Driving home tonight,I’m approaching a slip road on a dual carriageway. I’m going 60-65mph and a car appears at the slip road and decided to pull out. Without altering my speed I need to now pull around him as he’s pulled into the left lane. I pass him and start to pull back in but also having to accelerate a little as I noticed his lights tilting with the way he booted it. So he’s now behind me,very close,and full beam has come on.

This is after he pulls out of a junction making me alter my direction of driving. I am pretty annoyed at this full beam malarky after he pulled out on me and put his lights on. ‘Apparently he braked and the police van behind him ‘nearly went up the back end of him too’

Not long after, I get pulled over by the police and they ask me if I know why I was pulled over. I reply with a No. One of them tells me that I was ‘millimeters’ from the front of the guys car when I pulled back in. They then went on to explain that the way slip roads work, it’s common decency to pull out to the right lane to let them filter in. I told them that I used to do this but have recently changed as I’ve had a moment at the slip road a few miles back from the one in question when I couldn’t pull over as cars were already in the right lane, yet the driver still pulled out of a Junction into the flow of traffic. I told them that I had changed my ways on this because its a junction just like a T junction, and cars should join the flow of traffic at similar speeds without causing change in direction or speed of the cars already on it. They agreed and seemed to accept my ways on this matter. I think!

If I decided not to alter my speed I’d have been into the back of the guy earlier tonight (hardly likely to do that for spite) but at the same time I still had to pull into the other lane to avoid him as I wasn’t going to start braking with cars behind me when I can go around him.

So I get pulled over for pulling back into the lane I was already in, too close to a car that’s pulled out of a junction and accelerated up to speed and come close to me. Do I then have to slow down and shoulder check to find a way back into the left lane which I was already in, now 2,3,5 cars back from where I was seconds before? Or do I pull back in to the lane in front of the car that just pulled out from the slip road? I decided to go around it, to avoid braking/altering my speed as there were other cars in the left lane behind me.

I could have gone on and on with them (the police) and to be fair, they were seeing it from my point of view for most of it. I asked at what point after a 90 degree T junction is it acceptable for these people to just indicate and filter out willy nilly without even knowing what the cars might have trouble with in the 2nd lane if they too had to pull out? It’s wrong to do so and I told them I choose this approach to stop the bad habits from taking over completely. I think they agreed that a car should wait until it’s safe to join at similar speeds but at the same time they were giving me the impression with their words that it might be safer to join in the fun and do this common courtesy thing all the time to save these issues. This is the bit that peeves me off, that the guy that pulled out of a junction in the first place had caused all this, even after I had gone into the other lane for him. My reactions were a big WTF when the blue lights came on! Having sat a motorcycle test and had my fingers rapped during one of the lessons leading up to it for pulling out of a short slip road on the motorbike about 150ft in front of a lorry and not waiting for it to pass,it’s just confusing. I was told to slow right down or possibly come to a stop if it wasn’t safe to pull out from short slip roads. I now never pull out of slip roads after that lesson. If a driver is in the slip road and see’s cars approaching in the mirror, they don’t know for sure what cars are approaching in the outside lane so they are expecting one car to pull out for them without knowing if that car in lane 1 also has to shift lanes. It’s madness and it’s wrong.

Quite liked how they told me that they nearly hit the guy from behind (maybe because you were driving too close?!) then after we all drove off, he was approx 25ft from the car in front of him in a 50 zone.. having passed me over 50,in a 50 zone.

Feel free to attack me. *also for posting in the wrong forum :O)

Sounds like they were bored – you were very patient with them I would have been an a**e and probably made it worse

Probably

Not read it all but if safe to do so then pull into the right hand lane, it’s common courtesy. Is not like a T junction, it’s a slip road.

Sounds like you cut the bloke up out of spite?

Thinking about it, if I didn’t pull back in, I’d have been going 60-65mph in the right lane,wanting to get back in, when all I wanted to do was drive in the slow lane all the way home to save some fuel as I was in no rush to get anywhere. All that is far too much silliness with lane swapping etc for me. Left mirror checking and left shoulder checking to get back out of that fast lane? Not a chance I’m going to get into the swing of that crap.

I told them I want to stick to my ways and will continue for these reasons.

RE:pulling back in for spite – I pulled back in to the lane and told them that I honestly didn’t know how close he was. I told them that I saw his lights and accelerated a bit as I noticed that he booted it just before putting full beam on me. For me to pass him as he was going approx 40mph, while I was going 60-65, and for me to be fully past him and starting to pull back in, with a bit of acceleration on my part having realized how close he now was, I still don’t accept any blame even if we had touched because I never for one moment slowed down on him during all of that. I think he should have been talked to about common decency considering what I did in the first place. Maybe there was spite from his part?

Was speaking to a cop about it and he reckoned that if I was to get charged for whatever reason,they would have been told to get out of court and stop wasting police time as the guy altered my driving.

As far as I’m aware you’d fail a driving test for joining and then (potentially) undertaking like the other driver did.

Isn’t the driver joining supposed to give way to traffic to their right on the road they’re joining?

Once you’d decided to go right and let him come out, you don’t have some kind of automatic right to move back in dangerously, even if the driver you let out is behaving like an arse and booting it.

I used to match their speed and box the buggers in behind the next slow moving vehicle, but that was when I was 20 and foolish. Now I just ease off and let them get on with it.

Sounds like you were both very foolish but you caused more of an issue by cutting back in instead of waiting for him to pass.

Stupid wee short one at Munlochy or N kessock by any chance?? Not so much a slip road as a half arsed dangerous attempt at one.

If I cast my mind back to my Pass Plus;

On joining a motorway you try and match the speed of the left hand lane and display your right indicator, if possible/ necessary other road users will make room for you.

Stopping at the end of the slip road is dangerous, you’ve got a 0-60+ sprint to pull out as traffic bears down on you. In 6 seconds the a car travelling at 60mph will have travelled over 500 feet.

Also when overtaking the vechicle you have just passed should be fully viewable in your rear view mirror when you back into the left lane.

Surfmatt would know.

As far as I’m aware you’d fail a driving test for joining and then (potentially) undertaking like the other driver did.

Good point. Only I am pretty sure I never indicated back in. Not sure how important or against the law that is in this instance.

martinhutch +1.

This seems to be happening more and more. On my commute there are many occasions when people come down slip roads and seem to make no effort to match the speed of the carriageway and find a gap to merge into.
If I move out, I can, but it is not always possible.

Some of them seem to wait until the very last minute before looking in the mirror and then either panic brake or just keep coming out regardless.
Some drivers seem to be hell bent on joining the carriageway in front of you, even if there is a massive gap behind into which they can merge. They hoof it up the slip road and as long as they get a nose in front, seem to think it’s fine to just drift out.
And as the OP mentions, you also get the morons who once you have moved out for them insist on trying to undertake you, rather than giving you space to move back into the inside and then overtaking you.

I did a Driver Awareness course in June (35 in a 30) and the instructor bloke said he has noticed this type of slip road etiquette seemed to be becoming the norm. He said it was his current pet hate.

Stopping at the end of the slip road is dangerous, you’ve got a 0-60+ sprint to pull out as traffic bears down on you. In 6 seconds the a car travelling at 60mph will have travelled over 500 feet.

Yes, I’ve just read this as well. It’s a bit kamikaze for me to be honest and I see the thinking of the bike driving instructor. To follow that rule, and not take into consideration how much traffic could be in both lanes is just stupid. Maybe worth a try but as the person filtering in you would have to know 100% that it might be brakes on after that manic sprint. No questions.

At the end of any sliproad there are give way markings no?

When I went on my learn to drive slowly course recently it was pointed out that the right of way is yours if you are on the carriageway, if some interloper runs into the side of you or causes you to brake because they pull into a carriage way they are in the wrong as the lines are actually give way lines. They should stop or GIVE WAY to oncoming traffic

I Could be wrong but every one of us that answered “to move into the middle lane” and courteousley give way were slammed by the bod doing the “EDUCATING” ,the question was basically a situation which seemed impossible this applied to motorway slip roads also from the info supplied ,not one of us in the room thought to stop at the entry to the carriageway

It’s a really nuisance and happening more and more*. It’s clear what the double dotted lines mean, the copper should know that IMO.

* often Disco drivers with my neighbour driving.

flap_jack – Member

martinhutch +1.

+2. I normally let them pass then slot behind them … can’t be arsed to race them. Or if they are slow, after letting them join, I just drive ahead of them at a distance then slot in. No hurry. Just can’t be arsed to get wind up by zombies.

Oh ya … you have the right of way so you are not wrong IMO.

Sounds like you were both very foolish but you caused more of an issue by cutting back in instead of waiting for him to pass.

Like already said by someone above, I slow down and let him pass me, that’s him undertaking me,isn’t it?

Bedmaker, Yeah, the N.Kessock one. Impossible for 98% of the cars on the roads to get to 70mph in that short stretch.

I wonder if the pigs would have pulled the other guy over for undertaking if you hadn’t moved back in?

They were in the wrong initially for just pulling out when you had right of way (regardless of what is common courtesy). Then you were in the wrong for apparently pulling back in and cutting them up. Either brake (people behind can deal with it themselves, they should be prepared for it) or let them take off up the inside and pull back in. It’s tempting to teach them a lesson or get annoyed but no-one gains from it.

I tried to get his number but got a bit confused which vehicle it was. Urgh! To be fair, the police up here are always polite and never wind me up. It’s always civilized and I think that’s the way most highlanders see them.

I was shocked at the reactions and attitudes of the police down south on a police,camera,action type programme the other night. So nasty and provoking to the geezer.

Like already said by someone above, I slow down and let him pass me, that’s him undertaking me,isn’t it?

Maybe if you’d indicated your intention to pull back in he’d moved out. If they decided to undertake you when you stayed in that lane then maybe none of this would have happened, you were foolish cutting in front of him whatever he did.

What breadcrumb said.

OP don’t dwell on being stopped, 100s of people every day get stopped just for a chat, by which I mean an actual chat, not one of those patronising “having a chat” chats 🙂 If you’d done anything too bad they’d have done you for it!

EDIT Unless they were Highland cops of course, who as everybody knows are by far the most reasonable, most intelligent and most handsome of all cops everywhere.

All this driving is one reason I am thinking of investing in a Roadhawk dash cam … arrghhh … zombie maggots about … 😡

I normally let them pass then slot behind them

If there’s no cars behind me in the lane I was in, I do this quite often. If I can see that they’re booting it when I’m definitely going to be going slower than them seconds later, then I won’t start increasing my speed by 10-20mph just to keep up with them. Tonight I had a cop behind me plus other traffic. I wasn’t shoulder checking,checking mirrors and slotting in for nobody.

Bet it was a BMW or audi….

Bedmaker, Yeah, the N.Kessock one. Impossible for 98% of the cars on the roads to get to 70mph in that short stretch.

If you already knew this, I’d say you should’ve had the sense to move out in anticipation of incoming cars if it was possible

It’s his job to join safely but you obviously didn’t help him there

It’s your job to move back in safely but he obviously didn’t help you there

not great all round IMO

Driving is shit enough without the cops being clueless.
There’s a roundabout near me with a 3 lane approach, 2 lanes are marked to turn left. When you’re waiting to enter from the next entrance road, you can’t tell if the middle lane cars are going straight on or left, unless they indicate. Its annoying because you have to wait and no-one indicates left – last time I was there a cop car approached, I waited … he turned left without indicating just like all the other dicks.
They then went on to explain that the way slip roads work, it’s common decency to pull out to the right lane to let them filter in
Is wrong.Its common practice for drivers to keep in the right or middle lane miles from any junction just so they don’t have to change lanes to do this. Doesn’t make it right.

approaching a slip road on the inside lane, if it may seem necessary: slow down leave space for traffic to join and prepare to adjust speed or change lane.

approaching a slip road on the outside lane same.

glad everyone made it home

learn from it 🙂

I read this ten minutes ago then get a text from the crazy driver saying to read it lol, martins driving has always been good, even when he had a dead badger on the parcel shelf driving it around Inverness trying to sell it.

Ive not really got a good enough handle on what ur saying to judge your situation but there is far too much panicking around sliproads.

Two types, people accelerating to join not matching speed and finding a gap. Either expecting others to move over or then having to panic braking

Or from the other side if you are in the nearside lane doing 60 with a good gap someone joining from your left at a matched speed and then moving out into the middle lane shortly after does not even impact you! Don’t panic to move out or slow down..

It’s his job to join safely

Exactly. That’s the jist of it. Junction rules. Rules for the U.K. Not India or Thailand! He should never just fire out because he doesn’t know who’s approaching the slip road. He might be pulling out on someone that’s been up on holiday from the far south that’s never even seen that slip road before. So if you pull out with that mindset, that’s like saying you go into that slip road, knowing that some folk know how to anticipate the road layout,but others won’t, because some know the area, others don’t.. So you do it anyway. Crazy.

Can’t comment on the pull in but Plod were wrong to tell you to let him in. Its a give way. the joining car has to give way, you have the right of way and if needed they must stop. No ifs or buts. Being nice and allowing them out is just a very nasty custom to help traffic run smoother and as such has become enshrined.
It is all these stupid little rule breakings that create accidents. Under no circumstances EVER
should rights and the law be subordinate to custom.

Selling a dead badger! Nah,I’m not a good driver. I speed and have my faults.

That’s why I get pulled over :OD

if you drive around expecting other drivers to be perfect you may get a surprise one day

it does not matter who is right or wrong in the end.

Being nice and allowing them out is just a very nasty custom to help traffic run smoother and as such has become enshrined.
It is all these stupid little rule breakings that create accidents. Under no circumstances EVER
should rights and the law be subordinate to custom.

+100. All this altering of driving practices to fit in with the wrong is a joke. The police looked at each other and kind of smirked when I replied with ‘No’ when asked if I knew what I had done wrong.. after someone pulled out of a junction in front of me causing me to move over or slow down. Wishing that something did happen in some ways. Would have loved every moment of it.

If the motorway is quiet enough there is no reason not to move over to the right hand lane. This keeps the flow going.

It’s not give way markings at the end of the slip road either.

Can’t comment on the pull in but Plod were wrong to tell you to let him in. Its a give way.

I don’t believe they would be wrong in saying you should let him in. They’d be wrong if they said you should let the other person in because they have right of way, but that’s a different statement.
If you can move safely into the other lane to let traffic join, then that’s what you should do. Not doing so is not upholding your right of way, it’s demonstrating a lack of care and attention.

^ +1