Pike air pressures

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  • Pike air pressures
  • Just interested as I’m now running mine at 55 psi instead of recommended 65 – 75 psi, they feel so much better and still not bottoming out even off a few jumps / rough runs yesterday

    Is everyone else running there’s under the air guide pressures?

    I’m 11.5 stone kitted up or there abouts and running 55psi

    So what you running on them? Trying to gauge whether it’s normal or not to run them much lower?

    cruzcampo
    Member

    Running 50 psi, im 85 kilo. I should be running 75 to 85 psi.

    Full open compression with 1 click. 4 clicks from turtle on rebound.

    Running very well and super plush.

    dan77
    Member

    I’m running lower than recommended on mine aswell and they feel great, I also run my revs lower on the hardtail, does everyone do this with rockshox? I been using fox for the last few years,

    deanfbm
    Member

    85kg, 150mm, 95psi, 2 tokens, i can still bottom out harshly on harsh gaps to flat.

    Soon going to 140, 3 tokens, i imagine ill be up to 110ish psi.

    Thing is, the harder im making them, the better they’re getting on flat out rough where suspension performance really matters, soo much grip, low speed grip feels pretty awesome too.

    I tend to run 18-20% sag on forks on all my bikes.

    Also, dont get too hung up on “plush”, what does plush in reality get you? Maybe a little mental booster, compromise on grip IMO.

    Suspension helps grip by maintaining tyre contact with the ground, plusher may improve that contact, but if your fork is that soft, with that little damping to get a “plush” feeling, the tyre won’t be loaded. At the end of the day, grip is ultimately reliant on force on the tyre and how tacky the rubber is (maybe some other small minor factors), if your tyre doesn’t have enough load on it, no matter how “plush” your suspension is, it’s gonna have naff all grip. Most of the time too, the bumps people are looking for their forks to maove on, the tyres are (or should be) dealing with, remember they’re part of the suspension system too.

    Plus don’t forget too, sag massively alters your geometry, i imagine some of these softer set-ups on the steeps start to feel particularly divey and running out of front end height very quickly. Dont hapr on about the damping propping you up, damping can only effect how quickly you get pitched over the front, the spring dictates ride height.

    cruzcampo
    Member

    @ 50 psi my sag is at 19% approx, no brake dive and no bottomless tokens fitted.

    If I start to get any issues DH i’ll add some more rebound first to return the fork up quicker and a little more compression.

    Plush is probably the wrong word, but they have super small bump compliance and take bigger ruts with ease.

    There is a huge thread on these on MTBR and majority are running way under pressure.

    95 psi? Jesus they must feel like a pogo stick at that!

    Mine are about 27% sag with 55psi in so absolutly fine sag wise, they feel better softer they run better and the damping feels improved, also I’ve not topped them out yet even a few drops / jumps yesterday , in fact still no where near full travel, but they felt great though tougher stuff and rocky chutes etc

    @cruz do you mean the lsc is turned all the way into positive then one click back to the minus sign?

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    I found the guide a decent starting point for once but with the bottomless tokens in I’ve dropped it further, which has improved the frankly ropey small bump performance without any obvious drawbacks. It does ride a little lower in the travel but not severely. I think I’ve got 35psi in them now, I’m 10 stone, which seems stupidly low frankly.

    Tested the new setup at innerleithen yesterday and it’s the first time I’ve really felt the Pikes were up to scratch- far better on the pattery stuff at the golfcourse where you really want the grip, but no worse on the bigger hits over at the dh.

    Room for improvement though. I’ve still got a feeling that the basic compression setup lacks the range for a lighter rider so I think I’ll probably be going with lighter oil at some point, or I might try and get some more stokens and keep working with the air spring. TBF they still feel too tight, like they’ve not broken in fully but they’ve had enough use that they should be.

    (@Dan- my Revs are higher I think, and all my coil Rockshox are stiffer than recommended, they always recommend me soft springs but that was terrible. The internet keeps recommending me extra soft! I’d bottom out off a kerb!)

    cruzcampo
    Member

    95 psi? Jesus they must feel like a pogo stick at that!

    Mine are about 27% sag with 55psi in so absolutly fine sag wise, they feel better softer they run better and the damping feels improved, also I’ve not topped them out yet even a few drops / jumps yesterday , in fact still no where near full travel, but they felt great though tougher stuff and rocky chutes etc

    @cruz do you mean the lsc is turned all the way into positive then one click back to the minus sign?

    I found pogo stick action @ 75 psi! With front brake on very very little movement pressing down. Reminded me of my 426 coils when pop locked out 😯 Actually regretted buying them as they felt so harsh, but @ 50psi they are just beautiful! I’m going to try 45psi and up to 60psi just to see how they compare.

    One thing i’ve found when letting air out is your can empty the entire fork in seconds when pressing down the valve with an allen key, so they need pumping up again from 0.

    I find they just plough through rocky stuff and are great for making progress on the trail chatter free. The red band on the fork leg has got to around 50% so far, so don’t think i’ll be needing any tokens.

    RE: LSC, yeah turned all the way anticlockwise away from the padlock, then one click back clockwise

    cruzcampo
    Member

    Northwind – Member
    I found the guide a decent starting point for once but with the bottomless tokens in I’ve dropped it further, which has improved the frankly ropey small bump performance without any obvious drawbacks. It does ride a little lower in the travel but not severely. I think I’ve got 35psi in them now, I’m 10 stone, which seems stupidly low frankly.

    Tested the new setup at innerleithen yesterday and it’s the first time I’ve really felt the Pikes were up to scratch- far better on the pattery stuff at the golfcourse where you really want the grip, but no worse on the bigger hits over at the dh.

    Room for improvement though. I’ve still got a feeling that the basic compression setup lacks the range for a lighter rider so I think I’ll probably be going with lighter oil at some point, or I might try and get some more stokens and keep working with the air spring. TBF they still feel too tight, like they’ve not broken in fully but they’ve had enough use that they should be.

    (@Dan- my Revs are higher I think, and all my coil Rockshox are stiffer than recommended, they always recommend me soft springs but that was terrible. The internet keeps recommending me extra soft! I’d bottom out off a kerb!)

    At 10 stone / 140 lbs thats showing 45-55 psi

    Youre running 35psi which is only 10 below lower recommendation, i’d give them a bash at 25psi and 30 psi! Just as an experiment, and report back. Like you say you’re a light rider so could be needed?

    Also adding the tokens increases difficulty to bottom out reduces the volume of air, hence more harshness, how is it when tokenless?

    Premier Icon maxtorque
    Subscriber

    Same as you pretty much OP, 55psi with one token for the UK,

    (i ran 65psi in the Alps a couple of weeks back, also with one token, to help prop the front up a bit on the continuous “steeps” found over there)

    cruzcampo
    Member

    Perhaps deanfbm shock pump is misreading if 18-20% sag is showing @ 85kilo weight & 95psi?

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    cruzcampo – Member

    Youre running 35psi which is only 10 below lower recommendation
    <snip>
    Also adding the tokens increases difficulty to bottom out reduces the volume of air, hence more harshness, how is it when tokenless?

    Aye, but bear in mind it’s proportional, it’s “only” 10psi beneath their low end but it’s also almost 25%. 30psi feels pretty saggy, I’ve not ridden it properly yet but I think it’ll be too far. I’ve run out of bottomless tokens or I’d try more!

    Without tokens, frankly I thought it was poor, the extra air needed seemed to choke it up. I reckon they should come with at least one fitted, maybe 2, and some more in the box- the standard setup feels like it’s the “I’m an American riding a 160mm carbon bike with a 69 degree head angle” setup. Quite Foxy.

    All these moany posts of mine need a disclaimer- I loved my coil Lyriks, these have a hard act to follow. Getting better but still disappointing. But I’m not done…

    stevede
    Member

    I run mine at just under 50psi on my shock pump giving me 25% sag and 2 tokens fitted. Find them a close match for the devilles on my other bike, not quite as amazing but not quite as shit if I need some support! I have them on my alpine 160 with a ccdb air on the rear and really happy with the set up.

    deanfbm
    Member

    Perhaps deanfbm shock pump is misreading if 18-20% sag is showing @ 85kilo weight & 95psi?

    I used the wet afternoon to mod mine to 140 (a bit of cutting and tapping), just set mine up again, 3 tokens, preliminarily setting to 90psi, 26mm actual measured sag, so ~19%.

    Cracked open a box fresh shock pump to double check pressure, 2 pumps, both reading 90psi.

    Quick car park test is suggesting i’ll be needing 4 tokens.

    Who fancies sending me out a token for beer money?

    Also, how are you all setting your sag, standing or seated?

    robhughes
    Member

    Northwind.In the same boat as you.Do you have all three tokens in at 35psi and are yours 150 or 160.Cheers bud.

    m1ateusz
    Member

    @cruzcampo
    your chart is a little different that the chart that shows on mine Pike, its dual position version, but i’d imagine air pressures should be the same?

    forget it, just checked Sram website, its different for DPA

    I’ve dropped it further, which has improved the frankly ropey small bump performance without any obvious drawbacks.

    From the Avalanche website, here:
    http://www.avalanchedownhillracing.com/Rock%20Shox/Pike%20Charge%20Piston_Valve%20Upgrade%20Kit.htm

    FAQ’S

    The damper seems to have too much slow/low speed comression and feels a bit spikey on slow bumps?
    There seems to be too much preload on the check valve plate on the rebound piston. We managed to make a sleeve to space out the check plate but there is not enough room with the wider stock piston. Still has too much preload and this is causing the low speed harshness, sort of like a midvalve with no float. We ended up installing our whole midvalve assembly with our piston.

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    robhughes – Member

    Northwind.In the same boat as you.Do you have all three tokens in at 35psi and are yours 150 or 160.Cheers bud.

    Mine are 160- they came with none in the fork and 2 in the box, fitted both for now, if I had more I’d probably try another.

    Interesting link that Robinlaidlaw. Don’t really feel like dropping £200 on the avy kit mind but good reading.

    cruzcampo
    Member

    Northwind – Member
    cruzcampo – Member
    Youre running 35psi which is only 10 below lower recommendation
    <snip>
    Also adding the tokens increases difficulty to bottom out reduces the volume of air, hence more harshness, how is it when tokenless?
    Aye, but bear in mind it’s proportional, it’s “only” 10psi beneath their low end but it’s also almost 25%. 30psi feels pretty saggy, I’ve not ridden it properly yet but I think it’ll be too far. I’ve run out of bottomless tokens or I’d try more!

    Without tokens, frankly I thought it was poor, the extra air needed seemed to choke it up. I reckon they should come with at least one fitted, maybe 2, and some more in the box- the standard setup feels like it’s the “I’m an American riding a 160mm carbon bike with a 69 degree head angle” setup. Quite Foxy.

    All these moany posts of mine need a disclaimer- I loved my coil Lyriks, these have a hard act to follow. Getting better but still disappointing. But I’m not done…

    Ah didn’t realise sag was @ 25%, sounds like the PSI is right then. What rebound and compression have you got?

    Concur on the coils always a challenge to beat.

    cruzcampo
    Member

    m1ateusz – Member
    @cruzcampo
    your chart is a little different that the chart that shows on mine Pike, its dual position version, but i’d imagine air pressures should be the same?

    Yeah I was gonna say the dual airs are higher pressure.

    How much pressure are you running and what weight?

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    Think I’ve got the compression all rolled all the way off, rebound just fannied about with it til it felt best so not really sure what it’s set at! (wee bit fiddly to set these because of the rapid return)

    robhughes
    Member

    Cheers NW.Think i’ll have a pop at your method.Mine are 150’s and came with three of them.If i settle on two your most welcome to the other one.
    I’m off all week so i’ll have a mess about with them.

    cruzcampo
    Member

    So do the solo air come with two tokens and the dual air x3, in the case of the 150mm’s?

    Premier Icon Northwind
    Subscriber

    They’re all solo air but the dual position doesn’t use the stokens at all.

    m1ateusz
    Member

    cruzcampo – Member

    Yeah I was gonna say the dual airs are higher pressure.

    How much pressure are you running and what weight?
    i’m 85kg, running 95psi, but I got them just 2 weeks, so still playing with different settings

    cruzcampo
    Member

    down by about 10psi then going off the legs 🙂

    How easy are they to dial down or change the travel? do you change it often?

    m1ateusz
    Member

    to change from 160 to 130 is just matter of turning knob and compress forks (which you do anyway reaching for a dial), but to change from 130 to 160 I have to remove all compression – so putting legs on the ground
    I change it quite often, all climbs on 130, everything else 160

    chum3
    Member

    Just back from a few days in Les Arcs – I was running my 160mm pikes at 75 PSI no token, 4 clicks on rebound from fastest, and 5 clicks on LSC from fastest (I think?). I weigh about 70-72kg all kitted up (ie on the light side!)

    This set up was great when riding ‘properly’ (techy steeps and fast rough stuff) but as soon as mincing fireroad action started, then things felt a little harsh as folk have mentioned above. Didn’t get any tokens with mine, so that would be my next step – stick a token or two in and lose a some pressure.

    I had already experimented with the other option of running lower tyre pressures, but I was pulling tyres off rims at 20ish psi on my ghetto tubeless 2.4 setup, so didn’t want to drop much below the 23psi I was running.

    When I first got them, I set up as per guide (60ish?), and found them very smooth, but they just fell too low into their travel when things got steep, hence the more pressure for the Alps…

    The other thing is that any material change to the fork needed to be matched to the shock (CCDBA) to keep things balanced, so it’s been quite an iterative process getting it all dialled in for me…

    poah
    Member

    150mm 30% sag, no LSC, no tokens, 70psi, 80kg kitted up – use almost 100% of travel at glentress.

    Hob Nob
    Member

    I have been running them at the recommended 85psi, about 15% sag for the last week, with 2 tokens in. I raced this weekend on some crazy steep/tech so went up about 5-10psi.

    Felt good, had a couple of bottom outs on some nasty compressions, but found unless you are riding them hard, they can feel quite harsh at the recommended pressure. Good for racing, probably drop them back a bit again now, but not too much as Whistler is full of holes at the moment.

    ok very interestingly – i set the sag up again on mine last night for the first time in ages (probably didnt do it properly from day one if im honest!)

    using the sag indicator on the fork stanchion with 60psi in, it was coming out at about 17% sag! i was all kitted up (full water etc and all kit)

    i do weigh around 11.5 stone all kitted up so not heavy, but in order to get around the 25% sag mark (which is recommend for my frame) im going to have to drop to about 50psi which is around 20psi lower than the fork suggests on the back of the lower leg!

    must admit they do feel bloody good damping wise again now ive messed with the pressure, felt a bit pogoey for me at 65-70 psi, god knows what sag it was (probably around under 10%!) so no wonder they felt harsh

    ridden some nice techy stuff last night and they felt absolutly brilliant, like a whole new fork to be honest

    so it seems if your having issues, perhaps do the same as me and have a good play with pressure/sag

    cruzcampo
    Member

    @OW sounds like you’ve got them dialled now 😀

    I tried 55psi in mine yesterday, and it added back that little bit of harshness, so dropped back to 50psi, which gives me 19.5% sag and they are just beautiful forks, really can plough over stuff.

    Premier Icon bluearsedfly
    Subscriber

    Oscillate Wildly ok very interestingly – i set the sag up again on mine last night for the first time in ages (probably didnt do it properly from day one if im honest!)

    using the sag indicator on the fork stanchion with 60psi in, it was coming out at about 17% sag! i was all kitted up (full water etc and all kit)

    i do weigh around 11.5 stone all kitted up so not heavy, but in order to get around the 25% sag mark (which is recommend for my frame) im going to have to drop to about 50psi which is around 20psi lower than the fork suggests on the back of the lower leg!

    must admit they do feel bloody good damping wise again now ive messed with the pressure, felt a bit pogoey for me at 65-70 psi, god knows what sag it was (probably around under 10%!) so no wonder they felt harsh

    I’m exactly the same as you, 11 1/2 stone fully kitted up. Running 80psi at the moment on 160mm forks. They do feel harsh but I am using up most of the travel.

    Going to drop the pressure but I’m worried about them then bottoming out. Is it just a case of putting another token in if they do?

    I have two spare tokens in the box, not sure if they come with any already fitted.

    Premier Icon bluearsedfly
    Subscriber

    According to this it looks like they ship with none fitted?

    cruzcampo
    Member

    @bluearsedfly according to this as long as your not 29″ there should be no tokens by default in yours?

    So you could try dropping the pressure, adding two tokens, and even closing the compression dial on top right leg clockwise a little to help with diving.

    I reckon this would be way superior to the harshness you get @ 80!

    EDIT – ninja’d on the link 😀

    Bluearsedfly – try dropping your pressure, and don’t just go off the back of leg recommendations, I think I probably was a touch lazy and just did this…..also use the sag indicator if you are not already that’s what it’s there for

    My sag with 60psi in is just shy of 20% sag (I’m the same weight as you say)…. With 55 psi about 22% and 50 psi about 25% which is my frames recommended sag for any 150mm fork

    I have done some decent sized drops and jumps Including yesterday and didn’t once bottom out at all, that was the main worry with dropping the pressure but so far it’s absolutely perfect to be honest so I wouldn’t worry about bottoming out with dropping the pressure, just do it gradually, once you get it dialled in you know and it just feels right

    I’m still between 50-55psi as doing more techy descending etc on certain rides I’d prefer them a tiny bit harder without sacrificing the plushness….again still not to date bottomed out

    SOAP
    Member

    88 kilos,
    140mm travel RC
    80 psi with 2 tokens
    70 psi with 3 tokens
    Might go back to 2 tokens as the start and middle of travel is a bit soft.

    Premier Icon bluearsedfly
    Subscriber

    Haha first time I’ve ever used the url thingy!

    I usually leave the compression all the way open, 26″ RCT3.

    What is everyone using to remove the top cap? Don’t fancy using a standard socket as I don’t want to chew the cap up.

    Should have set them up properly when I first got them but as usual I was too lazy.

    cruzcampo
    Member

    @bluearsedfly, I reckon a perfect setup for you would be 50-55psi, fully open compression, with 3-4 tokens, as you seem to bottom out easy even with high pressures.

    This would give great small bump compliance and smooth out the trail chatter, yet should stop any bottoming out once youve lowered the PSI for plushness.

    I really wouldn’t take much notice of quoted pressures – you don’t know how accurate the pump gauges are, you don’t know the rider’s weight, you don’t know the front-centre:chainstay length ratio, you don’t know if the fork bushes are broken in, you don’t know the head angle, etc etc.

    Just use sag percentage – set it when standing with all your weight on the pedals, none on the saddle, almost none on the bars. Bounce up and down gently to overcome the fork stiction and then slide the O-ring down or look down at the markers on the stanchions whilst keeping your weight all through the pedals. You might need a hand if you’re not comfortable balancing like this – I find elbow against the wall helps.

    I’m pretty sure my pressures are quite a bit lower than printed on the fork. I added one token, then a second, then took the second out. Went from 20% to 30% to 25% sag. Have quite a few clicks of low speed compression.

    Not sure on the rebound but you can set it slower than many forks because once you’re deep in the travel the rebound is fast and unaffected by the rebound knob (which only deals with the earlier portion of the travel (“Rabid Rebound”). The rebound setting you need is dominated by the pressure in the fork because that’s what causes the fork to extend, so other people’s rebound settings are rather useless too!

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