I was reading an article about obesity in the UK and it occurred to me that while you see lots of overweight folk now, it was very rare when I was growing up (I’m almost 60).

1980 7.5%

1993 14.5%

2019 28%

And the numbers do confirm my memory.

What is it that’ll make folk change their habits, or is there nothing and in a decade or so we’ll be at USA levels (36%)?

The real challenge is highlighting the obesity issue, vs the current trend of “not body shaming”…

People simply don’t see obesity as ‘being ill’…

If I told my auntie I thought she had a melanoma / suspicious skin lesion etc, it would be taken seriously and thought to be a kind gesture. If I told my auntie she’s obese and it will make her unwell, I’d be told to FO and I’m rude.. (my aunti isn’t fat, but..examples…)

Once we can approach the idea like this, we can take steps forward..

DrP

Food is much, much cheaper than it was in the 80s – as a % of income – and a lot of jobs are far more sedentary.

Plus you can watch Netflix & order food directly to your sofa.

People know that healthy diet & regular excercise is good for them – but they’re too lazy to do it.

When I was growing up in 1970s I never had in between snacks, never had takeaways or fast food and had very little processed food.

The fast food and complete crap that is most ultra processed food is to blame for a lot of this. Humans are weak and take the easy option which fast and ultra processed foods gives them.

Also think people are typically less active – I never got driven anywhere and walked, cycled or in extremes got the bus whereas now kids seems to get escorted around everywhere.

The above maybe because I came from a fairly poor family.

It has to be food regulation, and by that I mean proper regulation, not shit-housery like printing the calorie counts on menus or traffic lights or anything that puts the onus on the consumer. 

We used to (about 10 years ago) lead the world in our attempts to reduce and remove salt from prepared foods, You can guess what 13 years of Tories have done to that. If I was king, there’d be rationing, but I’d be the first to admit that would probs. be less than popular. 🤣 I still think though a “shit food weekly allowance” ticket/book system is not that draconian given where we are and the impact that obesity is having on society. 

To a point I agree with Namastebuzz.
But i would argue that good food is not cheap, crap food is generally cheaper particularly if you factor in the time needed to make good food from scratch.
Cheap and easy food tends to be rubbish

A lot more manual jobs back in the 70’s too.

A lot more manual jobs back in the 70’s too.

You clearly haven’t spotted the overweight people doing these manual jobs today then.

It’s not just about cheapness, it’s about food being packed full of sugar (mainly).

A lot more manual jobs back in the 70’s too.

The amount of exercise you do will mostly not effect or overcome the shit in your diet, all that happens is your body compensates in other ways to try to maintain using about 2000-2500Kcals a day over time. If you put more food in it than that, you’ll get fatter, if you put less in you’ll get thinner.

We have to make food less calorie dense, and less easy to consume.

If I told my auntie I thought she had a melanoma / suspicious skin lesion etc, it would be taken seriously and thought to be a kind gesture. If I told my auntie she’s obese and it will make her unwell, I’d be told to FO and I’m rude.. (my aunti isn’t fat, but..examples…)

not the same thing at all, as one is a (potential) symptom and the other is only a risk-factor. A more equivalent example would be if your fat auntie developed chest pains. I’m sure she’d get that checked out.

If you put more food in it than that, you’ll get fatter, if you put less in you’ll get thinner.

Totally ignoring genetic predisposition and gut bacteria… as the dad to 2 step daughters who had different fathers, you would not believe they were half sisters.

Anyone who has tried to loose weight knows how darn difficult it is, but yes have to agree that def different to when we were kids (mid 1960s born) for all of the above reasons & direction of the food industry selling empty calories (think how little a Macdonald’s meal actually fills you up) apparently during rationing the UK was overall at its healthiest.

Totally ignoring genetic predisposition and gut bacteria…

Sure individually that’s going to vary according to our genes, there’s always been folks that are fatter than others, not denying that. But we’ve never (as a species) lived in a world where you can eat 5-6000Kcal or more daily without really trying that hard or spending that much money either. We either severely restrict the availability of that sort of diet or we watch as future generations live shorter more unhealthy lives than we do.

The sedentary way we live is one thing that’s killing us. I probably live in the most cycling-friendly city in the UK, but getting my kids to school by bicycle is a daily battle against selfish lazy people who want to travel everywhere on mobile sofas powered by climate destruction. We used to play on streets when I was a kid; today mine is a narrow racetrack dominated by psychopaths with esoteric finance on twisted status symbols. On an individual level I also think the fact I’m slimmer than my parents were at my age is down to cycling more than anything else because I don’t think my diet is better than theirs was.

Okay long post here but as a fat man, I feel I can weigh in on this with my anecdotal experience. Always been a big guy at 6ft3 and not lanky, and my weight has yo-yo’d over the years, at my skinniest in my early 20’s I got down to 15st, I still had a tiny bit of a belly but I was mountainbiking 60 miles a week minimum and in the gym or hiking the rest of the time, I’ve always carried a lot of muscle.

Currently im 20st 12lbs, I’m 2st down from this time last year but how did I get here? Partly I’d like to blame genetics citing studies that show lineages that have suffered starvation carry a gene varient that makes them more prone to putting on weight and finding solance in having irish lineage to explain my big gut, but really it’s my lifestyle.

As said when I was hammering out 60+ miles a week and lifting lots of weights IIRC my body fat % around then was something in the 7-10% range, currently it’s 35%. I went from 24st down to 15st in my early 20’s however I was at the time unemployed for a good while, living with parents and had nothing else better to do. So what’s changed? Time available for excercise is one factor, money is another factor as I can now afford nicer (sweets, chocolate, beer, cheese) stuff in the food shopping and more takeaways, I’ve developed a taste for craft beer too whereas in my early 20’s I was more of a spirits drinker, and of course metabolism slows with age.
Another factor I haven’t covered is going into my 20’s I was 24st, so what lead to that? Mental health issues, overeating, an abusive relationship and a penchant for takeaways.

So each time the reasons have been slightly different, I think for me all started in early childhood when I developered a coping mechanism through comfort eating, I was a fat kid until my teens when I got into skateboarding. But that’s set off a precedence for me through my adult life I believe.

So I got fat, lost it, got fat, lost it, got fat and now I’m currently in the losing it phase again, the problem is for me is that as mentioned, comfort eating, and less time to excercise means it’s a slow, slow process, that combined with sometimes long work days or busy days or just shitty days then also means when you don’t fancy anything you’ve bought in for cooking a meal, a takeaway delivered of a hot gooey pizza or a curry is hard to pass up, as is a beer or two to go with it. For me it’s more a mental game than anything else as I’ve also got a massive appetite, I can pack away a large dominos stuffed crust with 14 franks wings no issue and still have room for cookies on top. I can do a 25 mile ride on the weekend but all that work is undone with that 1 hour window of starving hungry and temptation on a Monday night.

To summarise, lifestyle causes obesity, mental factors can contribute and I also believe the ease of obtaining UPF and unhealthy food is easier than it ever has been before, especially for those with expendable income for it. In 2012 when I lost the biggest chunk ever, the difference to the years prior is I had less money for takeaways, I was eating less processed healthier foods, I was drinking less alcohol, I had more time for excercise, and I was happier and less stressed due to no financial strains from living with parents and no stress from working due to being unemployed.

I know what I need to do to lose more weight, it’s just doing it and staying disciplined is easier said than done whilst navigating day-to-day.

For the rest of the population, mental health issues are at an all time high, as is the convenience of takeaways, as is UPF foods and the ingredients in a lot of foods has degraded in quality imo, I’m still learning about all this palm oil stuff but speaking with my doctor the rise of high cholestrol in younger people seems to have risen with the use of palm oils and sugars being used although they’re still trying to properly pin the link, and also people are more sedentry with less time for excercise.
Most people I know these days are all working desk-jobs as am I.

When I saw the thread title I immediately sang it to the tune of “Anarchy in the UK”. Then immediately thought of the irony that the vocalist on that very song went on to advertise, of all things, butter.

Somewhere in the first series of A thorough examination with Chris and Xand they interview an academic who talks about the damaging hormonal impacts of UPF. How it tricks is into feeling hungry. I think the answer lies therein.

I was wondering if it had actually got better in the last 5 years or so.  I know when I used to come back to the UK it was always a bit shocking the number of seriously overweight people around but it doesn’t seem as bad these days and the number of people out exercising, not just the super fit, seems to really be going up.  I do agree with the mental health bit though.  There are so many more pressures on people than back in the 80s and you do spend more of your free time fixing stuff by email rather than going in to your bank/electricity supplier etc and that eats up your will to look after yourself

The sedentary way we live is one thing that’s killing us.

Hunter Gatherer societies spent even more time than westerners do sat around and doing as little as possible, most days that’s sat on the village log around the village fire shooting the breeze. The bi-weekly (or so) hunt is expending about the same energy as you do doing your 2 hour MTB ride on a Sunday morning.

The difference in our body shapes isn’t the amount of moving we do.

crap food is generally cheaper particularly if you factor in the time needed to make good food from scratch.

This touches on something – you now need two full-time incomes to pay for a mortgage and childcare.

My gran didn’t have a job, and was an excellent cook, making her own bread and growing her own veg.

My mum worked part time, so didn’t make bread or grow veg, but (usually) still had some time to cook.

These days, the only families I know where one parent works part-time are those where the other earns an absolutely ton. It’s rare, and drives people much more towards ready meals and processed foods.

When I was back in the UK last year I had to take the old man to the doctors. 

In the waiting room there were four chairs, out of perhaps 15 total, that were for fat people.

Never seen it before so tried discreetly to take a pic. The receptionist caught me. Thought I was going to get a telling off, but instead she went off on one about how society is normalising obesity rather than trying to tackle it. 

The UK is fat. Prior to brexit it was the most obese country in the EU. Now it’s my new Vaterland  homeland of Germany that is the fattest and they’re nowhere near as fat as the UK. 

Kerlyey – I was in a middle class family and my experience is the same.

Its incredibly cheap to eat. Any food, not just unhealthy stuff.

You could quite easily get a day’s decent meals out of 1 hour of minimum wage. (and thats good becasue a lot of other things are very expensive especially if you are poor)

And its all available, all the time.

That is probably the greatest acheivement of the last ~50 years of western society.

I love food, I love eating. Thank god I like mtb and exercise in general too, or I’d be waddling around.

Oh, and I’m currently in Italy.

I have to mentally prepare myself for a meal out with locals as plates of food seemingly appear out of nowhere every time the previous plate is emptied.

The Italians eat like kings most meal times, yet are not fat. A lot of it had to do with the quality of what you eat. Not much in the way of pre-cooked meals in most supermarkets here.

Before the “cost of living crisis” began the figures were something around.

The average UK citizen spends 8% of income on food.

For the lower 50% of the population to meet healthy eating guidelines they would need to spend around 30%.

For the bottom 10% that would rise to over 50% of income.

So while food may be cheaper, just the financial pressure to eat crap food is quite high, especially for lower earners. Given the housing costs, commuting etc it is pretty much impossible for 50% of the population to follow the healthy eating guidelines. That doesn’t include again include the time pressures on modern families. If you are 60 there is a very strong chance only your father worked when you were a child, in a 40 hour a week job in the same town you lived in (lets face it most jobs now are officially 40 hours but in most offices that is the minimum hours in the uk).

Given that there is also now quite interesting research about the impact of ultra processed foods, and their impact on weight and metabolic disease, which goes way beyond just the macro nutrients they contain.

The NHS is part of the problem. I’ve had a few issues over the last 6 months which has resulted in several trips to the gp and hospital. Everyone has asked me if I smoke and drink. (Do they not look in my notes?) but no-one, NO-ONE, has asked about my diet.

A recent trip to a&e necessitated searching for refreshments. The hospital shop contained all manner of goodies, but the only ones who’s main ingredient wasn’t sugar were crisps. You have a sitting target with a chance to educate them about food and it’s ignored.

Things haven’t moved on much since when I had a Heart bypass 15 years ago. The day after, I was served with Steak and Kidney pie , followed by sticky toffee pudding for lunch….

Healthy food in hospitals is possible, isn’t it?

apparently during rationing the UK was overall at its healthiest

That was kind of the point of it. A lot of people had a better diet as a result of rationing which helped them put in a good shift at the factory building bombs etc. I wonder if people in general are unhappier than before? More comfort eating? People doom scrolling on their phones and constantly being reminded of how shitty things are or seeing people like the Kardashians etc and wishing they looked a million dollars. It’s a bit of a vicious circle for people who are overweight. I have some sympathy for people who are overweight. I love chocolate and I know it can trigger a migraine but I can’t give it up completely and it’s the thing I want if I’m having a bad day.

A lot of people had a better diet as a result of rationing which helped them put in a good shift at the factory building bombs etc

One or both of the world wars was when the ruling class actually realised how poorly fed and underfed the average citizen was, when they gave cursory health checks on all drafted soldiers.

Regardless of how or why rationing came about (and it was mostly to prevent the rich from hoarding) the result was a very healthy population.

It’s all about choices and education. I can afford a takeaway if I want one. I limit takeaways to around 1 a fortnight. I can eat cake and crisps every day if I want to. I do loves slice of cake but not every day.

I also think level of activity has a big influence on putting on weight. I used to say I had a 200 mile a week diet. I found if I cycled 200 miles a week I never put on weight. That didn’t mean I could eat crap all the time. It just meant I could have cake if I felt like it a or a chip supper.

I agree on the high sugar ultra processed food being part of the problem and the availability of cheap sugary snacks and fizzy drinks. I don’t think you should ban these foods it’s a choice.

We need to help people make healthy choices and teach them how to cook. One way to do that would be use the tax raised on sugary/high processed foods to subsidise healthy foods.

I noticed that in developing countries fast food is expensive and fresh fruit and vegetables are cheap. These countries don’t have the obesity problem we have.

I wrote about the single most important intervention to tackle obesity a few years ago, building on the findings of the 2007 Foresight report I was involved in.

Public, media and political discourse is overwhelmingly focused on individual level behaviours, but this cannot explain the rise in the prevalence of obesity over recent decades. Educational interventions are an extremely weak mechanism for driving change; obesity is not a knowledge-deficit disorder. The obesity epidemic has been, and continues to be, primarily driven by a complex set of interacting changes to physical, social, economic, commercial and political environments, not fundamental changes in human nature, biology, or genetics. The existence of people who have been able to buck these trends does not negate the overarching picture, any more than Aunty Doris who smoked 60 a day until she died in her sleep at 102 disproves the risks of smoking.

But in the times of rationing there was no bad food (well not compared to last 40 years of ‘development’).

Yes you could make an unhealthy meal by eating lard, no veg etc,. but that was a lot less likely when you were given a set amount of items so ate them all. If we had rationing now it would be one UPF meal per day and some other crap so would not be the same.

My neighbours eight year old asked me if I ride my bike everywhere because I’m poor and can’t afford a car? Bless him.
We live a five minute walk to the local shop and ten minutes to the Primary School. All of my immediate neighbours use their car.
One neighbour who is a little older than me pays someone to walk his dog because he can’t as his knees have gone due to being overweight.
Most of us take regular exercise as just something we do. Unfortunately we are very much in the minority.
Edit, both of my kids cycled to school every day from the time they started reception. On wet or frosty days, parents more or less accused me of abuse!!
As it happens, both still cycle local journeys. If you lead, they will follow.
This just means that the kids getting taxied everywhere will just continue to do so as adults.

I agree with @kerley readily available cheap crap processed food.

A lot of people just don’t know what healthy food is, and don’t even care for eating healthy. There’s no interest what it’s doing to their bodies, and no connection that fatigue, lack of interest and motivation is down to an unhealthy lifestyle.

Also there’s a certain stigma amongst some, attached to healthy eating. Like you’re some kind of woosie if you like eating lentils, beans, quinoa and vegetables, and heaven forbid mention of the word salad. Oh you like eating rabbit food? and It’s somehow seen as manly if you stuff yourself with crisps and quarter pounders and wash it down with a pint of beef dripping. 🙄

I also think level of activity has a big influence on putting on weight.

We have to move away from the idea that population levels of obesity are still an individual’s personal responsibility to resolve. We’re surrounded by ‘food’ all the time that is extremely energy dense, in small enough portions sizes that has been very specifically designed not to fill you up so you consume it easily and buy more of it. Give people the opportunity to do things that feel good, regardless whether they will make themselves ill, and humans will do it, see; any drug from any point in our history.

(think how little a Macdonald’s meal actually fills you up)

Without trying to be awkward, I had a McDonald’s somewhat recently and felt perfectly well full up afterward.

I had one on the way to BPW last weekend, and I felt disgusting afterwards

I see it as a manifestation of widening inequality and poverty, comfort eating, addiction to UPF and sugar, cheap diets, snacking, the normalising of overweight/obesity, poor education, the commercialisation of exercise, time poverty.  Unless there’s some sort of shift half the population will be diabetic, have knackered knees and their naughty bits will be a distant memory.

Inequality and poverty is an interesting one on this to me. Purely anecdotal but go to the poorer parts of the city you see fat women and skinny men.  Go to the richer parts you see skinny women and fat men

the main issue is food regulation IMO – the big food companies deliberately make their processed food addictive with high levels of sugar salt and fat