Right, so my mother ia a fanatical bird watcher, lives on a salt marsh so sees lots of different and unusual birds. Her old binos, a oair of Praktica Sport glasses have gone all gummy, I assume the rubberised coating on the grips has broken down.
Co-incidentally its her birthday soon, so I am looking for suggestions for a cheapish but decent set of binos ,or maybe a spotting scope, for her. Cheers.

Sounds budget driven – so what’s it gonna be? Cheap is a relative term in the world of optics 😉

Well im very much open to being persuaded, she would use them so it wouldnt be wasted. Im defo not thinking Swarovski or whatever, but maybe £50 or therabouts, maybe £75 at a push.

Hate to be that guy but any chance of banding together with some other family members and getting her some really good ones in the £4-500 bracket?

I’ve had a go on some and the difference from cheaper ones I’ve used in the last was nuts.

Yeah would agree that “fanatical bird watcher, lives on a salt marsh” warrants a bigger budget.

The cheapest Olympus 8 x 40, DPS1, are excellent. See the reviews. About £60.

Opticron are great bins for the money. One of the kids dropped mine so I’m looking at Viking bins. They make the RSPB range as well.

Ok, thanks for the replies so far , 4-500 is well out of my league unfortunately. Also, I maybe should add she’s only about 4’10” so a pair of german U boat commander binos wouldnt work for her. Something pocket sized , visual clarity being more important than magnification as she lives right on the bank of the river, but loads of birds come into her garden.
also looking to set up a spotting scope or similar in her upstairs window ,the added elevation takes her line of sight up over the tree tops directly on to the marsh then.

If you get some additional budget (£170) something like these would be pretty good all round – https://www.cliftoncameras.co.uk/Opticron-Discovery-8×42-Binoculars

https://www.opticron.eu/docs/reviews/Discovery_WP_PC_8x42_BBC_Wildlife_Apr14.pdf

I bought these for a Namibian trip that never happened 🙁
They’re probably (undoubtedly) rubbish in comparison with a lot of others, but they seem very good to me

So what sort of features should I be looking for? Could a small telescope be used as a spotting scope? Are the optics set up to see something at ranges of a mile or less, or are they only for distant objects? I have a small scope which was quite cheap, a present , but it was good enough that I can see the Jovian moons on a good night.
Know nothing of this subject, happy to take all advice. Is the general consensus that my budget is too small?

Another vote for Opticron. Excellent VFM. Please up your budget & don’t buy cheap (buy cheap, buy twice) Even look at some used?

Yes, your budget’s too small. Especially if she’s a keen birder. Have a look at http://www.at-infocus.co.uk/in-focus-shops/ They do new & used stuff & know their stuff!

These are out of your budget but are brilliant bins in my experience.

Celestial bins

I bought some Celestron Granite a few years ago, incredibly good for the price I paid at sub £200.

I have nothing against buying used, in fact i intend on cruising ebay later, hence why the features I should be looking for is important rather than price guide, if you catch my drift.

You don’t want pocket sized if she’s not leaving the house

You want the biggest set of lenses you can get, that will give a brighter image and will be easier to use, especially as eyes age. I’d say 30-32mm minimum, probably 40mm ish

I’d avoid going for anything 10x, 8x is plenty and will limit the risk of not being able to hold them steady

Your budget is quite low sadly, you won’t get much good stuff unless it’s really old. Optics are pricey…!

Look at brands like Opticron, Steiner, Kowa

Very gratefull for all advice and recommendations so far.

@johnnymarone, YGM.

@esselgruntfuttock
Thanks for that link mate, i will have a good look later.

Very impressed with the helpful responses, thanks all.

Got some opticron and some viking though rspb

Both 100 quid ish and both great value.

I’d not be going over 10x unless she has a tripod.

One other option a scope n camera mount? Sit back and watch on your phone?

I’ve used Opticron for years for stalking. I prefer them to most German glass.

I hate to be “that guy” but at £50 odd quid you could buy anything as they will all be the same, cheap glass that will look OK on a bright day at a low magnification.

The jump to £150 / £200 makes quite a difference.

Oh and avoid ALL “zoom” binos or scopes, unless you are paying £1k upwards.

Olympus for £60 are great, make very good cameras so must know a wee bit about optics
They are a bit like recommending a Specialized bike to a novice not the best but perfectly capable

https://rmacleod.co.uk/

Usually hard to beat on price and a range of opticrons that will or should be around your budget

I have these in 8*42. Good price for ED glass, recommended if you can stretch your budget

https://www.focalpointopticsltd.com/product-page/pre-loved-celestron-granite-9×33-boxed-as-new-unwanted-gift

A bit cheaper, i have these in 8*25 that we take when we go out on the bike, maybe worth checking out

https://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/barr-stroud-sahara-8-x-42-binoculars.html

ED, HD, There are several terms but what they mean is that a coating is applied to the glass to reduce light reflection and dispersal and gives you a clearer, brighter image

There are a few threads posted already but advice boils down to:

Buy the best you can afford
2 numbers are usually magnification * aperture. Divide the second by the first and the bigger the number, the brighter the image, so 8*42 will normally be brighter than 10*42 for instance.
8* is usually fine for birdwatching, a good balance between magnification and field of vision: it’s good to be able to scan the sky but higher magnifications make this harder s you can’t see quite as much of the sky at once.
Bigger aperture means bigger lens at the end, and that means heavier. Bear that in mind if your mum is petite, perhaps

I asked this question a couple of months ago, except it was for binoculars for my wife, not your mother. 😉

I had a bigger budget, about £200. I was spoiled for choice at that price. Went for a set of Vortex Diamondbacks 10×42 from Uttings. Really impressed by them. Wife loves them and they’ve already had plenty of use.

Divide the second by the first and the bigger the number, the brighter the image, so 8*42 will normally be brighter than 10*42 for instance.

This number is the diameter of the exist pupil. In normal day light our pupils are about 3mm across. So 8 42 are no brighter than 10 42 in ordinary daylight. The extra light is just dumped onto the iris. In low light the bigger exit pupil gives a benefit as the iris expands

I think some thing 7×35 or 8×32 will do the job well. Particularly as a smaller older person probably won’t want to hold a heavy pair for long

We have a pair of these. Over budget but great

https://avalonoptics.co.uk/avalon-8×32-mini-hd-binoculars/?gclid=CjwKCAjw07qDBhBxEiwA6pPbHuJIZJPfEyz6zKUZcb5a-cd5JkeoJYndY7si7gcK8ud9NK-NT6GeEhoCoKsQAvD_BwE

Or look at the RSPCA site and choose 32mm binoculars to budget

https://shopping.rspb.org.uk/binoculars/rspb-puffinr-8-x-32-binoculars.html?ClickType=Text&ListType=&ListName=&Position=26

Useful list here

https://www.expertreviews.co.uk/accessories/1405550/best-binoculars-for-birdwatching-nature-spotting-compact-full-sized-from-50

Thanks for all the help. Any one got any real life experience of the Olympus DPS binos? Shop in my locale stocks them, so might be worth a punt if theyre any good…

When you were a kid did you ever play the birthday+christmas card? Time to play it in reverse I reckon 😉

For best performance in low light, 10×50’s are the best, they give the largest exit pupil – if you hold the glasses up away from your eyes, the bright dot of light you see is the exit pupil, the larger the better, as that lets more light through to the eyes which is important in dim light during winter and dawn/dusk, or even at night under moonlight.
IIRC, you get the exit pupil size by dividing the larger number by the smaller, so 10×50 gets a 5mm exit pupil.
8×42 actually gets an exit pupil very slightly larger, but magnification isn’t as great; however the glasses will be smaller and easier to hold, as they’re more likely to be a roof-prism design, just like two tapered tubes joined together with a hinge. Anything less than £100 or so isn’t really worth considering.

Olympus 8×21 DPC1 have been fine for my birdseed feeder watching. Not too expensive. I’d probably go 10x next time but about £75 will see you right. I like mine. It’s the only time I can correct my vision enough to see out of both eyes!

https://www.hdewcameras.co.uk/olympus-pocket-8×21-dpci-silver-4253-p.asp?gclid=CjwKCAjw07qDBhBxEiwA6pPbHiMjh8pzPrtf_f0-eVHYlEjbeiBdNyN_5PQW_0cdaGIT1HYUpqDEYxoCN1YQAvD_BwE

@scuttler,
After reading through this, that is exactly my plan. No point in her having them in December when its probably pissing down and dark by 4pm.

Its looking like I will up the budget, as I had already bought her a birthday pressie, but you only get one old gal, and she is knocking on now, so why not. She would do it for me.

As others have said; pushing the budget up over £100 will get you something significantly better than the £50-75 jobs. Better quality lenses, better coatings meaning a brighter image, better made, waterproof, all that sort of thing. For general birdwatching, 8x is fine; 30/32 front element as a minimum, 40/42mm does make things that much brighter. The brighter the image, the less eyestrain when using them, too. The tiny 20/25 pocket models are only really any good on very bright sunny days. I messed around for years with cheap and small binoculars, and it really is worth spending the extra, if you can afford it. A better quality pair will last ages to, if looked after. Of course, as you go up in price, you get better quality, so a £300-400 pair will be noticeably better than a £100-200 pair, generally; you start to see better edge to edge sharpness, and chromatic aberration (purple and green ‘fringing’ around subjects against a bright background) is reduced. But I think the £100-200 price range is the sweet spot for most people. I use a pair of Nikon Prostaff 8×42, and they are excellent. Not too big and heavy. I think their 8×32 are around £130-140, so something like that might be perfect for size and weight to carry around everywhere.

I bought a set of these after a bit of reading around a couple of years ago. Very happy with them.

https://www.picstop.co.uk/general-purpose-binoculars/vanguard-endeavor-ed-binoculars-8×32.html?currency=1

Looks like there’s a 15% off on there too.

One review mentioned that a 2 hinge design makes for nicer carry in the hand, as there’s a more natural handle, which I’d not considered that before. S’true, though!

Your eye pupil diameter reduces with age, from 8mm in a teenager to 3mm when you are elderly so a large exit pupil may be unnecessary.You may be better off with a 32 objective as light from a 42 may be wasted. Saves carrying the extra weight of a 42

Your eye pupil diameter reduces with age, from 8mm in a teenager to 3mm when you are elderly so a large exit pupil may be unnecessary.

While there might be some truth in that, going for binoculars that are already compromised in the amount of light they pass through to the eye doesn’t strike me as helping in any way at all.
These people do a huge range of binos at all prices, which can give you a good idea of what might be worth looking at, however, it’s no substitute for actually looking through a selection, so find some that look like they might be ok, then check around for any camera/optical dealers local that might have a choice.
https://www.uttings.co.uk/c493-optics/

As recommended to me on here I bought my Dad who had trouble getting both eyes focused with binoculars a Hawke Endurance ED 10×42 monocular available for around £100. Fantastic optics and lightweight, fits in a coat pocket. So good I later bought us a pair of 8×42

The age and pupil thing is right, but you need to marry the two up perfectly to benefit. A bigger exit pupil is far more forgiving to use

What about one of these camera binoculars ?. they were a thing in the 80’s though I guess the camera aspect of it was quite cheap quality wise, but nowadays with digital there might be something more worthy.
That way she can see and get a snap of it all. Memories are best when they can be uploaded.

Any thoughts on theae for £100?

Nikon

The tiny 20/25 pocket models are only really any good on very bright sunny days

Not found that to be the case sitting in my doing room watching the parakeets munching on my birdseed in the dull light and rain. I’ve been very pleased with them, but would like a little more magnification rather than light.

Something like a parakeet, which contrasts well against a background, is a bit different to say a Wren in it’s typical habitat. I used a set of 20s for years, and the 8x42s are so much clearer, sharper, brighter.

Any thoughts on theae for £100?

The ‘Aculon’ range seem to be the older porro prism design, so will be bulkier and heavier than the now more popular roof prism designs. Porro prism binoculars are technically better than roof, but these days, optics are so good there’s little or nothing in it. If you’re not so fussed about size and weight, those Acculons are very good value.