Desperately sad news about Ryan Jones. I was playing youth rugby for Carmarthen Quins youth whilst he was winning grand slams with Wales, so he was one of my very first rugby idols. He always seems like such a genuinely nice man.

I genuinely don’t know if I can continue watching rugby. So many of the current old guard must be facing the same future soon after retirement.

In this case hope until the 79th minute!

My wife and I both do the first aid for my daughter’s u14 team at the moment. She’ll be moving into the u16s soon and there are some very big size differences in that age group.
Our match first aid includes a lot of head knocks. The coaches are great and take it very seriously and won’t let the girls back on and won’t let them train for a week or more if necessary.
Some of the parents don’t take it well though; we’ve taken to putting a message on the group chat pointedly saying ‘X got a knock to the head and said she felt wobbily etc, we’d advise a trip to hospital’ just so it’s clear what we think should happen. Trips to a+e are rare though.
I’m torn about my own daughter’s participation. It is doing her SO much good socially, mentally (puberty hasn’t been easy for her so far) and in regard to her physical fitness. Her team have a great bond and care about each other.
But…what do we do about this constant bad news from older players? Can this sport continue to put young people at risk like this?
And it doesn’t help the girls get the shitty end of the stick when it comes to having to play in summer on rock hard pitches because the coaches and clubs are all focused on boys and men during the ‘proper’ season.
Don’t know what to do 😐

I just saw the article on BBC Sport website about Ryan Jones.

It’s such sad news for him and his family. Unfortunately he certainly won’t be the last player to have this happen.

I met him, and a few of the Ospreys lads, at a hotel in Caerphilly some years ago. Really nice guy and even though they were on a jolly had time enough to chat and bants.

The double edge sword is that I loved watching him play. One of the greats and a leader of the field too.

It’s truly horrible news.

But remember the guys in the news were all pro players so training more and harder and taking bigger hits than us Saturday warriors. I played to a reasonable standard and I know duckman played pretty high. And yes I took some bangs to the head but nothing like a pro player. Hopefully with rule changes and player care the probability is lessened. It would be more informative if there were information/survey on club and ex club players. Still one player effected is one too many.

Not sure if it’s been mentioned above, Steve Thompson was on BBC HardTalk not long ago, he’s been diagnosed with early onset dementia, too. Something’s gotta change.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3ct32r2

😀

Some of the parents don’t take it well though; we’ve taken to putting a message on the group chat pointedly saying ‘X got a knock to the head and said she felt wobbily etc, we’d advise a trip to hospital’ just so it’s clear what we think should happen. Trips to a+e are rare though.

Lister. I admire your stance, but you are actually not doing enough.
a) Have you, the parents and the kids doen the online Headcase course? https://www.englandrugby.com/participation/playing/headcase Its an RFU requirement for coaches and palyers.
b) You should be doing 23 day return to paly protocol if any player gets a headnock that has them off the pitch.
c) You can use this to push back to parents, tell them about Steve Thompson and Ryan Gsoling.

List below of what to look for.

They have one or more of the
following observable signs:
• Loss of consciousness
or responsiveness
• Slow to get up
• Unsteady on feet
• Incoordination
• Clutching of head
• Blank or vacant look
• Dazed/ Confused

One or more of the following
symptoms are present:
• Headache
• Seizure or convulsion
• Dizziness or balance problems
• Confusion
• Difficulty concentrating
• Nausea or vomiting
• Drowsiness / fatigue
• More emotional or sadness
• Blurred vision, sensitivity to light
• Irritable
• Difficulty remembering or amnesia
• Neck Pain
• “Don’t feel right”

Sorry Ryan Jones, not Gosling.

I was definitely concussed at least 5 times, including 2 where I was spark out ( one was boxing)But it isn’t even the concussions you know about, also Dementia is in my genes if my Mum and Gran are examples and I am into my 50’s now. I can’t say that I don’t sometimes have dark thoughts about it when I forget my pin/ where the car is momentarily.

I think rugby as we know it will be gone in a few years.

The injuries and head knocks mean imo its inevitable.

I’ve been thinking that as well TJ. Players are so big and athletic – the impact forces are so high at the top levels.

It has to change, I think a big plus would be making the pitches much wider at the pro level, bring skill and speed into it more.

I think rugby as we know it will be gone in a few years.

The injuries and head knocks mean imo its inevitable.

I disagree a bit – basically if the concussions are managed then its much less bad. hence the 23 day protocol. We just apply it blanket across our players, 19 days for seniors. Any one of the symptoms above, then we assume you have concussion and its min 23 days from cessation of symptoms. I think this will help in a big way.
I also agree with less replacements and/or bigger pitches.
Interestingly the womens game has become a very dynamic game to watch, less ploughing matches and more fancy backs moves.

Remember the time when George North went grey in the face on the pitch. I felt like that was badly managed, it still scares me that the senior game (in england, and especially in wales) appears to be ignoring the RFU stuff on concussions.
there was a lot of discussion about it during these summer games when SA, NZ and Aus players got ruled out but NH players were back next week… Hmmm…

Another jobby sandwich;Ed Slater the Gloucester lock has retired with immediate effect after a diagnosis for MND.

I think rugby as we know it will be gone in a few years.

The injuries and head knocks mean imo its inevitable.

I think that the focus has to change. At the moment the risk/reward ratio for going high in a tackle to stop the offload means that even the risk of a red card isn’t enough to stop head contact. And as we’ve seen over the last year referees are losing their appetite for giving out red cards so the incentive is only getting stronger.

I mentioned a while ago about how tip tackles were pretty much eliminated from the game but I don’t think this is going to happen with head contact. The risk/reward ratio for tip tackles meant coaches quickly adapted tackle technique to avoid tip tackles since there wasn’t any real benefit.

I think tackle heights have to come down and it has to be policed on the potential rather than the outcome.

By that I mean that contact should only be made below the shoulder. Making contact with the shoulder should be a penalty and possibly yellow.

This isn’t going to solve the issue because I believe the root cause is the sheer size and speed of modern professional players and direct head contact is only part of the problem. I think that basically outlawing the wrap tackle will do more to reduce player size because it will make offloads much easier. More offloads means that the game becomes more aerobic than anaerobic and players will spend more time jogging around the field rather that constantly setting the line and then sprinting.

The most idiotic mitigation I’ve ever heard for head contact is, ‘How is a large player supposed to get low enough to tackle a small player?’

Rugby is supposed to be a game for all shapes and sizes. This means there should be some advantages to being 5’5″.

Basically I think the focus going forward should be on adjusting the rules to encourage coaches to reduce the size of their individual players. Not that the entire team should be made up of Oompa Loompas but maybe it should more closely reflect the size and shape differences you see in a typical amateur team.

The modern game is not what it was in the pro/am transition and yes big changes need to happen. Big fines for management etc that keep a player who may be concussed on the pitch. Bring back the toughness of cards. Stop the on the pitch mitigation, allow that to happen at the panel (mitigation found cleared to play next week, no mitigation ban depending on severity). Another TMO to help spot potentials.
Stick another 25m on the pitch width and only allow medical subs. If you are suspected of gaming the system the it’s a deano ban.
Will it ruin rugby? Yes. But it’s no longer rugby of the rule book. There’s always been big hits and concussion but having me smash you at 11atone is different to steward hitting you in a tackle. As above big slabs of muscle smashing folk day in day out is causing damage.

Moving to a team GB format for the sevens World Series and the Olympic games. I have concerns that this will set a precedent for other competitions and other sports.
https://www.scottishrugby.org/news/scottish-rugby,-rfu-and-wru-announce-move-to-great-britain-model-for-hsbc-world-rugby-sevens-series

As much as love rugby the head impact issues need to be taken seriously.
How it will effect the game I don’t know but it has too, George north is a prime example of a player getting left on with head knocks.
Sexton is a current player that I aways think is only one game away from injury with big back row players clattering him.
Sadly we seam to be at the start of the graph from a data point of view. Wonder how fast will the old boys move on making changes?

22-23 Season thread here.

Rugby 22-23 Season