How do

After a bit of advice. Over the past 12 months my life has been pretty stressful, 2016 has not been a good year for both work and home life. Anyway, about 6 months ago I started waking up in the middle of the night with my heart going 90 to the dozen and my breathing being totally out of control. I tend to get them about once a month now, however I’ve had one at work today (which I think is the first time I’ve had one during waking hours) after an argument with the other half this morning before leaving for work. I’m also getting some quite severe dizzy spells that don’t last very long but leave me feeling utterly spaced out. Normally happens when I’m in situations when I’m under a bit of pressure (presenting in a meeting) or in large groups of people. Getting to my GP is a bit of a nightmare as I work away a lot and stay with my other half which is 100 miles from where my GP is based, however I realise the proper solution is to go see him (as long as he doesn’t try to stick me on the happy pills).

Anyway, being the slow witted fool I am, I’ve worked out that these could be panic attacks. So other than a dose of MTFU, does anyone else get these and how did you deal with them? Today I just took myself off to an empty office and sat there until it passed and I felt ok again. But long term this doesn’t seem like an ideal solution.

Get to the docs, get prescribed some drugs (shouldn’t be long term happy pills, more like short term beta-blockers or something- I’ll recognise the name- Polypropanol or something, identify what is causing the attacks. Crack on and deal with that.
Good luck as these attacks can be truly horrible.

You are right in identifying the GP as an excellent place to start, do try to make an appointment if at all possible.

Do not fear the happy pills, things have come a very long way and they have been an extraordinary help to a lot more people than you can probably imagine.

If self help is the only option available to you then I can suggest a mindfulness book by John Kabat Zinn, it’s called ‘A Mindful Way Through Depression’ or something like that. Do not be put off by the title- I know that you aren’t saying that you are depressed!! 🙂 The book is also excellent at dealing with anxiety too, it just doesn’t mention that in the title 🙂

I had them for quite a number of years when I was in my early 20s.

Brought in by a change in my lifestyle, location in the world and time to reflect on my past life.

Mostly brought in when I was quite relaxed, riding motorbikes, or bicycles, other times from what I suppose would be called flashbacks.

I learnt to recognise what they were first. That knotted feeling in my stomach, the usually rational thoughts now jumping all-over the place, pulse racing my mind screaming to let me get off the ride.

I suppose I self counselled myself, I learned to become reflective, I wasn’t in a country with decent mental health care not could I afford it.

I had to cut some of the triggers out,.My love of jungle and drum nbass had to be stopped for nearly 10 years.

I was fortunate to be away from the lifestyle and influences that got me there so that was in.my favour.

I still have moments where things flash into my mind, quite often “how didn’t I die from that” and I can feel it rising up a bit, but I can usually push it back down and get on with things.

Probably not much help

thank you! Was expecting just a ‘stop being soft’ response.

Its the anxiousness that gets me, today I could feel it coming on and felt sick leading up to it which was horrible. Normally I’m asleep and just having bad dreams so I’m unaware of the unpleasantness.

Quirrel – thats really interesting actually. I was in a train crash in March and I’ve really struggled getting back on them to come to work. Just thought that was the extent of it, but maybe its affected me more than I though.

Shermer – thank you. I’m always a bit wary of pills as I was put on Seroxat in my teens which royally messed me up. Hence wanting to avoid them now.

I had a few some years ago, bought on by work pressure and feeling I couldn’t cope. I changed jobs in the end as I wasn’t getting any support from my employer at the time.

Jesus Christ ^^

Get to the docs now yes. Find the root of the problem, and start working on methods to help. Popping pills won’t always help and may not be best for you – or they might be.

I’ve had proper panic attached when flying / driving over high Bridges. I’ve had many treatments. My latest round of Hypno combined with an application of mindfulness has helped. I’m able to help my brain understand the logic of the panic event and subdue the panic, at the same time I’ve taken lifestyle measures to alleviate the way I think, react and stress about things.

It’s not easy and you have to make a concious effort to find what works for you and apply it. Good luck with it – and go to the docs before you hurt yourself don’t be embarassed – my moment of realisation was stuck in massive panic with my foot to the floor on the gas pedal on the Dartford bridge unable to move – lucky it was clear it could have been nasty.

I’d recommend seeing your doctor and see if you can get some CBT on the NHS (six sessions should be available). You may have to say you are suicidal in order to move things along.

https://www.drugs.com/propranolol.html Them’s the buggers, they’re not happy pills. They just get the heart rate down and breathing back under control.
Good luck.

I found CBT very helpful. I was able to self-refer on the NHS but it was a few weeks wait to start.

Ultimately you will need to deal with the root cause (sounds like work/being away from home may be factors, relationship may be another) which will probably involve (major?) lifestyle changes (not necessarily what people want to hear, but IMO is a far better idea than trying to paper over the cracks with drugs).

Nix to the above. Get yourself out of the stressful situation. thats the only answer when they are in response to stress. What on earth do you expect your GP to do when you have identified yourself the reason why you get them?

I had them due to workplace stress. I changed jobs. NO more panic attacks.

Exercise will help a bit by burning off the stress hormones

Kryton – I know I’ve given you some stick about your racing, but I appreciate you commenting. I’m in a similar situation with the trains if I’m honest. Flashbacks to the impact and stuff get me breathing funny and in a bit of a mess. And if I look back, the stuff happening in my sleep would be around the same sort of time so it does make sense. Even now thinking about it gets me a bit ‘clammy-hand’.

I’m back home over the festive period so hopefully can pop to the GP’s for a chat. My GP is a bit, er…blunt so I’m wondering how well it’ll go. Anyway, worth a try.

I’ve done some CBT stuff before to help with anger but…well I’m still angry so wondering if it wasn’t for me. Or maybe the person doing the counselling wasn’t very good.

I’d recommend seeing your doctor and see if you can get some CBT on the NHS (six sessions should be available). You may have to say you are suicidal in order to move things along.

I gave up on that and went to see a therapist privately and it has really helped – identifying causes of anxiety and how to reduce them, and coping strategies for when anxiety occurs.

Now I’m just stressed about how to pay the bills!

I was under a lot of stress a couple of years back and used to get them, which made me panic even more.

I went to the GP and got wired up to an ECG. They told me there was nothing wrong, so I stopped worrying about my health and they stopped.

It worked for me. Not sure if this is a common occurrence though.

could feel it coming on and felt sick leading up to it which was horrible

When I didn’t know what they were was as bad as when I knew what they were and hadn’t worked out how to deal with them.

A train crash is a big thing, I think anybody would be shaken up y that.

As others have said if help is available use it. I don’t recommend soldiering through
There were times where it all felt totally out of my control I would have loved to have access.to someone who could at least have told me what was going on and strategies to manage better.

On the drugs side, try to avoid anti depressants etc which they’ll default to offering for anxiety/depression or anything they don’t understand. It’s the NHS way of getting rid of the problem (i.e. you), just chuck drugs at it.

However if they offer beta blockers (propranolol etc), take them. They are pretty much harmless drugs that just slow the heart rate and chill you out. Often prescribed for all kinds of stressful and anxiety situations. Can take them when needed and no withdrawal symptoms.

Understanding what is happening to you is a step in the right direction. I started getting this kind of stuff, without any obvious stress. Eventually worked out what it was and each time it starts to kick in I kind of laugh it off and ride it out. It’s rarely a problem now.

Other thing that’s helped a lot is exercise. Riding bikes in particular for me. In part it’s also just getting out into the countryside and away from everything.

Edit: just seen the train crash bit – yeah, that may need some counselling or talk with friends to deal with that. A traumatic experience!

If you are getting them without obvious cause then Beta blockers stop the symptoms. However when there is an obvious cause – in this case work related stress the only answer is get away from the stress. Either by learning to deal with it or doing something about the cause of the stress. In this case its your work. Only changing that will help. Work is making you ill. Its not worth it.

In this case its your work. Only changing that will help. Work is making you ill. Its not worth it.

Well, that’s one solution. Another is understanding your reaction to the things at work that make you stressed, and learning to react in a more positive way.

Yes that too Dr J – I did also say that. Medication is not the answer in this case

Without wishing to sound too alarmist, you sound just like my bro, who has epilepsy.

He has the same night time episodes as you, and this;

also getting some quite severe dizzy spells that don’t last very long but leave me feeling utterly spaced out.

Is a pretty similar description of his seizures.

As other’s have suggested, get down to the GP and I’d start to record your episodes, when they happen and how severe. I’m not suggesting that you have epilepsy, but you should def. get yourself checked out.

Edit: My brother described his symptom is exactly the same way as you do, as panic attacks and dizzy spells, it wasn’t until they hooked him up to a “machine that goes ping” that his consultant causally told him, “oh yes, you’re having complex frontal and temporal lobe episodes” as if it was common knowledge.

I suffered from panic attacks (>50) over the past 15 years.

Learning to recognize the signs (irrational thoughts, etc) really helps you prepare rather than panic.

When your breathing is going crazy you need to belly breathe and walk around do not bend over!

I never went to a Doctor as i’m stupid but I did eventually learn to deal with my social anxiety by understanding how the thoughts I have about myself are not reflected by others around me and hence I have nothing to worry about.

Surprisingly I’m the mental health awareness guy at work, below are a bunch of really useful contacts

http://www.nopanic.org.uk
http://www.anxietyuk.org.uk (08444775774 )
http://www.destigmatize.anxietyuk.org.uk

Many thanks everyone for your replies, really appreciated.

The epilepsy is a bit of a scary one, there’s almost part of me that would rather not know if that’s the case but something I need to nut up to and go see the doctor about. Quite hard to explain, its almost like I get an electric shock and it totally knocks me for six. I haven’t had one for a while, but I was concerned it was some sort of stroke – epilepsy seems to be a more plausible explanation.

There are a number of factors that have caused the panic stuff, the train stuff being some of it. In addition home life is far from brilliant and whilst I do quite enjoy my job, it certainly has its stressful parts which see me getting more ‘involved’ than I probably should do. I’m not 100% sure how much I can change the home life situation (and that’s another thread entirely) but the work stuff is something I could consider changing.

I’m riding lots though, in the region of 10+ hours a week so I’m certainly doing enough exercise. It’s all the other stuff that is currently a bit…well, shit for want of another word.

Flange, I’m really sorry if I’v e worried you unnecessarily, it wasn’t my intent, and I spent a good while umming and ahhing over my response before posting it. In the end I thought that you’d be better off knowing what others who describe almost identical symptoms have experienced.

Again this description:

its almost like I get an electric shock and it totally knocks me for six

is the same sorts of things he says about his seizures

My brother has (with help from CBT and mindfulness) learned the triggers to his attacks and episodes, and (apart from some powerful drugs in his case) unless he told you, you’d never know he suffers from what at first seems a scary condition.

Off to the Vet with you…

Flange, I’m really sorry if I’v e worried you unnecessarily, it wasn’t my intent, and I spent a good while umming and ahhing over my response before posting it. In the end I thought that you’d be better off knowing what others who describe almost identical symptoms have experienced.

I’d say no harm in mentioning it to the GP, they’re not perfect at spotting things (with all due respect). I’ve been lucky enough to have decent GPs who are willing to spend time talking through things.

Nick – apologies, I’m glad you did tell me! I think the only thing to do is go see the docs and see what the verdict is. Does your brother still drive?

ummmm, no, ‘fraid not, they took away his licence pretty sharpish, he can re-apply for it though, but has to be seizure free for a year I think. luckily for him, he doesn’t really need a car.

check out the DVLA site, they have all the info.

There was a bit in my thirties I had something similar and also stress related skin conditions.
Luckily for me changes in my circumstances brought about some new friends and a new lifestyle, no fags, less booze, more exercise etc and that seems to have fixed both conditions.
Think I mentioned in another thread recently, if things ever get really stressfull, the nuclear option now is a run when once it would have been a bottle.

GP without a doubt especially if you are having unusual ‘episodes’ – beyond this forum there is no shame in going to your GP

propranolol is amazing

take action early before fear of an attack becomes a bigger thing than the attack itself

it’s far, far more common than you think!

Be careful about getting into a state where you worry about the symptoms. By all means get a once over from your GP if you want, but refain from fighting the symptoms to try and stop them. By fighting i mean doing anything to try and stop the anxiety, such as googling things, researching all the time…etc. Its a battle you’ll never win.

Remember that these symptoms are the manifestation of your past worrying.

From times in the past, I can certainly recognise and relate to your current state of being OP. Not pleasant and worrying about it doesn’t help either.

We are all different in terms of what works for us as individuals in our quest for sanity, so be prepared to be inquisitive, curious and open minded when searching for your own solution. Mindfulness / meditation may be a route that helps you? For me, it was all about stilling the chattering mind.

Removing yourself from those situations you’ve identified as triggers is a good move, as could be seeking therapy or yoga, reiki, whatever helps. They are all long term solutions but changing one’s attitude and behaviour to life won’t happen overnight.

In the short term, I found Bach’s Flower Remedy very helpful when I could feel the onset of panic and confusion, a couple of drops on the tongue and I could start to relax enough to take some steadying breath’s.

There are many supporters of happy pills on here, personally, I prefer not to jump straight into ( or at all) the pharmaceutical approach. Each to their own and I trust you shall find yours.

There are many supporters of happy pills on here, personally, I prefer not to jump straight into ( or at all) the pharmaceutical approach

Propranolol is a beta blocker and I definitely wouldn’t call it a happy pill, it simply blocks the physical effects of adrenaline and hence stops escalation of anxiety that can lead to panic. I take one little one maybe two to three times a year when in difficult situations, in fact maybe only once this year. As well as easing the actual symptoms of anxiety/panic, knowing that it is there if needed means less anxiety leading up to a potential trigger event without even taking it, as it’s one less big thing to worry about.

Again OP, I really think you should speak to your GP, there is no need for heroics by not going when it comes to your health and life, especially just for scoring internet forum points. This kind of thing is still sadly relatively taboo but far more common than you might realise.

Like I say, we each find our own way and each to their own, what’s beneficial to one, will be different for another.

I hold the belief that with the right intent and perseverance, the true metaphysical cause/s for our dis-ease can be found and by doing so, reduces the requirement for long term pharmaceutical assistance.

Just about the pills…

When I had my dangerous panic attack in 2001, I was put on some “mild antidepressants” I don’t know what they were called. But I was on them for 6 months, and it took me a year to come off them. Overtime the dose was lowered I felt like crap until I got used to it. I hated the whole process.

However I now use beta blockers – Diazepam and Tamizapan for my flying issues, mainly because none of the treatment I’ve had gets ride of the fear an anxiety. Even on 20mg of Tamizipan I doze but don’t sleep deep; on a long haul. So if taken or used correctly they can be good.

But as others have said, look to the lifestyle and some therapies and find one which suits you. My biggest anxiety reducer was self-study mindfulness, realising I didn’t have to keep up with the Jones’ and not everyone was out to get me went a long way to my daily relaxation. Don’t get me wrong I’m still highly strung 😀

Slackalice is right – it is actually all in the mind. we’ve trained or shocked ourselves to be anxious about things which then triggers the physical symptoms – fight or flight response – and we can train our minds back the other way.

£3 ^^. short & too the point, very good.

panic attacks and dizzy spells.Has anyone mentioned labrynthitis?

As said, beta blockers aren’t happy pills. All they do is slow the heart rate, and are pretty safe to take. GP said they prescribe them for students for exam stress. Used in sports such as shooting to steady aim (though banned in competitive sports obviously). Though primary use is for high blood pressure, angina, reducing potential for heart attacks etc.

They aren’t mind altering drugs, they simply supress signals to beta receptors on the heart etc. For anxiety key is it deals with the fight-or-flight response. i.e. a panic attack triggers fight-or-flight and sends the heart racing which induces lots of other symptoms. A beta blocker will literally block this to some degree.

I originally got some for heart going crazy pounding which wasn’t judged anxiety at the time but more likely an excess of coffee 😀 . Nothing would stop the mad pounding, until I took some beta blockers, and then sorted. Took them a few times after for anxiety symptoms and they helped, but after that the only drug I’ve taken is riding bikes.

Would touch SSRIs though unless it was really no option. Crazy side effects and dependant drugs, you can’t just suddenly stop taking them.

A couple of things:

– Drink none or very little caffeine. I was getting crazy scary heart palpitations until I reduced caffeine. And red wine.

– Realise these attacks are not going to kill you, and think that while they occur. You be the boss. I used to play daft games on my phone to distract myself.

There are also heart conditions with similar symptons.

Visit doctor.

It’s been mentioned a couple of times above, but the one thing that helped me the most was CBT sessions. Had about 10 of them on a one to one basis. I went private as the NHS offering locally had a long wait and were group workshop affairs which I didn’t think would work for me. Wasn’t cheap, but the best £500 I’ve ever spent. Rarely get bent out of shape these days

Grounding…

5: Acknowledge FIVE things you see around you. Maybe it is a bird, maybe it is pencil, maybe it is a spot on the ceiling, however big or small, state 5 things you see.

4: Acknowledge FOUR things you can touch around you. Maybe this is your hair, hands, ground, grass, pillow, etc, whatever it may be, list out the 4 things you can feel.

3: Acknowledge THREE things you hear. This needs to be external, do not focus on your thoughts; maybe you can hear a clock, a car, a dog park. or maybe you hear your tummy rumbling, internal noises that make external sounds can count, what is audible in the moment is what you list.

2: Acknowledge TWO things you can smell: This one might be hard if you are not in a stimulating environment, if you cannot automatically sniff something out, walk nearby to find a scent. Maybe you walk to your bathroom to smell soap or outside to smell anything in nature, or even could be as simple as leaning over and smelling a pillow on the couch, or a pencil. Whatever it may be, take in the smells around you.

1. Acknowledge ONE thing you can taste. What does the inside of your mouth taste like, gum, coffee, or the sandwich from lunch? Focus on your mouth as the last step and take in what you can taste.

Simple Grounding Technique
Place both feet flat on the floor.
Lean back into your chair, and make note of the feeling of the chair under you and against your back.
Cross your arms over your chest.
Gently tap your shoulders, alternating one side at a time.