With the possibility of regular power cuts looming, I need to invest in an uninterruptible power supply for the epos equipment in my shop.

These come in all shapes and sizes, so what would the STW hive mind recommend for just running the equivalent of two PC’s/printers and monitors for a couple of hours?

You could try the APC UPS selector tool to get an idea of what capacity you need.

APC UPS Selector/Calculator – Find the Correct Battery Backup

and armed with that info, search around.  APC themselves are perfectly good but I don’t know how they compare price-wise with others.

Honestly a couple of hours for two PCs and monitors is going to be quite expensive. Most UPS are only really designed to run for a few minutes to enable things to shut down without corruption or to give time for a genny to start up.

If you go on the APC website, there is a calculator which tells you which model you need. You will need to know the average wattage of all the devices combined.

https://www.apc.com/shop/uk/en/tools/ups_selector/

Go old school

Still have the price hub in use 🤣

Looking at the calculations it’s around 1000-1200w

Tbh even if it gives me time to finish with the current customer and shut down correctly that’ll be abonus.

That’s how we used to do it in the pub on an evening.

It was better than being closed but there were always more mistakes.

Would something like a jackery/ solar generator(battery and inverter In one) be a better bet for your use – subject to less regulation over switch over etc.

Would take time to set up when your switching over – but does mean you can move your power around as required.

https://www.apc.com/shop/uk/en/products/APC-Smart-UPS-SC-420VA-230V/P-SC420I

I’ve got an older one of those, old enough that it’s in BBC Model B shade of brown. Just replaced the battery as it would only keep the load i have going for about 2 minutes.

New battery lasts about quarter of an hour. That’s 3x NAS, an ethernet switch and the router. So i can still talk to the NAS (only locally) when everything else goes down.

It’s good for the momentary glitches in power i get a couple of times a month (something between all the lights going dim, and up to a minute when there’s a small issue on the network)

If there’s actually a power cut, it’s no good. I’d need to spend a grand to just keep the very very basics running for an hour or two.

(I live in the middle of nowhere, so proper powercuts are a pain in the arse, and usually major.)

Would something like a jackery/ solar generator(battery and inverter In one) be a better bet for your use – subject to less regulation over switch over etc.

I don’t think I could justify the investment in a jackory or similar – we wouldn’t get the return in sales. I suppose it’s just about a bit of back up rather than a harsh shutdown in case of a power failure, as it takes around 20mins to restart and recover data (if it’s not lost) when there’s a powercut.

I don’t think I could justify the investment in a jackory or similar

Think you’re going to just have to suck it up then! Most cheaper Jackory/etc only provide 500W anyway… your power requirement is huge at 1200W – are you sure that’s right? Are you running gaming PCs with 40 inch plasma screens?!
Possibly time to invest in some more energy-efficient kit if so (can easily get a mini-PC & monitor than run <100W)

your power requirement is huge at 1200W – are you sure that’s right? Are you running gaming PCs with 40 inch plasma screens?!

No idea – those calculators don’t give a huge range of specs for things that aren’t big spec. It’s two old pcs, so old they  are in need of a desperate update (back office runs xp!), A couple of monitors (one touch screen), two printers (which don’t need backup), & an infrared scanner.

This one – https://www.broadbandbuyer.com/products/41025-apc-be850g2-uk/?gclid=Cj0KCQjw48OaBhDWARIsAMd966B9jZgRKRXlTURB1_PHbg5vBZy2DXiOmr9D5yO98JqWYFK_WSZiVR8aAv4lEALw_wcB

Its what we run in our stores so doing the exact same job. If the power isn’t enough just turn off one of the machines after the cut, or get two or maybe 3, they’re cheap enough. They have UPS and non UPS sockets so you can replace any extension leads with these and allow the less important stuff to die with the power.

Be aware the bigger, more industrial APC units tend to need kettle style heavy duty power cables so you can’t just plug any old thing in. This runs regular plugs and AFAIK is the biggest they do in this style.

EDIT – I just looked where I got ours from as I thought it was cheaper – https://www.ebuyer.com/951015-apc-back-ups-standby-ups-850va-520w-type-c-and-a-charging-ports-be850g2-uk

£99.99 Ex VAT.

Also swap one of your PCs for a laptop. Much lower power consumption + onboard battery, in combo you can run a laptop, printer and scanner for hours off one of these units.

From personal experience of a “prosumer” level APC UPS device (and subsequent googling), why not take the opportunity to add a smoke alarm to your order? It may qualify you for free shipping.

No idea – those calculators don’t give a huge range of specs for things that aren’t big spec.

should be a sticker on the back of the kit listing the power requirements. It won’t be as high as that.

The UPS linked above is meant for surviving power blips, or (as mentioned) just giving you enough time for a safe shutdown. No way will it see you through a 3 hour blackout! (From the specs, 34 mins @ 100W draw!)

I didn’t think there was a possibility of regular power cuts. I thought there is just a specific set of circumstances that could lead to them, i.e. very cold and not enough wind, plus a time of high usage such as early evening.

Are you not over worrying and potentially spending money needlessly? Are people really going to use your business in a powercut?

Could you use these things to run a gas boilers electric circuits in the event of a power cut?

back office runs xp!

And does this antique have internet access? How are you passing PCI compliance for card payments with that running?

Could you use these things to run a gas boilers electric circuits in the event of a power cut?

a UPS – not really, they’re not intended as a battery backup. One of the newer, portable “power generator” type things – yes. Obviously you’d need a plug on your boiler, rather than it being hardwired!

I didn’t think there was a possibility of regular power cuts. I thought there is just a specific set of circumstances that could lead to them, i.e. very cold and not enough wind, plus a time of high usage such as early evening.

Are you not over worrying and potentially spending money needlessly? Are people really going to use your business in a powercut?

this is a reasonable point though!!

No idea – those calculators don’t give a huge range of specs for things that aren’t big spec. It’s two old pcs, so old they are in need of a desperate update (back office runs xp!), A couple of monitors (one touch screen), two printers (which don’t need backup), & an infrared scanner.

if the infra-red scanner works off USB, could you just run the one part of the setup on a laptop? that’d give you an hour or 2 of offline running with 50% of your capacity, and just accept that the other till will take a while to get up and running

Zwift and a dynamo?

Zwift and a dynamo?

I’ve idly wondered why smart trainers don’t have a USB output so you could at least charge your phone or something… all those wattz going to waste 😂 The Neo can power itself when it’s being used so obviously has some kind of generator hardware built in!

Youd be better with a generator than a UPS.

I have a generator and circuitry for such emergencies to be able to power the heating boiler, freezer and light small power load (broadband/computers/ some lighting)

I didn’t think there was a possibility of regular power cuts. I thought there is just a specific set of circumstances that could lead to them, i.e. very cold and not enough wind, plus a time of high usage such as early evening.

Government says not much chance, boss of the national grid says there’s a high chance in January and February…… Now, who to believe. Also we do quite regularly get mini power cuts in the winter and it’s a pain when this happens so it’s something I’ve been look at for a while.

How are you passing PCI compliance for card payments with that running?

Our card payment supplier does this for us, the card machine processing is a completely different system to back office. Back office also doesn’t track or take any data other than basic z read, IE if the sale was a cash or card payment.

epos? If the power is going down over large areas, as planned, there’s no way the payment system will be robust enough to still work. I can’t see the telephone (line or mobile) system standing up for very long. As the power goes down, revert to £cash.

Regarding UPS, I picked up a pro one in a charity shop a while back. Popped new batteries in, good as new. It runs my PC (just the box, not the monitors etc) for less than an hour. They’re really not designed for continually powering things, just to tide you over for a short spell.

Youd be better with a generator than a UPS.

Generator doesn’t give you uninterruptible power though.  It only kicks in after you’re off and preferably after you’ve isolated the premises from the mains.
And these days a decent battery based system is probably cheaper over a year or two.  Certainly is on the ones our company has after 18 months.

Also remember that a UPS costs money to run so the bigger the unit the more it’ll cost to run.

I think it would be better to get a laptop and a simple power pack like one of these. Then just transfer the router etc over to the power pack in case of a power cut.

You could always use it when you go camping or having a BBQ.

Why not invest in tablet based epos? Comes with its own battery that should run it for several hours.

It’s two old pcs, so old they are in need of a desperate update

They are probably costing you a fair bit in mains power anyway. Every 100W is probably £50/year, and a newer PC with SSD rather than spinning HD will use less power.

Why not invest in tablet based epos? Comes with its own battery that should run it for several hours.

Was looking at new epos systems earlier this year, amade a day of it and went to the national retail show in Birmingham, spoke to all the epos stands. For what we need/would like, it’s around a 5k investment with installation and training and then £3-400 a month for licensing of the software. I’ve decided to stick with what I’ve got…. Until it goes Pop – or if I can get a grant of some form, which ever comes first.

a newer PC with SSD rather than spinning HD will use less power.

whilst true, a spinning hd uses at most ~5W more than a SSD. that means, every 200 hours its cost you ~40p more to run. A small SSD is maybe £20 if you’re happy to fit it yourself (a few hours if you need to transfer stuff across), so you have to run for 10,000 hours (4 years at 10 hours/day) to break even, after which point you’ll save £5 a year. I don’t think the economics are worth the hassle for most folks

Could you use these things to run a gas boilers electric circuits in the event of a power cut?

Yep – was looking at that last night. CH pump is 60W, need to power one solenoid valve for CH circuit, the boiler electrics which includes a solenoid for the gas feed. – Probably under 200W all in, so 3 hour blackout is 600Wh ie not a lot.

You can get a 2kWH UPS for £200 from Amazon, which would be ample.

Why not invest in tablet based epos? Comes with its own battery that should run it for several hours.

The local BT Exchange / mobile network cell site won’t last forever on battery backup once the power goes down, so EPOS will stop working at some point.

footflaps

You can get a 2kWH UPS for £200 from Amazon, which would be ample.

Link?

You can get a 2kWH UPS for £200 from Amazon, which would be ample.

Link?

My bad 2.2 KW but not KWh…

Looks like the actual storage capacity is minimal at that price point…

footflaps

My bad 2.2 KW but not KWh…

Looks like the actual storage capacity is minimal at that price point…

Yeah that’s what I wondered unfortunately 😔

I’ve got the same problem with my reef tank. It can’t be without water movement for any period of time as coral rely on water movement for respiration etc, so I want a system with low power draw but long run time. UPS are the opposite.
The only solution I can think of is a cheap UPS and bodging in a much larger 12V leisure battery.

Looks like the actual storage capacity is minimal at that price point…

yes, because a UPS isn’t intended to be a long-term alternative power source!

The local BT Exchange / mobile network cell site won’t last forever on battery backup once the power goes down

you’d hope at least 3 hours though! I googled it and it very much depends on individual pieces of infrastructure… the cabinets have backup batteries, bigger sites have generators etc. There’s no standard though. Apparently there’s meetings going on now to determine what protective measures there’ll be for telecommunications networks (priority fuel deliveries etc) in event of blackouts.