Ah you beat me to it Jamie. re: edited post!

PAH!

I was running something similar on my commuter bike way back in 2003!

Hey, snap! I had a planet x Jack Flash RAD with Shiver DC’s on back in about 03! Less commuting, more stair hucking…

Ooo talking over commuting those work gonicely on my commuter to soften the ride on my dodgy wrist!

Think of the extra unsprung weight those stanchion guards will add! 🙂

AlexSimon – Member
Lack of visible adjustment is a bit weird.

Little ports on the top, with adjusters underneath like everything else?

The adjusters could well be in the bottom as they are on MX bikes.
Ohlins on the MGP kit have rebound in the right leg and compression in the left. Everything kept simple and separate – one adjuster in each.
Base models tend to have rebound in the top and rebound on the base of the leg.
Rusty picked up on the other main benefit of this design – less “Stiction”. The moment you incline a fork sideways the up/down” forces become “up/down/sideways flex” forces and they call it Stiction.
Nitride coatings, DLC, etc are used along with minute lubrication to assist in reducing it but the inherent increase in rigidity of this design makes them superior.

JCL – Member
There is no way the sliders/drop out in this fork have a lower unsprung mass that the magnesium lowers of a Sid etc. Especially when the lowers of a normal fork actuate the spring via a 10mm hollow aluminum rod. As Jameso said, the dropout would at least need a larger hub interface if not axle to compensate for the loss in torsional stiffness from the lack of brace.

You can’t just compare a Mag lower though – there would never be “just” the lower – because the hub, spindle, springs, etc all are attached the the lowers on a “conventional” fork so all count towards unsprung mass.

Jamie, what are the chances of getting you to do a “Jamie photoshops STWers bikes” thread?

Utterly brilliant, as per!

Do folk really think unsprung weight matters?

You have say 3kg unsprung weight (fork lowers, wheel, tyre, brake) vs 70+kg (rider + rest of bike).

I can’t see it – no matter what the fork manufacturers tell us!

Do folk really think unsprung weight matters?

All the world champions on the forum obviously do 😥

The rest don’t give a shit which fork matters

You can’t just compare a Mag lower though – there would never be “just” the lower – because the hub, spindle, springs, etc all are attached the the lowers on a “conventional” fork so all count towards unsprung mass.

And the hub, axle and internals aren’t attached to the unsprung mass on a inverted fork??? If anything most of those items would be heavier on the inverted fork.

Also with the inverted fork there has to be a dropout to slider interface which wouldn’t be needed on a conventional fork. I’d still put money on the conventional fork having lower unsprung.

cynic-al, unsprung has more effect the lighter the sprung mass.

Do folk really think unsprung weight matters?

Yerp. It does. It doesn’t matter what the sprung weight is, if you can reduce the unsprung weight, it’s easier to control it, so the suspension works better. 🙂

What evidence do you have PP?

Please don’t say you read it in a mag/brochure!

Kind of (since a zero unsprung mass would mean being able to change direction immediately with no momentum to account for) but as usual does it have a real world benefit with the numbers we’re talking about? And the ratio of sprung to unsprung mass does matter.

cynic-al – Member
What evidence do you have PP?
Please don’t say you read it in a mag/brochure!
POSTED 7 MINUTES AGO # REPORT-POST

Physics

One of the problems of bike suspension, vs car or motorcycle suspension is the spring/unsprung mass ratio.

Thus bike suspension is far more reliant on very low breakaway friction, requiring higher spec bushings and is intolerant to secure seals.

It’s clear some suspension items suffer with sealing issues to get the smooth movement at the expense of environmental resilience.

I can’t wait to see the price!

I’ll be surprised if they’re under a grand.

Yes clubber+1

£1k?

One of the problems of bike suspension, vs car or motorcycle suspension is the spring/unsprung mass ratio.

+1

On a motorbike the bars/footpegs/saddle aren’t displaced in the same way though as the 100kg+ bike requires much more force to gain significant momentum, so the suspension does the work on it’s own. On an MTB your arms/legs do a lot more of the suspensions work, so in effect the whole bike’s mass is ‘unsprung mass’, which is why light bikes feel so good.

I’m just taking a wild stab here, but i’d lay good odds on the fact that the unsprung mass on this fork vs a similar size/spring type/travel fork would probably be at best 100-200 grams, given the requirement for a seriously overbuilt hub interface and the weight of decent light lowers.

I agree that lower unsprung mass is good, the lower the unsprung mass the easier it is to keep on the ground and the more supple the fork could be built with lower seal breakaway force if so desired, additionally a USB self lubes much better so even looser seals could be used.

That said, I doubt it will feel any different apart from the lower torsional rigidity to a normal 15mm through axle fork. Factor in the 24″ inches of fully active suspen sion you have working all the time you ride in your arms and legs and honestly the whole story is barely worth comment.

Does anyone know if they are using the Reverb keyway to add torsional stiffness, that’ll be a clusterf_ck of servicing issues to deal with.

With the amount of torsional movement during riding.. and the amount of movement a reverb has after a few months of riding.. it would be pointless for them to take that tech over to the fork as the point where the ‘key’ technology will kick in, will be way past (torsionally) the point where riders will twist them 😀

Sorry guys, just stumbled across this from the lead story at http://singletrackworld.com/2014/03/rockshox-everything-changes/ so apologies if I’m asking something that’s already been discussed.

I’m far from an expert but, isn’t putting the exposed part of the fork closer to the mud and slutch a Really Bad Idea? Aren’t we just going to end up spending half of our lives servicing the things?

(And incidentally, whatever happened to gaiters? Did they fall out of favour simply because they look like crap?)

We’re assuming that there will need to be guards attached a la MX/etc

Gaiters became unnecessary as sealing improved. Mostly. And they look carp 🙂

I suspect more crap hits the stanchions on forks now due to their proximity to the tyre than would get on the lowers on these forks from goign through puddles etc.

My discs tend to stay pretty clean, the brace etc on my forks is always covered in crap.

gaiters just tend to trap any dirt that finds its way in so aren;t ideal.

The use of the stanchion guards on this type of fork is a ‘good thing’ though.

I’m far from an expert but, isn’t putting the exposed part of the fork closer to the mud and slutch a Really Bad Idea? Aren’t we just going to end up spending half of our lives servicing the things?

(And incidentally, whatever happened to gaiters? Did they fall out of favour simply because they look like crap?)

On a reasonably mucky ride, how much more filth is near the hub than is near the brace/stantions on right way up forks? Same? More at the top? That’s what I notice anyway.

Gaiters? they store up all the crap and moisture inside them, and keep it rubbing against the stantions. Which is ace….

I’m far from an expert but, isn’t putting the exposed part of the fork closer to the mud and slutch a Really Bad Idea? Aren’t we just going to end up spending half of our lives servicing the things?

In principal I’d agree, but I know of a few pairs of those Maverick forks still going strong. I remember my main objection (when I was offered a set cheapish, I liked how they performed althoguh it’s all relative) was that I’d need a new wheel build for the through axle .. with maxle etc. as standards now maybe that issue has gone away?

At least part of the theory is that crud on the stanchions will be swept off by the seals and gravity, rather than accumulating on the seals, and also the damper oil will rest on the seals, keeping them lubricated.

tomhoward – Member
On a reasonably mucky ride, how much more filth is near the hub than is near the brace/stantions on right way up forks? Same? More at the top? That’s what I notice anyway.

You’re right, about mud. What concerns me is that my fork lowers are covered in scrapes from crashes or squeezing down narrow gulleys, I hope the stanchion covers are tough!

and also the damper oil will rest on the seals, keeping them lubricated

it’ll just be lube oil doign that work in these, damper oil will be sealed away. Plus, ever seen what happens when an open-bath USD fork blows it’s seals? 🙂

What concerns me is that my fork lowers are covered in scrapes from crashes or squeezing down narrow gulleys, I hope the stanchion covers are tough!

Fork lowers are soft magnesium alloy or similar though – the mere brush of a thick bush will often scratch them. I’m not saying that these stanchions will survive crashing into a rock, but they may be hard enough that the odd rock-strike doesn’t kill them.

I suppose one thing is, USD lowers are a relatively small part so replacing one shouldn’t be as big a deal as replacing a CSU. Assuming they’re available separately, at least. Wouldn’t really concern me on an xc bike though, crashing is less important than it is with a big bike.

On a motocrosser the lowers need guards to protect them from roost from the bikes in front. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if RS didn’t bother.

I predict a sudden upsurge in floro gator sales. god help us, but at least you could swap them to match your socks.

Only just noticed the cable coming from the top of the left leg in the pic of the s-works.

Excellent spot! Presumably lock-out, but cable or hydro?

Surely the Rock Shox equivalent of a Kashima coating will mean there are no worries at all about the longevity of the lowers.

Ha
Haha
Hahaha
Hahahahahhahahhahahhahahhahahhahah etc…

If the lowers are DLC maybe no ha ha ha ha ha
Ha ha ha ha ha eh?

@legend

Yup, babysick all down your stanchions and zero lube.

Is it not just going to be the normal rockshox black coating? ie, looks kind of cool, doesn’t do anything? I know they do DLC on some pro-level stuff but so far not on consumer kit (which possibly means they’re having the same issues as Showa always had, ie, making the bloody stuff stay on the forks)

Revolutionary!

In a sort of ‘Marzocchi already did it 15 years ago” sort of way…

But I do like a USD fork I does…