two – issues that may help sway a decision?

    Cheers

    MoseyMTB
    Member

    The SB-66 is very pretty. The rocket is very pretty.

    I’d buy a 66 tomorrow.

    geetee1972
    Member

    Not ridden either so this is purely speculative. The SB66 is perhaps posher and comes with a very recognised name that a lot of people lust after. It’s a better executed construction if not better executed design.

    And yet the Rocket is still the I would end up with. It’s, what the word, ‘tidy’. It’s not too much and not to little and its got a low BB and I like that.

    Rocket all the way… steel has a far better fatigue life and is easier to repair (though unlikely to need it) on the flipside, SB66s are known for cracking

    STATO
    Member

    steel has a far better fatigue life

    What about the glue used to hold the shock mount on?

    What about the glue used to hold the shock mount on?

    Dreamliner aside, glue does pretty well in planes, not to mention ALL carbon EVER!!

    Stevelol
    Member

    Rocket, looks cooler and doesn’t have to be ridden in anger to get the most of it.

    M1llh0use
    Member

    Those lotus Elise’s that are glued together don’t seem to do badly…

    mmel
    Member

    ndg – Good to meet you today, thoroughly enjoyed my Rocket experience.

    I’ve got the transition bandit on my list of bikes to ride before I commit, but for some reason the Yeti doesn’t grab me. Not sure why? Going to be having a go on 29″ full suss as well next week but I’m fairly sure that’s not for me. One thing is for sure – if I do go Rocket I won’t be fitting Magura forks. Oh and I need a large!

    Now, where am I gonna find those 2012 Rev’s?

    Premier Icon ndg
    Subscriber

    mmel – I had a play with my magura’s when I got home, couldn’t get them to lock up like that so I think there may be a problem with Cy’s pair?

    mmel
    Member

    Perhaps, though to be fair they were a lot better on the last decent when they had less air in them

    Premier Icon Mal-ec
    Subscriber

    The rocket has better clearance at the back for bigger tyres/mud.

    STATO
    Member

    So we are agreed, the glue is fine as proven by all the examples given, examples of alu stuff working fine… well thought out argument there boys.

    In many instances alu works fine, albeit with the limitations of fatigue life; however, SB66s still crack, whilst Rockets, fittingly, Rock.

    andeh
    Member

    How much are the relative costs of replacing the bearings?

    wrecker
    Member

    Rockets a fair bit heavier is it not?
    Steel cracks, too.

    Premier Icon johnhe
    Subscriber

    The SB66 is much more drool worthy IMO.

    Premier Icon timraven
    Subscriber

    Love my Rocket, didn’t get to try a 66, but tried a few others. Rocket better IMHO, of course.

    nodrog2
    Member

    Biased also as I own a Rocket but they really do handle very well. Super agile, great on the steep stuff and they pedal really well (explode out of corners). So much better than the MkII Nomad I was riding previously. Haven’t tried a 66 but I do know someone who as cracked 3 back ends on the Alu version.

    daveh
    Member

    I’ve done the rounds, demo’d 11 different bikes

    ndg – I’m considering a similar purchase, I’d be very interested to hear which bikes you’ve tested and what you thought of them.

    geetee1972
    Member

    The SB66 is much more drool worthy IMO.

    It may be, but the Rocket is still the one I’d take home. Sometimes the hotest babe in the room isn’t the one you’d have the most fun with….

    Love my Rocket… Never ridden a cotic before I got this, just took a punt. Very glad I did.

    Did look at the the SB66 though it is very pretty, liked the covert too.

    Premier Icon ndg
    Subscriber

    daveh, I’m no seasoned bike tester, all of my previous bikes have been bought unridden (currently on a 2005 Orange 5), but my I’ve scrawled down my impressions below. I’m an okay rider, in the faster group going down in my club (though there are no DHers in our club!), mid pack going back up, ride trail centres, peaks, long mynd, swinley etc. I’m 5’11” and rode a large in all the bikes except the Cotic which I rode in L and M.

    Banshee Prime
    Really liked this bike – rolled well and was chuckable for a 29er – worth a ride if you go 29er Good value too from memory. The lacquered raw finish on the Banshees looked great.

    Banshee Rune
    Super plush pillow of a bike, probably great if you’re riding big stuff, but way too much for an ‘everthing with an uphill’ bike. I struggled to get it off the ground on my test ride, and found it really draggy on the flat – not for me, so I exclude the SC Nomad as too similar

    Banshee Spitfire
    This was much more like it, really snappy and fun, I just wanted a shade more capability and the SB66 was more confidence inspiring.

    Spec Stumpjumper 29er
    Just not for me this one, seemed quick, but not fun

    Trek Remedy
    Felt too on top of the bike, and thus a bit nervous, quick though.

    Santa Cruz Tallboy LT
    Didn’t get on with this bike for some reason, it didn’t seem to have very good small bump compliance, but I wonder if that was shock setup – I was going to re ride it with less air, but decided that 29ers weren’t for me after demo’ing a mix.

    Santa Cruz Blur LT
    I like the suspension feel on this – good small bump compliance, not too much bob uphill, it was just the short TT that put me off, I felt far too cramped

    Yeti SB66
    This was the first bike I tested, and I immediately gel’ed with it, was the equivalent of a hot hatch – egging you on to go faster, giving you loads of confidence. The faster you went the more you got out of it. It pedalled really well up hill even with the propedal off. I re-rode it at the Leisure lakes demo day as I had some spare time and still got the same feeling coming off the other bikes. The first bike I rode had Devilles fitted and the second had fox 32’s. The BOS were really nice – I’d have them if they weren’t so expensive! The 32’s were fine, but were a little flexy in comparison.

    Yeti SB95
    Similar to the 66 but not as quick to change direction, it rolled over ruts very well and could be made to go where you wanted, but was happier to just steamroller a line through the trail. Easier going on the flat though. If I were less aggressive down hill it’d be between this and the Prime.

    Cotic Rocket
    Much like the SB66 this pedalled really well up and felt great down. The Large was spot on for me with a 60mm stem (I was riding Cy’s bike). I’m not convinced the forks were working properly though, they seemed to be locking up on the bushings. Cy had the Vipr shock fitted and I probably used only 75% of the travel with the sag set right, I suspect the compression tune on it suits a more aggressive rider than me (Cy)! The medium I rode was definitely too short for me both in length and height, and made my back hurt in fairly short order. The narrower bars also didn’t suit going down, I felt much less confident. The CTD shock felt better for me though – although I did pinch flat twice within 200m and didn’t think I was riding harder than on the large.

    Premier Icon ndg
    Subscriber

    Pastherizla – I think we met on the Birmingham urban ride. You don’t happen to be up Cannock at the weekend do you? The only thing I didn’t really get a sense of on the Rocket test was it’s ride on more groomed trails – it was all nice natural stuff.

    I’m up there next Sunday (24th)…

    I want a rocket sooo much and they are out of stock in short ass sizes 🙁

    That’s the one for me.

    daveh
    Member

    Thanks for that, very interesting. From your description we sound similar riders and looking for similar things. I’d love to do some test rides as you have but with baby duty barely have the time to ride my own bike!

    I’m not familiar with Banshee bikes so will have to look them up, the differences in travel/geometry should give me a good clue. I’ve never ridden a 29er (bar my CX bike) but know enough about me and my riding not to be interested (I ride for fun not speed). I do like the look of the rocket but the price and weight put me off a bit, a thread on here including the rocket got me into the genesis grapil. With it’s new lower pricing the 20 is tempting me!

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    Thanks for coming up at the weekend fellas. Was good to get some riding in and get the demo fleet out there. Sorry you found the Maguras on my bike a bit weird. I came to that conclusion myself last Thursday but the new ones are grease lubed so I couldn’t do a service on them. I’ll get them over to Neal at Veloexpert today to get sorted.

    Couple of points –

    – Weight-wise, the SB-66 aluminium is same claimed weight as the Rocket.
    – I wouldn’t be so surprised at not getting full travel on our demo loop. The limestone descent is pretty rocky, but in the conditions we had on Saturday (i.e. very slippery) you won’t have been going all that fast. The fast swoopy descent isn’t that rough. I wouldn’t expect to bottom out the bike on that loop.

    Premier Icon ndg
    Subscriber

    Cy,

    I had a play with my Magura’s when I got home and I just couldn’t get them to do the same thing – hopefully a check over will see them right.

    Agree on the weight front – nothing in it, the rocket is perfectly competitive. Something Paul said on Saturday also occured to me – that the Vipr only gives the right amount of travel for the situation, I think that was probably the case, and why I didn’t see loads of travel.

    As you can see I’m down to two options now, I’d be wanting it in Orange anyway so have a few weeks to choose! I was really hoping that the demo on Saturday would make it an easy choice one way or the other, but I just can’t get a piece of paper between them in my head at the moment. I can’t believe how much I’m agonising over it – my wife is well and truly fed up with me talking about it now – and it’s such a first world problem!

    scruff
    Member

    Have you looked into the SB66 big bearing thing being replaced / serviced ?

    Im guessing the bike designed in Sheffiled may well be better at riding through the winter without a huge bill in March.

    si-wilson
    Member

    The fact you can speak directly to Cy on here or by phone is fab.

    If you unsure on both but like both frames go with the one with the best customer service…

    Premier Icon roverpig
    Subscriber

    If you can’t choose between them based on performance then you’ll have to use some other criteria. Which brand do you prefer? Does the “designed in the UK” tag mean anything to you? Which colour do you like best? Which will be easier to sell on in six months when you are lusting after something else? etc.

    Can’t fault cotic customer service. I took mine to be chased and faced at lbs they said the shell was off, sent off to cotic and their tool cut it fine and was back to me within a couple of days.. My head badge also fell off and went missing, a quick email and one turned up in the post.

    banks
    Member

    Renthal/hope/cotic shame so many companys, their customer service is just spot on

    geetee1972
    Member

    the Vipr only gives the right amount of travel for the situation, I think that was probably the case, and why I didn’t see loads of travel.

    I can vouch for that as well. It can feel over damped when you come to it from say a Fox damper and it really is best mated to a Devile fork IMO; that pairing makes everything feel ‘harmonious’ i.e. both units are working in the same way, metering out the same amount of squish in response to the input and so keep the bike balanced.

    I can imagine a Vipr mated with a Fox or RS fork might make the bike feel nervous or unbalanced (whereas the Devile can I think be used more successfully on its own).

    The fact you can speak directly to Cy on here or by phone is fab.

    This would be my deal clincher.

    Honestly if I wasn’t riding Nicolais I think I would be on a Rocket; It says a lot about the design of the Rocket that in my head at least, the alternative to a high price, custom fabricated engineering marvel is a bike made from steel and built Taiwan.

    Hob Nob
    Member

    Have you looked into the SB66 big bearing thing being replaced / serviced ?

    Im guessing the bike designed in Sheffiled may well be better at riding through the winter without a huge bill in March.

    If replacing the switch link bearings at £25 is considered a huge bill, then maybe spending £1500 plus on a frame could be considered a touch extravagant…

    Premier Icon timraven
    Subscriber

    The fact you can speak directly to Cy on here or by phone is fab.

    This would be my deal clincher. +1

    mildred
    Member

    I can vouch for that as well. It can feel over damped when you come to it from say a Fox damper and it really is best mated to a Devile fork IMO; that pairing makes everything feel ‘harmonious’ i.e. both units are working in the same way, metering out the same amount of squish in response to the input and so keep the bike balanced.
    I can imagine a Vipr mated with a Fox or RS fork might make the bike feel nervous or unbalanced (whereas the Devile can I think be used more successfully on its own).

    I’m not sure that over damped is how I would phrase it – with the Vip’r, it seems to me that the air spring has a very different characteristic; in my experience Fox shox blow through the mid-stroke (an issue that is exaggerated with high volume air cans) – like a switch from rising rate at the sag point to linear or falling rate mid stroke, then a switch back to rising rate towards the end. Normally i would argue that this is down to suspension design on my bike, but given ive found this on every fox air shock i’ve used, i’m more inclined to think its just the Fox characteristic. Perhaps Fox are aware if this hence the boost valve..? As a dyed in the wool bike tart, my experience with Fox is on most suspension formats: single pivot, linkage activated single pivot, Gt I-drive, URT, and currently a Nicolai Horst link 4-bar.

    In contrast, Bos seems more stable/predictable/linear… Difficult to explain but there’s just no surprises. The damping feels constant throughout the stroke, but I wouldn’t say “over damped”. My first experience of Bos suspension was my 1st set of Devilles. Coupled with a CCDB I believe that for a gravity bias it was the best suspension set up I’ve tried. Based on being impressed with the Devilles I bought a Vip’r – I’ve now sold the CCDB, which says a lot for the Vip’r in my opinion.

    I would love to have a suspension engineer take some Bos products apart and explain the difference. The only product that comes close (well, as good in my experience) is the marzocchi Rc3 damping system.

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    If those Yeti bearings are £25 then there’s not going to be a deal in it on parts costs as a Rocket is 4 x 28x15x7’s + 2 x 22x8x7’s + a couple of shock bushings. I do feel I can vouch for the life of the bearings though; my bike that you rode at the weekend is the very first prototype, and still on it’s first set of bearings. All the demo bikes are untouched from last April too.

    The word I would use for the Vip’r is accurate. In testing all the potential shocks during the development is consistently used about 3-4mm less stroke than all the other shocks, but felt more composed and posted slightly faster times. You can get close with the Fox with high Boost Valve pressure on the older shocks or Trail 2 on the new ones, but it’s a compromise in other places IMO. That said, the lockout on the BOS isn’t up to much whereas the Fox is very good. I’m a twiddler so the BOS doesn’t bother me, but other people are more fussed about that so Fox is more their thing. There’s a reason we offer choices on the shock 😉

    scruff
    Member

    Hobnob, I meant some of these other low cost Colorado service items –
    😯

    http://www.silverfish-uk.com/Brand/9946/Category/11185/SB-66-Alloy

    CY, Please start extending the XL frame size of the solaris to your other bikes… would love an XL rocket…

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    Looking at XL Rockets later this year. Nothing solid yet, but I am working on it.

    Premier Icon roverpig
    Subscriber

    Are you still working on a 29er version too ?

    Premier Icon cy
    Subscriber

    Yup. Lot’s of variants in the pipeline, but nothing finished yet. Prototypes are being ridden. They’ll be shouted about when they’re ready and not before 😉

    bren2709
    Member

    SB66 – is there not an issue with rear wheel catching seat tube then going through the travel?
    Still a sexy bike all the same! 😛

Viewing 45 posts - 1 through 45 (of 47 total)

The topic ‘SB66 vs Rocket which one’ is closed to new replies.