Didgerman, I didn’t even notice your posts earlier. I’m not pretending to be an expert of course, I have only read a bit, been coached a bit, and done a lot of training sessions. And tried various things, most of which did nothing of course.

However, scrolling back:

As usual there a couple of believers giving advice. You have to wonder why.

Why? Cos I’ve tried it, and found some benefit. Was that wrong? Is it not possible? I know that some people are very gullible and will say something is good if they’ve paid for it, but other pepole are also quite analytical and dare I say, sceptical.

The twenty minute thing is total bunk

I’d like to see some evidence for that, if you have any?

nothing beats a proper diet

No-one’s saying otherwise, of course. However, timing and GI of food intake seems to be significant.

a theory you’re developing, which is in fact already mainstream

Good, that means I’m on the right track then? 🙂

the idea of a fast recovery being beneficial is far from settled

Oh? That is interesting, do you have any more info?

Molgrip you gave some pretty specific advice, maybe start by declaring yourself as a fellow bodger first?
I quite liked this blog….:
http://evidencemag.com/recovery-window/
Not an authority by any means, but is well referenced.
The amount of fluff that gets talked about with regard to ‘improving recovery’ is huge. A whole industry churning out things like compression socks /titter to improve recovery, ice baths, protein shakes, antioxidants in diet, it’s never ending. However, there’s little science behind the idea that speeding recovery is beneficial. This is when gains take place, and shortening that time isn’t necessarily going to make you fitter.

Molgrip you gave some pretty specific advice,

Just what I’ve read in lots of places over the years. It may be about to be overturned by modern research, I have no idea 🙂

Reading that link then..

However, as we’ve already covered, it’s usually not necessary for most endurance athletes to maximize glycogen storage after workouts.

Hmm.. ‘most endurance athletes’ encompasses a pretty wide range of people and activities. Personally, as an MTBer with a tendency to fuel with glycogen rather than fat, I definitely feel better after eating specifically for recovery. This could mean recovery drink, or emphasising simple carbs through normal food.

I’ve noticed that for me, when trying to do the iDave diet I often stay feeling tired and stiff after a big ride until I do eat lots of simple carbs (ie the re-feed day) which might be most of the week. It can take a couple of days of eating lots of carbs.

Part of the issue is that I also need to lose some fat. So trying to balance recovery with fat loss is quite difficult for me. I either eat plenty of carbs, recover well, ride well and stay the same weight; or I diet, ride worse, recover worse but lose some weight. I know this is how I respond, from experience – but it doesn’t seem to be the case for everyone.

Also, the question of what you end up eating after a big ride is perhaps significant. Many people on STW talk about the post-ride munchies, and wanting to eat lots of crap. Recovery drink really seems to help me avoid this.

Pointless asking on here, just google for previous threads if you need to know why (e.g. this)

I eat properly before, during and after no need for these overpriced “recovery drinks”

people are sucked in by so called scientific babble.

people are sucked in by so called scientific babble

I’m not, though.

Well, it is day 2 after my century / first use of a 400ml milk / high5 stuff. Still have slightly achy quads (like normal) however, I did notice on my morning commute I have more ‘beans’ than usual, like I do after a few days off the bike. Despite supposedly trying to cycle in zone2 I found myself chasing a segment at 30mph+….

Completely non scientific but I don’t usually feel like pushing hard a day after a 6hr ride

I’ve bought a big tub of the stuff. Compared to what the bike cost, or even that matter a pair of bib shorts / jersey its a fraction and if it means I feel better on the bike I’m up for it.

Once the tubs finished I’ll have a go at plain nesquick / milk and see if I can spot a difference

people are sucked in by so called scientific babble

So you’re argueing against science in general?

Once the tubs finished I’ll have a go at plain nesquick / milk and see if I can spot a difference

Also try Torq. Seriously, and I’m not affiliated.

Milk+banana+honey+cocoa+scoop of porridge oats+scoop of whey protein+ice cubes. Liquidise. Drink.

Beer for afters.

I have this before riding also, without the whey.

Bit disappointed I don’t feel any different then, maybe I was expecting too much and it will be tomorrow I’ll feel like running up stairs / jumping on the bike for another all dayer.

Was going to say it won’t make you feel any better necessarily, but your body would respond better if you got back out on the bike today. read your next post and you seem to be confirming this.

FWIW I have felt a benefit when increasing exercise volume (I tend to mix it up even when aiming at a specific event, just to get more time in without getting jaded – so I’ll run, cycle, swim, climb whatever just do more of it), if you were commuting a decent distance on top of doing longer weekend rides I think it’d help you cope long term.

So you’re argueing against science in general?

arguing against rubbish science – if you eat properly there is no need for “recovery” you’re body will piss and poop any excess glucose and protein out.

eating properly is the key.

arguing against rubbish science – if you eat properly there is no need for “recovery” you’re body will piss and poop any excess glucose and protein out.

Excess, no, it’ll turn excess glucose to fat, as long as it’s absorbed by the gut; but the recovery drink isn’t ‘excess’ it’s what you need to replace what you’ve lost.

I don’t think it’s rubbish science, tbh. If you have more evidence please share. Preferably specific to amateur training MTBers or at least cyclists.

Carbs after exercise DEFINITELY speeds recovery, for me – that’s been proven beyond doubt over the years. Whether or not I’m better off recovering quickly or slowly, well that’s another debate, and I coudn’t say. And recovery drink is a bit more effective than other methods, again for me, in my fairly long experience of feeding myself.

you’re not eating enough carbs during exercise then. most glucose is pissed out of the body

The commonly quoted figure for carb absorbtion during exercise is 1g/kg body weight per hour. As in, any more than that will be pissed out. However a bit of maths should reveal that it’s quite easy to use up a lot more than that, so I’m bound to finish depleted.

That’s what reco drink is for.

poah – Member
you’re not eating enough carbs during exercise then. most glucose is pissed out of the body

Virtually all the glucose that is filtered through the glomeruli is reabsorbed by the proximal renal tubule and so glycosuria represents a pathological state not one induced by diet or exercise.
The amount of glucose reabsorbed by the kidneys is usually 99.9%. Adults excrete a total glucose content of about 65 mg per day, an amount undetectable by standard techniques.

you’re not eating enough carbs during exercise then. most glucose is pissed out of the body

Virtually all the glucose that is filtered through the glomeruli is reabsorbed by the proximal renal tubule and so glycosuria represents a pathological state not one induced by diet or exercise.
The amount of glucose reabsorbed by the kidneys is usually 99.9%. Adults excrete a total glucose content of about 65 mg per day, an amount undetectable by standard techniques.

I was about to say, if you’re pissing out glucose then you have more problems than arguing on the internet about the advatages of a sugary drink after exercise and should see a Dr sharpish.

I can’t believe this thread has reached almost two pages without a single mention of the one truly evil downside of recovery drinks…..

The farts

The earth-quaking, eye-watering, nose hair-singeing, marriage-endangering farts!

Seriously, the Maxim stuff should be banned under the Geneva convention.

Virtually all the glucose that is filtered through the glomeruli is reabsorbed by the proximal renal tubule

Pwned.

Pwned by google search, but pwned anyway. Stored as fat, not piddled out. Again though, it’s a reminder that your body drives down the middle of the road, more is not more.

Again though, it’s a reminder that your body drives down the middle of the road

Meaning what?

PS I don’t think hilldodger just googles this stuff, he seems to know a fair bit generally.

No-one else get horrendous wind from recovery drinks then?

Or explain why I do?

http://www.patient.co.uk/doctor/Glycosuria.htm
A good source of info though, and presumably knew what to look for.
Meaning, too much protein is a waste, your body won’t benefit from it. Our normal diet should meet our protein needs, so there’s no need for hyped recovery drinks. None. Unless you’re some kind of pro who trains more than once a day, and I mean trains, not just commutes or tootles about for an hour…

I used to not have protein drinks, then started with them and recovery seemed quicker and stopped snacking on everything edible in my cupboard.

So they may be over hyped and there maybe easier and cheaper alternatives but it has done the trick for me.

As for the wind problem, I am always a bit gusty in the trouser department so no real change there 🙂

Meaning, too much protein is a waste, your body won’t benefit from it.

That’s true, and as I understand it it’s questionable if the protein in recovery drink makes any difference. I think the theory is that rather than actually being used for rebuilding muscle, it’s simply there to aid the absorbtion of the carbohydrate.

The protein is not the point of the recovery drink -the carbohydrate is.

Unless you’re some kind of pro who trains more than once a day, and I mean trains, not just commutes or tootles about for an hour

Some of us train hard (or have done so) despite not being pros. It doesn’t matter how fast you are actually going, it matters how much you are stressing your body. And anyone can stress their body to its limits, pro or not.

This is not some widget to try and make you go faster, this is about recovering from training to enable you to do more.

The way I see it. There’s a lot of contradiction and uncertainty in the field of nutrition and each time I attempt to research anything I end up more confused.

But we’re talking about chocolate milk here… I’m willing to give the benefit of the doubt 🙂

Homemade here. Milk. Banana. Cocoa. *slurps*

Yep, the only option is to try it for yourself and see how you get on. Which is what I did, but apparently that’s wrong and makes me a stupid marketing led idiot.

Although, if I were to STOP using it, then would I be an idiot who gives in to peer pressure instead?

Which is worse? Dilemma.

I gave up caring what other people thought of me a long time ago. 🙂

Grips I think you’ve thrown some toys there. There’s no peer pressure, the evidence is there for everyone to see, but you need to read it from places that aren’t selling something.

I think I’m just gonna continue having a chocolate Yazoo (not a euphemism) after my rides and feeling better for it.

I call it a “chocolate milk” rather than a “recovery drink”, if that makes it easier for the contrarians to swallow?

thrown some toys there.

This is where STW threads on supplements or energy/recovery products generally end up.

but you need to read it from places that aren’t selling something

Ok. Do you have some? I do take the commercial websites with a pinch of salt of course but what I have done is try the more plausible products anyway rather than dismiss them.

A few things I have tried, based on the advice of their vendors, I have topped using because I did not see any benefit. However, Torq reco is not one of them.

Pwned by google search, but pwned anyway. Stored as fat, not piddled out. Again though, it’s a reminder that your body drives down the middle of the road, more is not more.

Well and truly lol. TBF it’s been a while since I studied nephrology and never really paid attention to it then 🙁

Well back from my usual 2hr / 37mile / 1800ft loop. Quads still ached, but felt strong, lots of energy to keep pushing. 18 PRs.

Works for me. Or maybe its a placebo?

No farts so far….hmmmm….maybe I need more?

Choco YAZOO half price in Tesco

From my experience of riding and recovery ! eat well BEFORE obviously, DURING as finishing depleted will hammer you more and AFTER as this will aid recovery.

At the end Of the day your all arguing about Supplements !
Thats what they do supplement a balanced diet. i certainly dont see any benefit from taking it and ive tried, it bloats me and if anything makes me lethargic !
Whetehr thats true or not i dint know, i’ve never had it certified by scientist, but we are all different so if it works for you crack on.

I can’t face normal food after exercise and milk makes me heave so I use a recovery drink.

I’ve tried a few and as molgrips i’ve found the Torq stuff seems to work best for me.

Kuco

Whats Normal food ?

Thats why we are all different, given the choice between a Massive Sunday roast and a Glass of Chemicals 💡

Normal food, anything thats solid 🙂 I even struggle eating a banana after a ride. I’m okay after about an hour or so it’s just when I initially stop riding.

Yeah, after a hard ride I can’t stomach a meal either. I have to wait a few hours. Fairly common I think..?

Doesn’t matter if you can’t face a meal after training, that’s not a reason to go for ‘recovery’ drinks. Plus, your gut is clever, you can train it.