A few days ago I posted this thread:
http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/long-shot-anyone-in-tenby-got-a-spare-spoke-today

I got a new spoke 2 days later in Carmarthen, after towing the trailer a lot more miles…. Then on to Swansea and the train home. Lots of miles, lots of hills, lots of weight…. At times stopping 150kg+ from 30+ mph on 20-25% gradients….
Today I took the bike out for the first time since the holiday and noticed the wheel was making odd noises again, I was thinking another spoke.
Err, no:
[url=https://flic.kr/p/nYPj98]IMG_1818[/url] by PeterPoddy, on Flickr

About half the spoke beds are cracked in a similar way.
I’m glad I didn’t notice whilst I was away. I’d have shit myself!

The rims are only 717s, 4-6 years old and have done usual MTBing, then onto commuting and 3 heavily laden tours. They’ve done well really, but it’s 521s next I think 🙂

Nice one 🙂 My 717s failed similiarly, though the cracks didn’t get that far- like the eyelets create a stress riser in the rim or something. One of my 721s started to go the same way but only cracked at a few eyelets.

Seen this too many times to ever want to ride a mavic rim.

Weight limit on 717s 🙂

717s for racing; 317s for everything else, used to be the law!

who built them 🙂

317 you say ?

who built them

Me. Build was good (Still is) I’ve just overloaded them for too long. I’ve had a 717 go like this before, it won’t stop me using them though. I’m not light, I’m fairly tough on wheels in general and I’m quite happy with 4-6 years out of a lightish XC rim. I think they’re very tough actually, there’s still nothing else at the same price/weight I’d rather use.

Just not a touring rim, but then I knew that anyway.

The ‘outfit’

[url=https://flic.kr/p/nUd88q]IMG_3845[/url] by PeterPoddy, on Flickr

I’m carrying this lot:

[url=https://flic.kr/p/nBR6W1]IMG_3849[/url] by PeterPoddy, on Flickr

Yes, even a table and chairs 🙄

😉

Peter Poddy, you must have legs of steel, dragging that lot about

I thought only carbon rims failed.

Seen this too many times to ever want to ride a mavic rim

Pish and twaddle, I’ve beaten the hell out of 321 and 521 rims, both of which held up admirably.

717s are weight weenies, and should be treated accordingly.

That is all.

Lol, ridden D521’s like that for yonks back in the day, still have an EX721 that’s showing a lovely crack and no sign of giving up.

At that point I’d replace but it’s only really abuse that generally causes such issues (as you freely admit I may add).

Seen this too many times to ever want to ride a mavic rim.

Most popular bike wheels….

In other news, Ford car breaks down, Casio watch stops telling time….

Inbred still looks good 🙂

My 717s 8 yrs old and 1000s of miles, they’ve taken a pounding in Morocco though and will check tomorrow to see if there’s another thing to put on the shopping list! Looks like you had fun 🙂

trailofdestruction – Member

717s are weight weenies, and should be treated accordingly.

WEight weenie is just about the last name I’d give to a 717.

dirksdiggler – Member
Seen this too many times to ever want to ride a mavic rim.

Tosh dude show’s how little you know about quality and construction and numbers sold to failure figures.

Peter you did really well with them with all that weight and abuse, if anything it show’s testament to how strong mavic’s are in proportion to there weight.

Had a similar thing happen with my 517 a few years ago. Trying to true out a wobble, saw where the rim was catching on the brake block, twiddle, twiddle, twiddle. “hmmm, now it’s catching on the other side…” twiddle, twiddle…

Took me longer than it should have done to twig that it was bulging, not wobbling. Tyre off, inner rim bed/brace was cracked through the spoke holes about half way round the rim.

Hardly surprising, as the funnest thing to do on a bike round campus was 5-6″ step drops to flat, and I’d been doing them a lot! Very glad they failed how they did and that I spotted them when I did. Replaced it with a F519 “freeride” rim.

Peter Poddy, you must have legs of steel, dragging that lot about

Phhh. Only did 325 miles this time. ‘Tis nothing. 😉

Peter you did really well with them with all that weight and abuse, if anything it show’s testament to how strong mavic’s are in proportion to there weight.

Agreed. I’ve overloaded it for a long long time, I knew it was marginal from the off, and I wasn’t left stranded, so I’m happy really

I had a lovely pair of 517 Ceramics this happened to. 😥

At times stopping 150kg+ from 30+ mph on 20-25% gradients….

Jesus. If you listened to some people, 717s are only for tiny children and would fail at the first sight of a pebble, yet they are actually incredibly strong and can take loads of abuse they aren’t actually ‘designed’ for.

Seen this too many times to ever want to ride a mavic rim

In my experience, Mavics tend to fail slowly, like this, and can stll be ridden for quite a while, whilst other brands can crack/fail very suddenly, leaving you stranded or worse, badly injured. I only use Mavics when building my own wheels, as they are the most reliable brand in my experience.

cannondaleking – Member

Tosh dude show’s how little you know about quality and construction and numbers sold to failure figures.

Of my 6 modern Mavics, 3 cracked/split around the eyelets, that’s not a real good rate considering none of them was really used that hard. The Flow that replaced the 721 also cracked (at the valve hole), but it took a lot longer and a lot more use. The Traversees that replaced the 717s are miles lighter and have had, oh, maybe 10 times the use and most of it harder. Some of it much harder, world cup downhills and enduro racing and that compared with pretty basic XC.

Obviously that’s not a big enough sample to be taking very seriously but it’s enough that every time someone says “Oh stans are too weak because eyelets” I make a funny noise out of my nose.

Obviously that’s not a big enough sample to be taking very seriously but it’s enough that every time someone says “Oh stans are too weak because eyelets” I make a funny noise out of my nose

Stans make nice rims, I’ve built quite a few. Personally I won’t use them because I think they’re waaaay too expensive. They also build to a lower spoke tension because of the lack of eyelets. Make of that what you will!

PeterPoddy – Member

They also build to a lower spoke tension because of the lack of eyelets. Make of that what you will!

No, they don’t- All the Ex models have a limit of 125kgf, all the others 100kgf or 95kgf, which is higher than Mavic recommend for any of their standalones (90kgf, from mavic.com).

I seem to remember Roger Musson’s book saying the cause was more to do with running narrower, high psi tyres on an MTB rim, cos they’re designed for tyres of the softer, fatter variety.

@citizeninsane

I can see how that could cause a problem as high PSI will relieve some of the spoke tension possibly leaving them a bit soft.

No, they don’t- All the Ex models have a limit of 125kgf, all the others 100kgf or 95kgf, which is higher than Mavic recommend for any of their standalones (90kgf, from mavic.com).

I’d personally be very wary of putting very high tension into a brass nipple going into an un-eyeleted aluminium rim.

I seem to remember Roger Musson’s book saying the cause was more to do with running narrower, high psi tyres on an MTB rim, cos they’re designed for tyres of the softer, fatter variety.

717s are just 2mm wider than Open Pros, and are specified for tyres from 1″ (25mm) to 2.1″, so I’m sure they’re fine for most touring duties, even with narrow tyres.

I’d personally be very wary of putting very high tension into a brass nipple going into an un-eyeleted aluminium rim.

What spoke tension do you recommend for Flow/Arch EX rims?

cotic soul trailer high five!

Those of you having problems with failing Mavics – did you ever check the build tension with a spoke tension meter?

My tuppence is I’ve only had one rim fail like that, and it was a Sun Rhyno Lite that went at the spoke I’d overwound. While couriering, with narrow tyres on.

I rode it for about another 5 years after, Phuket.

bigrich – is that a fully loaded touring unicycle at the front? 🙂

gofasterstripes – Member

Those of you having problems with failing Mavics – did you ever check the build tension with a spoke tension meter?

Nope, but one set were Hope Hoops and the other were Merlin, neither was massively tight (actually less tight than my Wheelpro Flows)

Those of you having problems with failing Mavics – did you ever check the build tension with a spoke tension meter?

Yes. I built them.
Surprisingly the tension is on the low side now…… 🙂