Do you want a discussion about the commercial and sporting result of this weekends games, or just an argument about the small print of each ruling?

I’d say (and I don’t read every one) that I generally agree with the rulings of citing commissioners (although less with the punishments handed out sometimes) but I think they’ve got this one wrong. By bringing intent into the decision, they’ve set a dangerous precedent because red-cardable offences concerning player safety are not supposed to give weight to the “intent” of the player committing the offence.

Small print sometimes matters. IMO (not that it matters a jot) player safety has been compromised a bit by this decision. Sorry if you’re a bit bored of discussing it.

Intent shouldn’t be a factor, as defined in the laws, but sometimes that’s the only way to look at it.

If both players had run into each other there would be no need for this debate. The problem starts when one player jumps – and current rulings say that all other players must take care of the airborne player. Barrett is the player who made the situation hazardous but Fall is meant to give way, despite not being aware that Barrett is in the air because he is clearly only watching the ball.

I will continue to disagree with you and the rules on this. I think they have gone too far with protecting players in the air – if they want to jump for the ball they should expect other players to be also contesting. (As long as it’s a fair contest, of course.)

Or alternatively the refs should make an effort to make the correct decision on field.

Sorry, forgot about posting on this… but christ, the above is pretty dumb, isn’t it? The ref discusses with TMO and assistants and you think he doesn’t make an effort. FFS, no wonder DD got “flippant”.

To be honest, who cares about a bit of concussion as long as we’re all entertained.

who cares about a bit of concussion as long as we’re all entertained.

The people who decided not to do anything about the All Blacks twin high hit?

Exactly, a_a.

Darcy, you’ve got it right – entertainment comes into it as much as player safety. When was the last time you saw a player penalised for a hand-off to the face? Why is it generally ok to lead with a fore-arm into the throat or face of a defender if you’re carrying a ball but not if you’re defending?

Dezb – such a dumb comment but the decision was rescinded. And my position on how much refs are influenced by other factors has been very clear since these threads started – would that have been a red card if Fall had been ‘taken out’ by Barrett?

Four week suspension for Moriarty

4 weeks for Moriarty, welsh players must have upped their biscuit game!

<div id=”story-body” class=”story-body sp-story-body gel-body-copy”>
<h3 class=”sp-story-body__cross-head”>Heineken Champions Cup 2018-19 draw</h3>
<b>Pool One: </b>Leinster, Wasps, Toulouse, Bath

<b>Pool Two: </b>Castres, Exeter Chiefs, Munster, Gloucester

<b>Pool Three: </b>Saracens, Glasgow Warriors, Lyon, Cardiff Blueso

<b>Pool Four: </b>Scarlets, Racing 92, Leicester Tigers, Ulster

<b>Pool Five: </b>Montpellier, Newcastle Falcons, Edinburgh, Toulon
<h3 class=”sp-story-body__cross-head”>Challenge Cup 2018-19 draw</h3>
<b>Pool One:</b> Northampton, Clermont Auvergne, Dragons, Timisoara Saracens

<b>Pool Two:</b> Pau, Ospreys, Worcester, Stade Francais

<b>Pool Three:</b> Sale Sharks, Connacht, Bordeaux-Begles, Perpignan

<b>Pool Four:</b> La Rochelle, Zebre, Bristol, Enisei-STM

<b>Pool Five:</b> Benetton, Harlequins, Agen, Grenoble
<h3 class=”sp-story-body__cross-head”></h3>
</div>

Apologies for the formatting!

Bristol sign George Smith, I am sure Gareth Edwards has some game time left in him.

Two years ago George won Wasps’ Players’ Player of the Year, Wasps’ Player of the Year, Aviva premiership Players’ Player of the Year and Green Flag Forward of the Season and got Queensland reds players player of the year only last year. As you will know, Pat Lam is no fool. He wouldn’t have signed him for a laugh.

Amazing how they’ve gone from looking scarily strong to a bit meh!!

Cippers has never been good enough, why would he be now?

<b>England team to face South Africa: </b>Elliot Daly (Wasps); Jonny May (Leicester Tigers), Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs), Owen Farrell (Saracens, capt), Mike Brown (Harlequins); Danny Cipriani (Wasps), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers); Joe Marler (Harlequins), Jamie George (Saracens), Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins), Joe Launchbury (Wasps), Maro Itoje (Saracens), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Tom Curry (Sale Sharks), Nathan Hughes (Wasps).

<b>Replacements: </b>Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs), Alec Hepburn (Exeter Chiefs), Harry Williams (Exeter Chiefs), Jonny Hill (Exeter Chiefs), Mark Wilson (Newcastle Falcons), Sam Simmonds (Exeter Chiefs), Ben Spencer (Saracens), Denny Solomona (Sale Sharks)

Cips is a far more mature individual than he used to be . This is huge for him, a very tough platform in which to prove your worth.

I still thinks he’s cleverer in the head attacking and better going backwards that Ford . Well see on Saturday.

Cips is a far more mature individual than he used to be . This is huge for him, a very tough platform in which to prove your worth.

I still thinks he’s cleverer in the head attacking and better going backwards that Ford . Well see on Saturday.

Downside is they’ve picked him for a game with a shit westher forecast – he’d probably have done a bit better on the previous, dry pitches. Eddie seeting him up to fail? He’ll still be hamstrung by a pack that can’t win ball and Youngs and his super slow service and eratic passing.

There are far too many people in thats squad with very little form. Can’t help thinking that we’ll get whitewashed this tour and I’m sure there’ll be a shedload of stupid penalties given away.

Downside is they’ve picked him for a game with a shit westher forecast

I know what you mean about the previous dry pitches, but wet and windy Capetown is still better weather than wet and windy Twickenham in January.

And at least they won’t have to contend with playing at altitude this week.

Can’t help but agree with you mind map.    Its not the best platform for Cips to show his skills, and should there be a fallout at 10 after we lose, he hasn’t dented the confidence of his bestest yet fragile mentality 10.

The Donkey Stockdale back in for Ireland, in Tandem with The Shit Keet Earls and Kearney.

WT actual **** was Lacey thinking giving that!!

Very rarely do refs look bent but thats an awful decisiin.

16 v 15

Lacey has made an absolute howler there.

Pass looked forward as well.

I could see why he gave it – where were the other French defenders? Made no difference to the outcome anyway. Fantastic game of rugby, really well reffed. Pleasure to watch.

 could see why he gave it – where were the other French defenders?

Well the one who’s man it was was being blocked by the ref. He an that clown Ayoub should hang their heads in shame. Worse decision I’ve seen in years.

No, I said where were the other defenders.

Least match affecting decision I’ve seen whinged about on here in years. What about the AB’s disallowed try that the ref clearly saw grounded?

Ireland make history with a series win in Australia. What a year it’s been so far.

Some people aren’t going to be happy.

#TheFutureIsGteen 🇮🇪

Least match affecting decision I’ve seen whinged about on here in years

Considering the score at the time it had a masdive effect. As for where the other defenders were well they were marking their men.

Ireland make history with a series win in Australia. What a year it’s been so far.

Awesome effort, second favourites for the World Cup at the moment?

On paper they will be. Although there’s an Autumn series and another 6N to go. They’ll find a way to **** it up. 🙂

Beirne had a big impact from the bench. (I realise he’s dead to you now but thought you’d like to know anyway.)

Regardless of any effect on the result, it was still shit refereeing. There is a gulf in class between the ABs and France, but France have been very hard done by in every game and it’s just not good enough.

I’m not chipping at the AB’s at all, I’m annoyed at the quality of refereeing and how they apply some (very ambiguous) laws. It’s crap.

Lacey:"I'm happy"
TMO: "you happy with that, John?"
Lacey: "yip"
Ludicrous decision #NZLvFRA pic.twitter.com/CAJ8COgGRM

— Couttsy (@Couttsy88) June 23, 2018

Just watched the hilights who is the Kiwi 10? How much pace has he got?

You might hat the AB’s but they are a ruthless machine.

Here we go then.   Will Robshaw crumble?  Will Cipriani shine?  Will the real Maro Itoje please stand up? Will the penalty country be less than 10?  Etc.

I couldn’t watch for fear of seeing one of the warriors impale himself on his spear slipping over!!

TheFutureIsGteen

Not at U20 level!

Great result, and series, against Australia, mind you.

NZ were excellent this morning, but once again a refereeing decision will be the headline, not the rugby

Cips – GENIUS!!

Not at U20 level!

Been a tough year for you guys.

Cips – GENIUS!!

Strange definition of genius, was Cips any better than Ford? Are both of them any better than Faz… once again England seem to be falling down the non settled team rabibit hole. Good win mind. One day Wales will beat Aus or SA away…..hopefully!!!

Only when I look out of my window and think ‘oh look, a flying pig carrying a unicorn’

Yes Cips was better than Ford. In defense that 10 channel was more reliable and less fragile.  He also is more effective in the tackle.

No difference on the flat pass, yet more innovation in attack and less fragile mentally , Although probably not the best game to highlight those.

Cips walked into a team and matched Ford everywhere except defense where he beat him.  I’d like to see if the same is true in a faster game .

So now its all done we can end the thread with a run down of what we think our best teams will be moving towards the world cup.

1/2p

Loopy Liam

Davies (fingers crossed very short here)

Parkes the Poach

North

Bigger (Patchel)

Davies (shame Webb is gone)

Faletau

Warbs/Tips/Jenkins/Davies

Modiarty/Shingler

AWJ

Cory BIL Hill/Ball/Maybe Seb Davies

Francis/Lee/Lewis

Owens/Dee

Evans