I need a new groupset for my roadbike shortly, and there are some good offers around at the mo.

Currently I can get DA9000, Red22 or Record for within £25 of each other, but not sure which to go for.

Record – most familiar with as I’m currently using 2004 Record. Like the hood shape/shifting action. Don’t need to buy a new freehub. Heaviest, and not compatible with my other half’s bike. Not as bombproof as it used to be? Stupid tool needed for joining the chain

Red – Lightest by 200g, I’ve always had good luck with SRAM mtb kit, can play mix and match with my other half’s bike (she’s on Force). Reputation is that it’s not all that robust?? Need to buy a new freehub.

DA – probably the most reliable/”just works”. Wouldn’t have even considered it until this generation, but the new hood shape is much nicer. Upgradeable to di2 at some point. Needs a new freehub, but then can swap wheels with the missus. Not a great fan of the shift lever set up, but sure I’ll learn. Least pleasant of the 3 to look at, IMO.

Thoughts? I know there’s a lot of personal preference involved, but what’s your take? Gut reaction is to stick with Record, but I’m sufficiently weight weenie (and at 10 stone can almost justify it!) that the 200g difference in weight is dragging me towards SRAM, but then I’m hearing loads of good stuff about DA too…

Depends a bit on what the bike is

Personally i’d go for DA on my bikes but if i had a Colnago or something like that then it would have to be Record

Upgradeable to di2 at some point

No more so than Red – you’d need new mechs/shifters.

DA – simply the best g/set there is. Looks pimp too…

I ride Campagnolo and have done for the last decade.
But if I was buying now, I’d go for the Dura Ace, no question.
Fantastic kit, light years better than the last edition.

Mmm; lightest, latest or purist choice?

All good in their own ways, so a nice dilemma to have.

My 2012 force stuff has been perfect for 6000 miles so far. I like SRAMs doubletap shifting. Although if I was going for a new groupset I would probably go electric I really like the idea of a front derailer which trims so no rub

SRAM cos it’s double tap. Plus the shifters are a nice shape. And it’s very light. The new front mechs are meant to be dead good. Worth the risk of it falling apart I reckon.

I like the ‘no BCD’ of the Shimano, that’s what swung me to Shimano.

get the shifters you like most and don’t use a campag 11spd chain, use a kmc thus no need for the insanely expensive chain tool.

DA. But them I’m one of these odd people that, where bikes are concerned, there has to be a very good reason for me not to buy Shimano.

Campag Record: stupid tool needed for joining for the chain?

Nope

Just go for a KMC chain.

Only chains I’ve had snap on me are Shitmano and Campag.

Go for the Record, but sell the chain if buying groupset and buy a KMC chain.

[edit] Oops, beaten to it! [/edit]

always used dura ace for years .got some red at a good price for my latest no1 bike.and it’s superb once you get used to the double tap shifters.

I have sram red on my supersix – faultless for over a year – the front shifting is excellent with yaw mech

SRAM on all my road bikes, but have used 105/Ultegra a lot in the past. I’ve got 2012 Red shifters on the posh bike and they feel both light and very definite when shifting. Absolutely lovely.

SRAM just feels more comfortable and positive to me. I also like the way the the big lever only brakes, so it feels more solid when braking.

Never ridden Campag but looks uncomfortable to me. Horses for courses though!

They are three flavours of very nice. You would not be dissapointed with any. If it is for nice rides rather than racing, DA Di2 would be my choice. I think Shimano are ahead of the electronic game. If weight is everything, then Red. If it’s a budget thing, Ultegra Di2. And yes, I used to ride campagnolo.

Has Record got a lot heavier or DA a lot lighter? Haven’t checked current groups, but when I bought my Record 10 (just before Record 11 was announced 👿 ) it was over 200g lighter than DA. Others have already covered the bit about the chain – I use a KMC chain with mine.

Personally I still prefer the look of Record, but clearly that’s a personal thing.

Haven’t ridden DA for at least a decade (and never a SRAM road group) – can you ‘dump’ a load of gears in one click like Record does? I love that – crest a hill, sit up and zip your jersey up, neck a gel, start pedalling and you’re at the wrong end of the cassette. With Record you can be in the right gear in one or two clicks.

Harder to change down while in the drops on Record. Possible, but because of aforementioned gear dumping you might change a few instead of one.

KMC chain negates need for Campag tool, also Pedro’s have a 1 to 11 speed chain tool with the pin mushrooming capability.

My next group will be electric though – the advantage of being able to change gear when my hands are frozen solid is worth the price of admission.

I’m completely in love with my DA 9000 groupset! It’s so easy to shift and the 110 BCD for all chainrings is a nice touch if you need to switch things out. The brakes are amazing at stopping too!

2000 trouble free miles since Sept.

OK so I did have to alter the freehub to run 11 speed, but that was no big deal.

STL

DA 9000, I’ve never got on with double tap particularly, the campag group just isn’t as user friendly as shimano, you can gear dump up the cassette with 9000 but not down however Di2 allows you to in both directions

Unique cables on Dura Ace and Ultegra so I’m told.

Red for my money. I far prefer the feel of fake shifting, it looks and feels nice and it’s light. I’m not aware of any reliability issues..?

Ive got one of those Italian Colnago things and had a similar dilema. One squeze on the DA 9000 brakes and shift from little to big ring and my mind was made up.
DA 9000 all the way.
Some people do raise an eyebrow about Shimano on an Italian bike though.
🙄

Red or Record for me. I like Record 11 with a KMC chain and I find it very robust. On the subjective side I don’t like the looks of DA and I can’t say that a well set up top line groupset I ever miss shifts so I can’t see the need for electronic shifting. I hear about plenty of people having issues with their electronic
Shifting

It’s just personal preference.
Nothing current seems as well build as my old record 10 years old and still going
For me I hate SRAM double tap but that not because it does not work just I don’t like it

If the whole build is the lightest you can get then carry that on with the group set

I have ridden Campagnolo for the past 25 years.

During that time I switched to Shimano a couple of times just out of curiosity, but always went back to Campagnolo quickly. I have 2 bikes with Super Record EPS and a couple with mechanical Super Record. I guess you could say I am a Campagnolo fan.

BUT, if I was starting from scratch today, I would buy Dura Ace. They have really set a new standard with their latest groupset. They are streets ahead of Campagnolo in both mechanical, and particularly electronic format.

I think we are in a similar period in the Shimano vs Campagnolo debate that we were when Ergopower, STI and indexed shifting first came onto the market. For a few years back then, Shimano were in a whole different league before Campagnolo caught them and then overtook when they started using carbon in their groupsets more (just a time reference, not saying that the inclusion of carbon made them inherently better). Right now, Dura Ace is so far ahead of Record, that it makes Record look like what it is – a groupset that basically hasn’t changed for nearly 5 years, with some components (eg brakes) pre-dating even that.

You will notice that I have only compared Shimano to Campagnolo. SRAM just doesn’t compare to either. Sure they have thrown a lot of money at professional sponsorship and their stuff is light, but that doesn’t make them on par. Plastic, cheap feel to Red. They have become a bit gimmicky because they know that they have to be shouty since they were late to the party. Plus, SRAM have had more than their fair share of product recalls lately which suggests to me that they are perhaps pushing the boundaries of light weight and in a rush first-to-market a bit too far without proper testing. I know that both Shimano and Campagnolo have also suffered recalls during their time, but not the same extent that SRAM have in their short life.

Some people do raise an eyebrow about Shimano on an Italian bike though.

Yeah, English people on forums with too much time reserved for criticising others. My understanding is that most purists in Italy don’t really care and will use what’s actually best (ie DA).

Fair enough go for Record if you want to. But not because some ill-informed forumite says you ‘should’.

Interesting thread. My first reaction was to jokingly quote the comments on yesterday’s thread about why bikes were cheaper than boats and say “these group sets are for posh people” 😉

But actually I’m interested, what would you all think if I speced Ultegra on a new Bianci with Campag wheels? Haven’t taken the time to get used to the Campy thumb shift and am more used to the Shimano stuff, although I like the faster shifting of the Campag groups. The SRAM stuff doesn’t seem to be an option with the dealers

DA. Solid, stiff and light. Just gets on with the job.

Granted, Campag looks nice.

But actually I’m interested, what would you all think if I speced Ultegra on a new Bianci with Campag wheels?

If you prefer the shift levers of shimano,( why I don’t understand 😕 ) do it. If you want Campag wheels, you could always get fulcrum? but either way the freehub bodies are available for Shimano or Campag.

Yeah, English people on forums with too much time reserved for criticising others. My understanding is that most purists in Italy don’t really care and will use what’s actually best (ie DA).

Yup, in my limited experience of cycling in Europe, you’ll see plenty of Italian bikes with shimano groupsets.

Interesting point – just how many years did it take for EPS to come to market from when it was first used in the peleton?

using record on my nice bike been floorless set up and forgotten, built many bikes with all 3 groupsets, sram too flimsey seen a fair few breakages, campag been good but as mentioned get a quick link to join the chains, dura ace by far the slickest been very impressed with it so much so just stuck ultegra on my winter bike.

as they say campag for show shimano for go sram well !!!

[quick thread hijack]

With Di2, can you mix and match groupsets? I’m thinking Ultegra shifters and DA mechs?

[/quick thread hijack]

Cool, so this has been busy overnight…

And in true t’interweb fashion – no general concensus, bar it’s all great, which I guess I kinda knew anyway…! 😀 Still no closer to picking one!

Ideally I guess I’d want Record levers and cranks, Red brakes, DA cassette and mechs, but none of that lot will talk to each other properly! And that’s purely based on looks, not performance.

aracer – there’s only about 30g between Record and DA, but Red is WAY lighter. Here.

Quite impressive that DA Di2 is only about 150g heavier than Red22.

Sram red is the lightest. I made the change to red last year, however, I will change to something different for this year. Red is considered to be less reliable and in my experience it was (not sure about the 22). I was disappointed after coming from shimano. With shimano, I mounted everything and was set up and ready to go in 30 or so minutes following that I has seamless changes and trouble free shifting. Red took longer to set up and was far less robust, needing more trimming during the season, often difficult to bring it back to optimum. It was also much more noisy. Build quality wise, Sram red is poorer, I felt it more like tin foil. In general I feel it is not so well engineered, they have seen an essential addition to the groupset being a chain catcher. This is essential as you will drop a chain with some point with the red groupset.

Having said that I don’t have a feel for what the 22 is like. They say seamless shifting with ALL gear combinations.

I would go for campag or DA

I have full Red on my Cervelo.

Dropped the chain twice on the front. Once going up and once down, this is over about 1000km. Lovely shifters and very light group set.

On my Giant with only Tiagra, never dropped once.

Tiagra is the bargain performance groupset. Used to be 105, but the external cable shifting of Tiagra is magnificent. If they could just get rid of those indicator windows and make it look more like my Ultegra 6600 I’d recommend it even more highly.

For Di2, Ultegra and DA 11 speed are now interchangeble. First gen Di2 DA used a bespoke wiring loom. The new gen uses the Ultegra loom.

I’ve worked/used the following of late:
-Campag EPS
-Record
-DA 9000
-DA Di2 9000
-Ultegra Di2 6800
-Red 22

Observations:
-The campag EPS was the best feeling electronic groupset, all the benefits of di2 with a more mechanical feel (if that makes sense). Though I do question its reliability.
-There were no tangible difference between Ultegra/DA di2.
-Indexing got harder for 11 speed, once again.
-Campag definitely had the worst brakes, still very good though.
-Red 22 only trumps the weight category. Still very good, I really like doubletap.
-DA 9000 feels exceptional

Conclusion:
They’re all really good, pick the one that looks best on your bike.