- PSA 'Bargain' Hope HB160
I’ve worked in composites for about fifteen years or so and I can’t believe how cheap they are doing it for. You just can’t compare it to mass produced brands like Santa Cruz or whoever. It’s the production processes and quality control that is the major cost along with skilled, educated labour.Posted 2 months agoeddSubscriber
Could it be that they underestimated the sales so the tooling and development costs are now spread out over more bikes and they are passing that back to ALL the customers rather than just the new ones? If they had just discounted it now then they may well have put off the off the original buyers who were early adopters and probably more likely to buy their stuff in future from investing in their products in future.
Well played Hope.
I really hope this is right, for all that the geometry is undoubtedly conservative (/dated), I really admire Hope for investing the massive amount of time and money that it must have taken to get this bike to market.Posted 2 months agochiefgrooveguruMember
There’s very little wrong with the geometry that wouldn’t be helped by chopping 50-75mm off all the seat tube towers, renaming the current sizes XS, S and M, and adding some larger sizes.
I think £5500 for a European made composite bike is incredible. Look at the prices for Unno, Antidote, Robotbike and Arbr – almost as much for just a frame.Posted 2 months agodudeofdoomSubscriber
I’ve worked in composites for about fifteen years or so and I can’t believe how cheap they are doing it for. You just can’t compare it to mass produced brands like Santa Cruz or whoever. It’s the production processes and quality control that is the major cost along with skilled, educated labour.
Yep… the weaves visible as well so even more production hassle, no filling and painting and its done over here.Posted 2 months ago
The proprietary stuff doesnt bother me. Most of the time you upgrade TO Hope stuff so having it all on there already means no upgrading so who gives a monkeys and if anything does need replacing Hope are not going to let you down. They make it all in house and have a long history of supporting older components.Posted 2 months agoOnzadogSubscriber
The rear end is fantastic. Because Hope make the swingarm, hub, rotor and caliper, there’s no adjustment to worry about. The caliper just bolts down in one position, the right one.
I see proprietary kit here as an advantage, but as planned obsolescence on a specialized.Posted 2 months agobigdeanSubscriber
Still no bottle mount for a 5k bike. (But i admit some dont mind that missing).
Looked at the one at 18 bikes. Look nice but 5k is still a lot for a bike for me.
I’m sure there is a carbon fiber producer in notts (toray?) Hope are handy with a cnc so moulds shouldn’t be to hard, the only development/ dificuly i can find is lay up blue printing & testing to make consistant and how to make the bladders. Plus auto clave costs (but i dont see many bikes needing autoclave as such more oven with pressurised bladders in a steel mould.Posted 2 months agobenpinnickSubscriber
I think its a cool bike for the money (now). Jeez if I could make a carbon frame with that kit for 5K in the UK I would be all over it. Just need a massive factory full of CNC machines and £500k spare first. Geo is personal, for some it will be bang on. The proprietary stuff? I guess Hope have the rep for long term support so if you want the bike its probably no big deal.Posted 2 months ago
The value is amazing considering all the parts at the cheapest you can find them for non-trade, let alone full RRP. What are top of the line 36’s and X2’s – £900 & £600?
Even at £5.5k it’s cheaper than the top 3 most expensive Bronson builds on the SC website, and only the top one comes with Kashima as standard.Posted 2 months agojuliansMember
I think if the geo was a bit longer with shorter seat tubes itd sell like hotcakes .
I guess thinking about it rationally it is now good value,even if still a lot of money, and the proprietary bits are mostly not the sort of thing you would upgrade at a later date – With the notable exception of the brakes , i can see being locked into hope brakes as a big problem for some.
For me its mostly the geo that is the issue.
Good on hope for doing it though, i hope they do a longrr/Lower version in tbe futurrPosted 2 months agocrankriderMember
From what I have read in a trade mag Hope are selling the bikes as quickly as they can make them at the moment – Maybe the dealers are bugging them for bikes and they cant deliver so they are increasing production capability, the article did also say how they are planning to build more space and that they have spent 1.5mil per year for the last few years on new machinery – Hope sound like they are flying.
I did read the 1/2 a mill figure quoted for frame development but remember they have probably received a 150% tax reduction on this amount as there is currently an R&D tax incentive for manufacturers developing new in-house techniques they cannot easily obtain elsewhere / buy off the shelf, an in-house UK carbon frame development fits into that quite nicely.Posted 2 months agobenpinnickSubscriber
It works out about 25p in the £ I think on average (Having done a few previously), so still a fair chunk of outlay, and thats only on what can be considered genuine R&D. Just making stuff that other people have made doesn’t count in many cases even if its not readily available in the UK, and HMRC are fairly hot on it.Posted 2 months agoRosssMember
I stood in Swinnos last week contemplating one of these, beautiful in the flesh and you have to give kudos for the process they’ve taken in building it. For me I prefer the bigger wheels now however the Hope has so much going for it it’s still in contention. Slash 9.9 or HB 160?Posted 2 months agodirkpitt74Subscriber
“Hope’s first bike, the HB160 was successfully launched last August and received praise from all who rode it. An asking price of £7500 certainly put it into the Superbike category, but given the quality finish, attention to detail and uniqueness, it’s not unjustified. However this price didn’t really sit well with one of Hope’s founders, Ian Weatherill. He’s been quoted many times stating that UK manufacturing can easily compete in the global market, but initial pricing for the HB160 didn’t really reflect this.
Over the Christmas break Hope spent time reassessing their Carbon bike program and finding ways to bring a UK manufactured bike to the market at a more affordable price.
They have managed to recalculate the absorption of the R&D costs for their whole Carbon bike development program. This has enabled them to drop the retail price of their HB160 to £5500. They realise this is a major shift in pricing, but there will be no compromise in quality. The frames will still be meticulously manufactured in Barnoldswick by the same craftsmen.”
So looks like it’s a reevaluation of R&D costs and trying to make UK manufacturing competitive.Posted 2 months ago
Well done HopeSpeederSubscriber
julians – Member
i can see being locked into hope brakes as a big problem for some.
I expect if you’re the type to be bothered by Hope brakes, you’ll probably not be interested in the other Hope stuff on the bike and it won’t appeal anyway.
I love the integration and some proper, better standards (radial caliper, a stiffer but narrower back end anyone?). I’ll not be buying one but then I’ve just bought a forever bike and it’s steel. I’d be very tempted by one of these even if the seat tube is a bit too long for my short legs really.Posted 2 months ago
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.