http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/603583/Rescues-soar-walkers-ditch-maps-mobiles
What’s the point in simply telling people to carry a map and compass if they haven’t got a clue what to do with them?. Surely they should be saying “don’t go out into the hills unless you know how to navigate and/or are fully prepared”. blaming an app is a bit daft IMO, blame the numpty using it (or not if the battery is flat or the phone stopped working because it got wet)
As an aside, looking at their incident logs it appears to be mountain bikers that are one of their biggest issues.

Journalist in crap reporting shocker.

As above

there was a guy on R4 yesterday. He was talking about people not bothering with a map and relying on a smart phone. One of the problems is battery life is sucked more quickly when using gps so if the battery fails you’re left with no means to navigate or call for help. Also more people were getting lost using smartphones as you can only see a small portion of the map, it’s easy to loose your bearings, people become over reliant and simply get lost. Also smartphones are not ruggedised like a proper outdoor gps device. If the get wet or dropped their users can then be one lost without it.

His advice was to learn how to read a map and use a map as your primary navigational tool and not your smartphone. Quite simple really…right tool for the job. Just like wearing the right walking boots, or jacket.

The same people would have gone out with a map they couldn’t read or no map at all and they’d still need rescuing. Or they’d have run out of fuel on the way there having ignored the gauge.

The issue with smartphones is that people keep then turned on all the time when using the mapping function. If they used a paper map and only turned on the smartphone to double check a grid reference then in an emergency situation they would have a battery that would last a lot longer if they had to contact emergency services. Instead they run the battery down, get lost because they now have no idea where they are and they can’t phone or text for help with no battery.

yep, years ago we had a few occasions on big Scottish mountains where in full winter
conditions we had a whiteout on the summit, fannied around trying to find our descent ridge, and then threw in the towel and backed off back down our route of ascent. A GPS/phone app would have helped, asserted our position and probably seen use on our intended way. The apps aren’t the issue, it’s the plonkers who get out of their depth without any plan/organisation/back up.

The apps aren’t the issue, it’s the plonkers who get out of their depth without any plan/organisation/back up.

This +1

I was back in the UK last month, decided to take a trip up the back of Ambleside and link some trails together, done it heaps 5 years ago. So bought a map, had the GPS fully charged and that worked out. There were some points where I could have gone wrong and having the map and knowing how to use it worked out. The GPS gave me the extra info like heights and direction that helped make the map even more useful.

The difficulty is trying to explain to an adult why they need to carry and learn to use a map and a compass when they believe that they have all of that built into their phone already. I’ve had the conversation with two friends and in both instances I got nowhere, they either appeared to consider me alarmist or some kind of luddite. It really was a discussion that was going nowhere.

Personally I take a map and compass which I know how to use but I tend to leave them in my pack and use a dedicated GPS (with replaceable batteries) for navigation. It’s not often that I need to get the map out but it does still happen from time to time.

The ideal for me is to use a dedicated GPS but as soon as visibility is reduced get the map out and tick off my position at regular intervals
That way I know where I am without trying to take compass bearings through fog should the GPS fail

Our team are heading for our busiest year ever… 55 shouts so far. I don’t think a single one of our call outs has been due to someone using (or falling to use) a smart phone mapping app. Different area and different sorts of incidents, but seems like an easy lazy target to me – people have always gone out unprepared in the Lakes, smart phones haven’t changed that. Suspect there’s something else more complicated going on as the root cause for the increases we’re seeing.

Map plus GPS device showing grid reference and bearing (Fenix 3) balances my dislike of map reading with instinctive laziness.

For the sake of balance, smartphones and apps like sarlock (which allow us to remotely get gps fix form a phone, so long as the person has signal, battery and has given consent) means that in the right conditions we can go straight to a casualty, rather than having an entire team out all night searching for them.

I’m not going to click on the above article, but who is blaming apps, an MR member or the journalist?

Meanwhile….

ViewRanger has confirmed its mapping and navigation app is now used by more than 90% of the mountain and lowland search and rescue teams across Great Britain.

— http://www.viewranger.com/en-gb/about-us/media-centre/2014/12/04/search-and-rescue-teams-find-success-with-viewranger-app

So, as above, it’s not the apps that are the problem – it’s the users.

I work in an area with two of Scotland’s busiest MRT’s, and read all the incident logs. In almost a decade since I came here I have never seen this recorded on the incident logs as a factor in people needing rescuing. Getting lost after going up without navigation equipment, or with no knowledge of how to navigate, sure, but never a phone (or a dedicated GPS come to that) running out of battery.

Ah the Express.

So there’s maybe one case where this happened and they’ll make a story of it.

@thegreatape

You should speak to Killin MRT team then – a good few call outs for folk with dead phone batteries on the one phone that had the navigation app…

Killin’s not one of mine 🙂

Some people will always be tempted beyond their abilities. Having some sort of Nav App will fool some into going further than they should. A similar discussion on “cairning ” hill paths has been going on for decades

<devils advocate>

Maybe freely available OS maps and compasses are a bad thing. Not everyone can read them or navigate properly using them. It just tempts people with poor navigation skills to head further and higher into the mountains.

Alternatively how many MRT call outs are avoided through people having GPS or phone apps and being able to determine their location and find their own way home. Maybe with just a map and a compass (or nothing) they would have needed to call MRT.

</devils advocate>

There are plenty of idiots out there who will get themselves into trouble in the hills (or anywhere). Having a phone app or paper map or not doesn’t change that.

Personally I’m lazy and will alwasy choose the easiest method possible, hence most of my nav now is using MMTracker with OS maps as it’s just easy. I do carry a paper map and a compass, but they rarely need to come out. The small scale nav is done by the phone and the large sclae is done by looking at the map before and having an idea of the route and terrain. Changes to the planned route would involve the paper map to get a better wide scale view of the area. I have a spare charged battery for the phone for emergencies. Also in poor phone signal areas where hunting for a signal will kill the battery quicker than the GPS receiver I will switch the phone into airplane mode (with GPS on) to better manage battery. This has the added benefit of ensuring incoming calls/messages don’t interupt my day in the hills 🙂

The sarlock app mentioned above, has anyone got a link for it, I’ve done a quick search on google and App Store and it’s not showing up, is it called something else?

The sarlock app mentioned above, has anyone got a link for it, I’ve done a quick search on google and App Store and it’s not showing up, is it called something else?

Its called SARLOC. Its not really an app as such, so you don’t have to install it on your phone.

Basically the MRT send you a text with a link to a webpage. When you visit that page, you have the option of sharing your location. So that will be sent to the MRT, and they can be view it on a map etc.
Some details here. http://www.dsrtashburton.org.uk/sarloc/

So there’s maybe one case where this happened and they’ll make a story of it.

Mountain rescue teams have been reporting this for years, at least up here anyway. Friend of mine was using his phone to navigate him in could up a mountain and nearly walked off a cliff and he is pretty intelligent, usually.

Google it and loads come up eg

http://news.stv.tv/north/149570-smartphones-blamed-as-mountain-rescue-crew-deployed-four-times-in-four-days/
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cumbria-34108143

Friend of mine was using his phone to navigate him in could up a mountain and nearly walked off a cliff and he is pretty intelligent, usually.

He doesn’t sound it.

You can’t blame phone apps for people being foolish and not taking precautions. I still bet the figures aren’t huge.