Hi there,

I know a few people on here are with Octopus, either by choice or, like me, due to the Avro collapse.

So anyway, having had to go through their entire complaints process to get them to acknowledge that I had a smart meter (and not an economy 7 meter) I settled down for a period of calm but wincingly expensive energy bills…

But recently got the email about revising the direct debit, due to incresed priced from April. All so good so far. However, they stated that this was based on readings form their and supplied by my previous supplier. So I asked them to show me how they’ve calsulated the values, that look suspiciously like the “industry default” values for a medium usage household, that are used when there is no relevant meter usage history….

After several rounds of back and forth, they’ve stated that the usage used only dates from September (when they took over teh supply) and it is likley to be an over-estimate as its based on winter usage only. They still haven;t actually demonstrated how they’ve got to the estimated usage values yet with actual numbers.

ANyhow, to prevent them wildly over-increasing my direct debit, I ammeneded it myself, to find there was a “lower limit” on what the direct debit could be. But it turns out if you set it above this limit, you can then go back in and change it a second time to whetever you want….

I’m also a bit frustrated that I have to input my meter readings every month, but can view my consumption down to 30min intervals on the Octopus customer dashboard! Not that it’s massivley user friendly presentign elecrricity usage in kWh, and Gas in cubic metres..

Anyone else noticed their energy supplier artificially overstating usage to bump direct debits? Or issues with OCtopus in general? I thought they were meant to be one of the better suppliers, and I appreciate they’ve had 200,000 customers dumped on them with little notice, but not being able to justify (with actual numbers) why you are nearly doubling the direct debit payments seems pretty poor.

Cheers,
Keith

I thought energy bills are about to double though ?

Ha! After I posted that I got an email from USwitch, saying that they’re “hearing of customers being overcharged”! I guess it’s not just me then…

Had the same with Ovo… figure no point in stressing about it considering the hikes from Friday… Will give it a month or two to settle down then act accordingly.

I had this e-mail recently.
They are asking me to pay £205 a month which consists of an estimate of my future usage & a small amount on top (something like £13 a month) to pay off the current debit on my account.
For reference, my initial direct debit was set at £92 a month which was carried over from my previous AVRO account (where I was £42 in credit).
EDITED – it was AVRO I was with previously, not OVO as I originally stated.

I looked back at my usage since swapping to Octopus in October ’21. It averaged £140 a month. Obviously this makes the £205 seems a bit extreme, but then I remembered that I think the prices are going up in April – so I assume this hike is an estimate based on the new prices that will be kicking in.
Luckily I can afford the hike in prices (as painful as they are!) so have decided to leave their estimate as it is, until I have a better handle on how the new rate compares to my actual usage throughout the year.

This seems to be an the rage with energy suppliers at the moment and they are doing it under the pretence that bills might go up again in October as well so they are doing it with their customers interests at heart.

All complete bollocks of course but nothing in the rules stopping then doing it…

As above, I think it should include the April hikes, well that’s what my fag packet calcs suggest…

Also Avro -> Octopus, also being asked to increase a £77 a month direct debit to over £250 monthly … thanks for the update then alter tip too 🙂

Also had issues with Octopus regarding a SMART meter, can’t read my gas meter, coming out to replace it next month, the existing one is 12 months old. As for D.D.s I’ve increased them myself as I’ve gone from £12 in credit with AVRO to £600 in debt with Octopus and that’s based on real readings and before the April hikes kick in. Someone somewhere is making a lot of money.

You can ask them to set the direct debit at a specific amount usually, at least EOn let you do that. Then it’s up to you to try and balance out the expected usage and expected rises.

At the end of the day any extra you pay now means playing less later in the billing year provided you’re savvy with reading bills and providing monthly readings.

Eon £120pm (always had unused balance) leccy&gas now £270.
This ain’t gonna be fun.

Price cap is about to hit, more so if you’re on a variable tariff, so all energy suppliers are hiking prices to ensure they are not left with customers potentially owing thousands.

FWIW I’ve been an Octopus customer for a few years, never had a problem with them, in fact the couple of times I’ve had to deal with them over the phone they’ve been absolutely spot on. We’ve set our own direct debits, had over payments repaid at the click of a button on their website. Also had a few recommendation fees paid to new users and myself on switching.

Working in the industry I don’t think it’s malice. It’s more likely the result of archaic and inefficient processes. The yearly consumption estimate processes is an industry wide thing. Your supply submits your readings and then eventually gets back an annual usage estimate. It wouldn’t surprise me if Octopus hadn’t yet got estimates for your meterpoint from the industry since you moved to them in October.

Annual estimates are also woefully slow to change. It’s taken nearly 2 years of living in our house for our gas annual estimate to get anywhere near close to the previous owners (we’re at about 1/3rd what they were). That’s with a smart meter giving regular readings.

I know that the communications we sent out about the price changes included a break down of the costs; the standing charge + the annual usage x unit rate. And included a note to indicate if the industry defaults for annual usage had been used rather than actual estimates for your meterpoint. I’m not sure if that was a regulatory requirement though.

Had similar with bulb. The business model seems to be for the customer to lend them £600 a year. You get the credit back if you ask for it then they immediately start upping the recommended direct debit to build it up again. They tell your average use is £x a month but ask for a regular payment of £x+y
I now pay the exact useage month by month after doing the reading. Wasn’t hard to set up.

Thanks all.

It’s not so much that they are increasing the DD – I understand there is going to be a significant per-unit price hike in April – it’s that they cannot/will not justify how they have got to those numbers….

I’ve had the heating off from the start of March, so I know that my March usage is likely to be farly typical from now until the heating goes back on in October(ish). So I can reasonably forecast my usage for the next 6 month, and from that my expenditure. I want to see how they are working it out, and why it’s so different. I may have got it wrong, but they appear to have mis-informed me initially about what data they have used, and may be using “off the shelf” consumption figures rather then actually basing it on my usage data, that they have full access to!

So much for smart meters makin life easier!

On the last point about comms stating standard figures had been used in their companies comms – Octopus specifically stated that they used my usage information to calculate the estimate/DD amount, and made no reference to “standard” usage numbers in altering my direct debit.

Tbf to octopus they esnt out details of the new tarrifs and did not hike the direct debit.
I balanced my combined gas annd elec at £52pcm, the elec is steady through the year and the gas use goes up 5x in winter.
You email the reading through monthly and within 2 to 3 hours a detailed bill arrives
If its next day its usually accompanied by a demand for more dosh as ypu have triggered a parameter, stll negotiate this increase though.
There are odd things though, lady at work does weekly readings and her bill and demand for more dd money came through with a guessed reading and the bill saying ‘actual’ on it. The reading was low to infer higher use.

I thought energy bills are about to double though ?

A lad at work was moved to Octopus when his old supplier went bust last year, he’s just been told his bills are rising from £96 pm to £279 pm. I’m also with Octopus (by choice, not moved and don’t have a smart meter) but haven’t had the same email, I’m currently paying £63 pm with no indication of how much its going up nxt month

I’m with Octopus and when I bothered to properly read their comms it was pretty fair. They basically said you can either bump it up a bit now and spread the cost of a rise, or take a massive hit when the time comes. Ultimately you’re only going to pay for the amount you actually use so it’s just down to how you want to manage the costs.

Never had an issue and been credited the money back if I’ve overpaid and want the money back in my account.

I’m with Octopus and as far as dealing with them (installation of smart meter, electric vehicle charging point etc) they’ve been brilliant. Their management of my combined supply account has been extremely good

Their communications around likely price hikes have shown eye-wateringly high increases (way more than the figures quoted in the press), but then there have been a few emails along these lines and I get the feeling that they are trying to give customers as much warning as possible but are having to re-issue comms as things change.

We were moved to eon next. New DD is £330 (from £130)! No option in the app to set your own value though. Grr.

That’s nothing. We were on c.£91 per month with zebra. British Gas wanted £2,400 per month.

I’ve seen someone else with 6k per month estimated.

As geuben says above, it’s shit systems and processes. Once I’d supplied BG with readings and waited a couple of days, it calmed down to £140 ish per month.

I’m not letting them do DD though as they WILL **** it up. We’re paying quarterly.

I’m with Octopus. Most user friendly supplier I have had. If you think you are building up too much credit over the summer just go to your online account and there is an option to return it to your bank account.

No need to navigate call centre mazes.

Similar issue here. Moved from Avro to Octopus so they have very little to work with, meaning you get total insanity like this:

My current DD is £218 per month. Gives an annual amount of around £2600 give or take.

They are proposing going to £423 per month which is £5076 although they are estimating £5,262

The right answer is somewhere in the middle but seeing as they only have data since our consumption increased around September then it’s likely too high an estimate.
“Based on your estimated annual usage, not the figures you gave when signing up.” is the line used – the issue seems to be that they are applying the estimate using autumn and winter usage year round.

Will look at my recent email from them then!
Have been very happy with their service when switched from Avro.

I will stick to providing readings and paying a bill when they send it. Direct debits can **** right off.

Just remember that paying quarterly is usually more expensive than paying by DD. Usually £100-200 more and some discounted tariffs (those that are left) make paying by DD a prerequisite.

Stop the DD and you may lose the deal. Worth checking before pressing the button

I will stick to providing readings and paying a bill when they send it. Direct debits can **** right off.

Yes there is this option too, might do that myself.

granny_ring
Full Member
I will stick to providing readings and paying a bill when they send it. Direct debits can **** right off.

Yes there is this option too, might do that myself/blockquote>

That’s a good idea. I wonder if you can do that pro actively and input a meter reading monthly, and pay the due amount?

Oh how the chuff do you quote on here? And the preview button has disappeared!

We were moved to eon next. New DD is £330 (from £130)! No option in the app to set your own value though. Grr.

You can log into website and change the amount and date for your direct debit as often as you want, it takes 30 seconds. And no I don’t work for them.

Thanks airvent.

Considering there is little benefit to a supplier to bump up direct debits def false pretences, but a big customer service impact if they do, I think it is safe to say you might be reading into this too much… Octopus are one of the best suppliers out there, and that is from someone who works for a competitor (but not a supplier).

The best thing I can advise anyone is to look at your last year of bills and work out your annual consumption – from that you can then use your new prices to work out your annual bill. Assuming you have no debt in your account, divide that by 12 for your monthly DD. If that is wildly different to your suppliers suggestions give them a call with the figures.

The expected outcome will be a correct direct debit. Anything less is worth an ofgen complaint.

I know it’s tricky if your supplier went bust and your account disappeared overnight. But if it’s any help, because I’m a data nerd and also because we had a new boiler a few years ago I got into the habit of keeping figures and tracking usage pre and post. Then covid, and wfh, I kept going to see how much extra I use as a result of being at home (spoiler – electicity quite a bit; gas not so much but I do have a new down bodywarmer instead 😉 )

If it’s any help I find my electricity consumption almost flat across the year, as long as you turn lights off when not in use, etc., the same amount of TV and kids electronic devices and electric oven usage etc. So as an estimate for the year, take whatever you have on Octopus so far and extrapolate.

On gas, yes if differs, but as a rule of thumb I use about 30% of my gas in the summer months April – Oct and 70% Oct-April, and it’s not that variable. OFC it went down due to the boiler and then up due to covid but because I still wasn’t running the heating very much when WFH the actual ratio stayed about the same. And also OFC we haven’t had a proper cold winter for a few years.

So if you only have the past 6mo or so of data due to a supplier going tits up, maybe use that 70/30 split as a guesstimate for your year. It’ll almost certainly be better than just doubling the last 6mo.

And FWIW I find Octopus great, despite being with them for 4 years now I’ve not had a problem other than my sum total of the wheel-of-fortune bonuses being £1. In 48 months give or take. And two spins a month. I think it’s fixed.

other than my sum total of the wheel-of-fortune bonuses being £1.

ohhh get you and your big win

big fat zero here, I also think its rigged.

Martin Lewis has been talking about energy Cos bumping up DDs way over the 54%, he’s believes it ‘may’ be Energy Cos trying to increase cash-flow, although I suppose you can’t blame them, things have been tough for them too with most of the market going bust!

I think the thing I’ve learned from this is that energy is bloody complex and all this talk of ‘average caps’ which worked in normal times, is more misleading now.

I also think how fair it is all boils down to personal circumstances.

My fixed price deal ended in Oct, so back then my payments went from £111 to £144 and I was ‘on the cap’ now because of the raise in cap I’m going to £195, that’s not quite 54%, partly because we reduced our usage and partly because in the year before we were paying too little (EDF only bill twice a year). So, it’s all but doubled over 6 months. So people though who’s deals are ending now, or had to switch because their provider went bust are getting it all at once, so their bills are doubling “overnight”, add a year of underpayments into the mix and it could easily be more.

It must be hard for people who’ve been switched because there’s not enough data for their new providers to honestly estimate usage, and they’re going to be keen to take more, rather than less, there’s likely another big jump coming in Oct!

I’m with e.onnext (which apparently is not the same as E.On), got transferred to them from npower.

They took on my DD and everything pretty smoothly and they’ve tried to put my DD up a couple of times but the app has an option to set your own payment level.

With the price rise, they told me mine was going up 70% and I went online and knocked it right back down – I’m already in credit with them. I submit a monthly reading via the app – they keep telling me to book a smart meter installation but that’s not going to happen.

anyone read the article on BBC yesterday/today. Interesting breakdown the average annual bill of £1,971 the operating company makes £35 profit (source ofgem).
Can hardly accuse the companies of profiteering, just trying to keep the business alive with the current market volatility

The industry is broken

Source;
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58090533

I’m with Shell (not through choice, they took over my previous provider) and they asked me to increase my own DD with a suggested value. Their email implied it was my choice but I’d be in debt if I didn’t increase. I can change it any time on the app with a slider and it gives me a projection on where I’ll be in 12 months based on the DD chosen.

I’m not sure if Shell have a different policy but the value of the DD is in my control – I guess if I got mega bucks in debt they may enforce something?

We’ve been with Octopus for 18 months and have been happy with the service tbf.

We were paying £117pm, then had an email a few months ago saying due to usage it was increasing to £147 and now been told it’s gone up to around £250. Kind of in the ballpark I was expecting so will just suck it up for now and keep an eye on how much in credit the account is.

We should be able to cope as we have slack to cut but god knows how those with little spare will afford it. Mate of mine works full time but isn’t on a huge wage, doesn’t drink, doesn’t smoke, doesn’t really do anything that costs except fuel for work but regularly is down to a few quid the week before payday. Plenty will be worse off than him.