Nail on the f***** head! The labour party of Blair and his cronies no longer exists. The sooner binners and the rest of them get used to that the sooner labour can move on.

NEWSFLASH: ‘Moving on’ is exactly what the last 4 years, under the ‘leadership’ of the sainted benevolence of Comrade Corbyn have been about. A total break with the past. A complete rejection of Blairism/Centrism (booooooo… hisss…. IRAQ!!) A new socialist dawn. The delivery of a new ideologically pure Utopia.

We’ve reached the final destination of that particular project. It ended with the biggest Tory majority since 1983. The voters of this country gave it a massive two fingers and opted for what looked like a least worst option. Imagine that for an achievement…. Joris Bohnson and his far right cronies were a least worst option? Staggering!

At some point those on the left are going to have to poke their heads out of the bunker, take their tinfoil helmets off, stop blaming everyone else for the abject failure of their cloud-cuckoo-land manifesto and voter-repellent ‘leadership’ and acknowledge that they, and they alone, own this shitshow

If they fail to do this – and as yourself and the rest of the fan club are busy demonstrating – theres absolutely zero sign of that happening, then its permanent tory rule for all of us

It really is that simple

RL-B was spouting something the other day that sounded too much like BloJo for my liking.
She’ll need to move her position a long way to get my vote.

Do you think anyone on the left is going to get in touch with anyone in the real world at any point in the near future?

People in the ‘real world’ currently think climate change either doesn’t exist or can be fixed by recycling cans and bottles. People in the ‘real world’ are obsessed with trade tariffs and ‘making our own laws’. People in the ‘real world’ think all our problems are down to foreigners. People in the real world think those of us who eat foreign food and don’t eat meat are weirdos.

The real world you’re referring to is nothing of the sort, it’s a nostalgic fantasy that we can go back to the glory days of fish and chips and asians only working in corner shops and curry houses. Anyone who thinks climate change is a big problem, that we should pay more for public services, and is comfortable with homosexuals and non-white people is roundly dismissed as an elitist metropolitan communist do-gooder. The real world is a cesspit of hatred, bile, selfishness and petulance, and I’m quite happy to stay as far away from it as possible.

We’ve reached the final destination of that particular project. It ended with the biggest Tory majority since 1983. The voters of this country gave it a massive two fingers and opted for what looked like a least worst option. Imagine that for an achievement…. Joris Bohnson and his far right cronies were a least worst option? Staggering!

But they didn’t give the policies the two fingers, they just wanted to “Get Brexit Done”. Rerun the election with the same people in 2 years time when Brexit has been “done” and the result would have been very different.
The leader certainly didn’t help but Brexit was just as big an issue issue. The policies were good and they should have just shouted about the 2 most popular ones and repeated it rather than confusing everyone with loads of polices.

Daz… I know its Monday, mate, but even by your standards you’re a little ray of sunshine this morning.

Do you need a hug?

Do you need a hug?

Ha! S’ok it’s all just a coping mechanism. First the sociopathic rage, then the defensive nihilism. I’m well practised at it 🙂

Why would shifting away from Corbynism necessarily mean a return to Blairism? Are we that lacking in imagination that we can’t think of other alternatives? RLB talks of a revolution in politics, the only revolution that needs to happen is that within the Labour party, because at the moment it’s not fit for purpose.

If we can accuse Brexit voters of being enthralled by an imaginary version of the past then surely we must hold Labour to account in the same way, trotting out (pun intended) a version of late 70’s-early 80’s loony leftism. One side wearing a pair or rose tinted spectacles whilst the other wears a blindfold.

Politics is a sales job, Labour needs to set out a vision for the future and market it. At present it is completely stymied by the structures within the party. It’s painfull to watch leadership candidates campaign with one (or both) hands tied behind their back. They seem too afraid to say what they know needs to be said.

This is a thread about Labour leadership candidates, it could also be titled New direction for Labour. The current direction pins all it’s hopes on the country completely falling apart and the population seeing the light and turning to Marxism. That’s a pretty cr*p message to sell.

Labour needs a post Brexit mindset, Brexit didn’t happen last Friday, it happened 3 years ago. (I know someone will be on here in a bit saying it’s only just started and when seen as a process they’d be right.) Lisa Nandy seems to be the only candidate to have accepted the reality of Brexit and she accepted it some time ago. This leads me to think she’s been thinking in a post Brexit mindset for some time, not mulling over long lost battles.

But they didn’t give the policies the two fingers, they just wanted to “Get Brexit Done”. Rerun the election with the same people in 2 years time when Brexit has been “done” and the result would have been very different.

Labours messages managed to get more confusing as the election campaign progressed. It felt like they were throwing policies at the wall to see what would stick. Making it up on the hoof.

And the parties ratings were only headed in one direction. Through the floor. Why on earth do you think that will change in a couple more years, given the utterly shambolic state of the party? It looks like all they plan on doing is replacing Grandad with his anointed one and carrying on banging the same drum that voters rejected twice already. The last time by a thumping great margin.

What is it they say about the definition of madness? They need a radical change of direction after this miserable defeat. Only Lisa Nandy seems to get that.

The leader certainly didn’t help but Brexit was just as big an issue issue. The policies were good and they should have just shouted about the 2 most popular ones and repeated it rather than confusing everyone with loads of polices.

All this illustrates is the political cluelessness of those around Corbyn and their utter ineptitude when it came to running a campaign. This is all well documented. All those marxist incompetents should be history after that magnitude of failure they delivered. But instead, in a typical bout of nepotism, they were all given (very highly paid) permanent contracts so they can’t be put out to pasture. Thus reinforcing union stereotypes of ‘jobs for life for the boys’ and rewarding failure. A great look in 2020.

Whats more, the Corbynites are presently franticly trying to secure more senior places on their union-funded gravy train at the top of the party, to ensure anyone who follows Grandad (in case the membership fails to deliver ‘Becky’) is straight-jacketed into the same narrow political cul-de-sac

They’re behaving exactly like the Cult that they’ve always been accused of being. A closed shop.

Labours messages managed to get more confusing as the election campaign progressed. It felt like they were throwing policies at the wall to see what would stick. Making it up on the hoof.

Exactly why I said pick the 2 most popular and just repeat them everyday. The others can just stay in the manifesto which nobody reads.

All this illustrates is the political cluelessness of those around Corbyn and their utter ineptitude when it came to running a campaign.

I think this is the closest we’re going to get to a concensus between us. That was entirely the problem, I don’t think the policies were in themselves problematic as opposed to the way they were packaged and presented.

Yet the millionaire Marxists responsible for those appalling communications and disastrous strategy have all been given new contracts and pay-rises, so whoever ends up as leader is saddled with the same gang of highly paid incompetents.

I thought it was the Tory’s who were meant to be the old boys club?

Ironically, their (horribly effective) head of communications and strategy isn’t even a member of the party.

Here’s an interesting little snippet for you… he’s also paid less than Grandads strategic genius, Seamas Milne, who’s almost comic ineptitude is all funded by union members subs of course.

Jobs for the boys…

I think this is the closest we’re going to get to a concensus between us. That was entirely the problem, I don’t think the policies were in themselves problematic as opposed to the way they were packaged and presented.

The policies were great, Nationalise everything quickly, every family will be £6k better off, water and utilities will be cheaper with better quality, free interent, 4 day working week etc etc.
A great list of policies, which everyone in the Country should vote for.
But in the real world, it was clear that lot could not be paid for, and it just looked like a made up list, which was totally unworkable, and so far off the affordability range that even solid Labour voters couldnt vote for.
I always laugh when someone on the front bench say they have ‘won the argument’.
Yes, you have, we all want these things, but the clueless Labour Leaders could never deliver it, so we’d never vote for it.
Disregarding Corbyn (who is an abysmal Leader), the Labour front bench was a Vanarama league team up against Premier leagues Tories. And the Tories have been doing terribly for the last 3 years.
They didnt lift their game enough to even get a draw.
And, it really was the worst Governemt for many years they were playing against, yet still couldnt get a goal, never mind a win.

God it’s depressing, just had a look at the betting odds to remind myself how bad things really are and are likely to be for some time to come. Starmer nailed on and RLB 5/1, Nandy 11/1. I had deceived myself in to believing possible futures.

The immediate future for the Labour party is to be an effective opposition. Boris is already dismissing any scrutiny of his Brexit plans as mumbo jumbo. There’s no one to hold him to account for the minute because the opposition is too busy eating itself. Once they finaly get back to their day jobs It’ll likely be Starmer at the dispatch box, challenging the government with a load of legalese. This has been the approach of the last 3 years and it hasn’t worked. I can’t see the public being engaged in any way with Starmer at the helm, Boris will be able to steamroller the whole thing through.

We can’t look to parliament and the law to hold Boris to account, he’ll brush it off. The public needs to keep engaged with the process. The only thing Boris will pay attention to is his popularity with the electorate. (That’s why he’s called a poulist) He wants to keep the public in the dark as much as possible and just trust him to get it done.

Again, I can only see Lisa Nandy as the one being able to engage with the public on this issue and keep them interested. Though again, I just looked at the odds.

Thornberry is feeling the squeeze between Corbyn’s adopted daughter and Starmer. Poor thing

Polls showing Thornberry ahead of RLB with the public, even when limited to Labour voters. She has no chance of getting union backing now though. And the members wouldn’t choose her anyway. Nandy more popular still, outside the “better to be a protest group than compromise in government” ilk.

So… talking of someone Unite and a huge chunk of the membership back, but voters don’t want anywhere near office… Unite’s candidate for Deputy Leader…

Great coverage of my pledge to change Labour's rules so that we won't back military action without the members having a vote.

With this pledge, Labour members will never again experience the shame of having to say "Not In My Name" against their own party. https://t.co/bGdDtNaOtY

— Richard Burgon MP (@RichardBurgon) February 5, 2020

change Labour’s rules so that we won’t back military action without the members having a vote.

Parody account?

I was reading in this morning’s Grauniad that total plum’s latest attempt to make Jeremy Corbyn look like a towering political colossus. He’s the political equivalent of Alan Partridge, randomly shouting out his ideas for programmes

MONKEY TENNIS!

I bet they love him in the 6th form Momentum common room. The fact that he’s Comrade Lens choice for deputy leader tells you everything you need to know about Comrade Len’s judgement. His dream ticket of Becky and Ricky as the leadership team really would deliver us a true one party state

Parody account?

You’d hope so, wouldn’t you? Unfortunately for the Labour Party he’s very much for real, and has his finger on the pulse of the pressing issues at the forefront of voters minds.

What a total cockwomble

Went to my CLP nomination meeting this week. It was interesting (actually worrying is a better word) how a majority of the nearly 40 members who got up to speak were still firmly of the belief that Corbyn was a great leader, that the policies put forward in the manifesto were very popular, and that the only reasons for the election loss were the press and those Labour members and MPs who were in the centre or right of the party who didn’t ally themselves to Corbyn, McCluskey and Lansman’s ‘popular’ version of socialism. Some speakers didn’t even bother highlighting the benefits of RLB, but just used their time to slag off Starmer with a couple even stating they would leave the party if he was elected.

RLB won the vote for leader, but interesting only got 4 second preference votes compared with Lisa Nandy who came a narrow second but had some 40 second preference votes. Dawn Butler won the nomination for deputy.

It seems that currently in the Labour Part there is more emnity for those in the centre and right of the party rather than the Tories.

Burgon’s got some great ideas.

I look forward to the Tories stealing them and seeing the result of when the membership vote on reinstating the death penalty and national service.

If Richard Burgon’s motion gets passed and by some miracle we get a Labour gov’t, does that mean we will declare war on Israel? (Backed by the members having a vote obviously)

Dawn Butler won the nomination for deputy

Dawn Butler makes Richard Burgon look sane, reasonable and measured. Corbynism with an added evangelical christian edge. Just what the country is crying out for

It seems that Labour has now given up even the remotest pretence at being an actual political party, let alone a serious contender for government.

It’s basically now just a sanctimonious, virtue-signalling facebook group that distributes online petitions about making veganism compulsory, or nationalising Greggs, before nipping over to Twitter to post some death threats to Margaret Hodge.

The Corbynites/sixth formers/PFJ have been quiet of late. It’d be interesting to hear the views from underneath the tinfoil helmets, inside the bunker on how this is all panning out

“none shall vote for us!”

The Long March From Power continues.

We had a discussion about the new leader at a regional union meeting I was at. Plenty in attendance are, unlike me fully involved in the local Labour party so it was a decent debate.

When it came to choosing who to back I stated my case for Starmer as for numerous reasons I think he’s the candidate most likely to win back lost votes.
Others then stated their preference and kept referring to not wanting to go back to the days of Blair or swinging to the right (Directed at Starmer). When I explained I was not involved with the party like they were so classed myself as a member of the great unwashed (so more like the people who need winning over) and asked what Starmer has said or done to make them believe he would take the party in that direction non of them could answer. I found that depressing.

RLB won the vote. I personally think she would be the worst option.

RLB won the vote. I personally think she would be the worst option.

Yep, and more because of her personality above anything else. If she wins and Labour don’t realise the mistake within a year they will probably lose even more seats in next election.

RLB won the vote. I personally think she would be the worst option.

All the polling with the people who actually matter – the voters – is saying just that

Rebecca Long-Bailey is least popular Labour leadership contender, Evening Standard poll reveals

Just 14% of voters see her as a potential prime minister. Which means she’s no doubt nailed on as Corbyns successor. I’m sure that would dip substantially once she’s anointed and all the Tory’s and the right wing press have to do is point at her and utter two words ‘Continuity Corbyn’ then just carry on their terrorist sympathiser, antisemitic narrative.

Considering she’s been a front bench politician for years, I can’t think of a single thing she’s ever said or done. So in that respect, very much ‘Continuity Corbyn’

on how this is all panning out

And how is it panning out? All I can see is two frontrunners for the leadership and deputy who would be pretty good and a lot of froth about nothing much at all. The only ones paying attention at the moment are those who are still obsessed with Corbyn, the rest of us moved on long ago.

One comment I will make though is it’s going on far too long. Why they need 3 months is beyond me. It should all be done and dusted by now.

all the Tory’s and the right wing press have to do is point at her and utter two words ‘Continuity Corbyn’ then just carry on their terrorist sympathiser, antisemitic narrative.

Yup, that’s exactly what would happen and she’d be sunk before she began. I don’t have much of an opinion of her either way but the quote above is the exact reason I’d never even consider voting for her as leader.

Love him or loathe him if Starmer doesn’t get the job…. well its decades before a balance is restored.

I am a working class socialist and firmly believe in looking after people in a fair and equitable way.

I am also a business owner who employs people so i understand that business needs sensible regulation.

I believe in good education, social mobility and freedom of movement. I could never vote for Corbyn or many of his policies, i didn’t like Blair from day one.

Me and many like me need the middle ground not Tory light Blair or Comrade Corbyn. Like it or not Starmer represents that and i dont believe a word of his support for Corbynsold policies…. but id he is playing a fast one to beat Seamus and John then brilliant because ideolgy is the death of this country and replicating the dogma of the Tories will never beat the Tories.

So buckle up all you momentum folks, eat the shit sandwich and vote for Starmer and get a parliamentary labour party with some fresh faces (not baggy old trotsky left overs) and fight Johnsons bunch of semi facist arseholes each and every day. They are not invincible they have never been challenged. We need to extrapolate every bit of bad news post brexit and hammer it home.

One other point Labour need someone who can dismantle the Tory approach in Parliament and Starmer can do that, he may not be the eventual answer i dont know but i guess his prep work for prime ministers question time is pretty good…

This whole notion that the voters in the Northern towns somehow ‘lent’ the Tories their vote is a complete fallacy. It’s going to take a humongous effort to win their vote again and that’s not nearly enough, they have to find a way of appealing to new voters as well. It’s not like there’s a load of Lib dem voters they can poach as the Lib dem vote was shockingly low as well. We’re doomed.

Saw RLB on Peston the other night talking of how she felt the floor pulled from under her when the results started coming in on election night..The shock for me on election night was how well Labour actually did, I didn’t expect their vote to hold up as well as it did in metropolitan areas, I had the Tories down for nigh on a 100 seat majority.

I remember Johnson being in at a press conference with Trump in the US when thw supreme court verdict with regards prorogueing parliament came in and journalists were questioning him about it. Twice Trump interjected on Boris’s behalf saying ‘just another day in the office’. Then Boris responded, ‘well, it’s just another day in Parliament actually’.

I knew then and there that Boris was going to get exactly what he wanted, with regards Brexit and any potential forthcoming election. At that point I completely switched off, bowing to the inevitable. It wasn’t just the quick wittedness of his response it was how dismissive he was of the whole affair, it was water off a ducks back as far as he was concerned,. Almost as if he was prepared for the verdict, as if he and Cummings had factored in the possibility, recognising how little weight the Supreme Court actually had and knowing the public would see the whole process for the sham it was.

I think Jess Phillips , Lisa Nandy and Ian Murray were the only Labour candidates who recognised this so as such are the only ones with more than half a brain. On that note, how on earth can the Labour party membership not see how Ian Murray is streets ahead of any other candidate in the deputy leader race?

there is more emnity for those in the centre and right of the party rather than the Tories.

T’was ever so. I’ve been to local meetings back in the early 90s and been spat on for refusing to take some communist leaflet and called tory scum

how on earth can the Labour party membership not see how Ian Murray is streets ahead of any other candidate in the deputy leader race?

Its not really much of a mystery. The present labour party membership elected Jeremy Corbyn not once, but twice. They’re presently overwhelmingly endorsing Rebecca Long Bailey (as she promises more of the same, which has been so successful with the electorate), with god-bothering communist Dawn Butler or that comedic village idiot Richard Burgon as deputy leader. Some of them were seriously suggesting Ian Lavery. Just sit and let that sink in for a minute. Ian Lavery as a potential PM?

Everyones talking about Starmer but given the track record of the people who will make the final decision I don’t think he’s got a hope.

If RLB’s name is on that final ballot, she’s going to walk it, probably with Richard Burgon as deputy

You have to remember who you’re dealing with here. The labour party membership really is that detached from reality. How many more times do they have to demonstrate it?*

* Just this one last time, obviously. After that, the labour party is done. The UK will be a one party state

Trust the bookies binbins

Inkster

Ian Murray?

Architect of the labour / tory non agreession pact that saved May’s government?

He is a complete rear end of a cow.

You can hold on to your grudges if you like TJ. Whilst I could sit here looking for some witty riposte with regards pantomime animals I’m beyond that now……but you’ve pulled my chain, suffice to say RLB and the beast of Burdon would fail the audition for the rear end of a pantomime anything.

Murray knew Labour was heading for a cataclysmic defeat and wasn’t scared to say so. Plus he’s a ruthless hard nut, a quality I’m looking for from my politicians at the moment. He wouldn’t have to fight his way out of a paper bag because you wouldn’t get him hiding in one in the first place.

I posted earlier that an alternative thread could be ‘New direction for Labour’ but realised that was wishful thinking on my part, predicated as it was on a Nandy – Murray type ticket.

I hope you’re wrong Binners and Starmer succeeds over RLB, at least then Labour might live to fight another day. If you’re right and the lunatics do take over the asylum then the next thread will be along the lines of ‘Do you remember the Labour party?’ Or maybe someone’s already posted that thread on Retro-bike.

For those saying the party has lost it’s mind and still has massive support for Corybn:

So far, 350 CLPs have nominated candidates to be leader of the Labour Party.

Keir Starmer: 201
Rebecca Long-Bailey: 96
Lisa Nandy: 40
Emily Thornberry: 13 pic.twitter.com/HOCiY1OLAB

— CLP Nominations (@CLPNominations) February 7, 2020

“So far, 350 CLPs have nominated candidates to be leader of the Labour Party.

Keir Starmer: 201
Rebecca Long-Bailey: 96
Lisa Nandy: 40
Emily Thornberry: 13”

“So far, 352 CLPs have nominated candidates to be deputy leader of the Labour Party.

Angela Rayner: 200
Dawn Butler: 49
Richard Burgon: 39
Ian Murray: 37
Rosena Allin-Khan: 27”

Starmer is far far ahead with the traditionally more left wing CLPs (compared to the general membership).

I too agree that Nandy may be a better choice, but lets just try and keep to the facts. The party clearly knows that a big change is needed, and is acting on it.

If it ends up being a combination of ‘boring but across his brief’ Starmer, and ‘laugh off your erudite but condescending questioning style’ Rayner… that is probably the best outcome possible, given the dual requirements of not scaring away existing support, and looking to build on it, and given the list of candidates that put themselves forward.

If it ends up being a combination of ‘boring but across his brief’ Starmer, and ‘laugh off your erudite but condescending questioning style’ Rayner… that is probably the best outcome possible

It’s going to be those 2 almost certainly, unless either makes a monumental gaff in the next few weeks.

It’s basically now just a sanctimonious, virtue-signalling facebook group that distributes online petitions about…

Now where does that sound like? On the tip of my tongue like it’s almost staring me in the face…

Or maybe someone’s already posted that thread on Retro-bike.

We tend to keep away from politics on RB, leads to too many arguments. 😉