Just wondering if anyone could recommend a frame that rides like an old Kona? Are the new hardtails any good?

I’m having a rethink on my plans for the bike build based on my original thread and not getting on with my Soul:

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/anyone-not-get-on-with-a-cotic-soul

I’m on a budget so did toy with getting an older Kona with a 1 1/8th headset and selling everything else.

I had the soul resprayed but I just don’t think I’m going to get on with it to be honest.

My Saracen Kili Flyer (2012 853 frame) isn’t far off. It’s pretty fast steering, put it that way.
But, to be honest, my ’93 Explosif (Tange Ultimate Ultralight) is in a different class. It’s just a rocketship if flickable pointyness. I wanted one in ’92 and couldn’t afford one, I built this a couple of years ago and it’s everything I ever wanted and more. If you want an old Kona, only an old Kona will do I think. 🙂

I picked up a 2005 lava dome in very good condition for a couple of hundred quid, not as pricey as expplosifs and tubing not so flash but still really nice ride and the 2005s had disc tabs as did the purple 2006s which pop up now and again

pretty much swapped everything out, it rides really well

the 650b explosifs are supposed to be ace but a bit pricey!

heres mine

edit

infact if you are a large…

http://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/fs-clearout-frames-mechs-shifters-bars

I bought a Kenesis Decade Virsa to emulate my old Kona frame that was stolen.
It has the Tange Prestige tubing, skinny seat tube etc and rides lovely.

Mr Poddy has it though, only the real thing will do and there are many appearing on Ebay regularly.

A new frame that rides just like your old Kona, or how you remember your old Kona to ride?

If you mention what size you’re looking for, I’m sure someone on here will find you an old Kona frame to build up.

>double post<

Nothing will really ride like an old Kona except an old Kona…

but help us out here, you’ve told us you’re not getting on with your Soul, what was/is it about your old Kona that you like so much and are those thing still relevant to your modern riding?

Plenty of people* still using old favourite frames, some have sent their old frames off for a disk mount a spruce up to modernise, easy enough to do and if you really like it then as long as it still suits your needs then why not?

*me included

@kimbers

Probably one of the best photos I’ve seen of a bike that ‘just looks right’.

Nice.

Have a look for a Voodoo Wanga. Not the new Halfrauds alloy one, the Reynolds 631 tubing one.

Its designed by Joe Murrey, the same as the old Kona’s, and feels remarkably similar to ride. Its designed to take up to 100mm fork. Great fun to chuck about on twisty singletrack. Sliding dropouts mean you can run it single speed, if thats what floats yer boat

It was zingy and just felt right really. Can’t explain it. Not too harsh or dead either. I generally blast all Iocer the South Downs so it’s all cross country stuff. I liked the fact it was fairly light weight

A new frame that rides just like your old Kona, or how you remember your old Kona to ride?

Mine rides exactly the same but better than the 4 others I had before it (91 Cindercone, 93 Lavadome, Hei Hei, 92 Cindercone)
🙂

The thing is, back then, RACE and LIGHT ruled the world. So the bikes are just that. Fast, quick steering and light. My Rxplosif frame is a whisker over 4lb which is nearly a pound lighter than my other 2 853 frames. It runs probably the best rigid fork ever made, the Triple Butted Project 2, and a host of lightweight retro bling. Without even trying its under 24lb ready to ride.
Bikes aren’t made like that any more. They’re slacker, heavier and have suspension. All of that is great but it dulls the feeling that a lightweight old rigid bike gives.

I think I’d feel much more like the OP if my 95 Kilauea had a touch more tyre clearance at the back. It’s still a nice bike to ride but it wouldn’t be my favourite – I think that bikes have moved on for the better, even if you get a current frame with rigid forks though. The biggest issue you’ll find with a current (eg now rather than in the last few years) steel frame is that the CEN changes have killed off a large number of springy steel frames.

FWIW though, I don’t think that my Kona or many others of that era actually have a particularly springy ‘steel’ ride. A lot of people feel what they think they should IMO.

Obligatory pic

It just felt right

A lot of people feel what they think they should

Exactly what I was thinking. However much you like your new “like an old Kona” bike, there’s always going to be a part of you that thinks “Hmmm. It’s not an Kona though…”

Don’t take the chance. Get an old Kona frame, tart it up a bit if you need to. Keep it light, new light stuff as bling as you like, stick with rigid forks around 425mm (or maybe less if it’s really old?) or get some SIDs and space them down to 65-70mm.

Here’s mine, a 1997 LavaDome. All in I think it’s cost about £600ish to build it up, with a few mates rates. Took it out at the weekend and it rides great… all be it nothing like a 150mm full susser! It makes easy things harder/more fun.

Peterpoddy. I think you have nailed it. Some lovely pics by the way!

I think I am going to hunt down an old Kona to build up.

I just sold a 95 Lava Dome with P2’s and Rock Shox, full original LX and Campag Stheno (?) on XT wheels. I only got £100 on ebay, I think the buyer got a bargain.

They are long though, I sold it because after time on Kinesis, Dialled and Charge frames it just felt waaay too long. Can you borrow one to check it isn’t rose tinted specs syndrome?

Something like this? I love it. Only selling up to get the Ti version. Also some new ’13 models online for great prices!

Market has changed, when I started the norm was 71/73 and about 22.5 top tube 135 stem, 5 degree rise and slammed,

find that bike now. stems are shorter, top tubes longer, head angles slacker and bikes have gone from rigid to 100+ front travel.

Also consider that cutting bars down was normal, that cutting down from 560 or less!

A wanga is not quiet as nice as an explosif as it is not so composed at the rear end on bumpy stuff, or at least I found. the geometry is nice though.

If you are near Woking in surrey I have an 18 inch steel wanga built up that you could try out to see if you like it. I also have an 18 inch voodoo bizango frame that I bought for 80 quid, which you could build up to see if you like (or I might swap it over with the wanga frame anyway).

The bizango it’s probably going to be the most explosif like as it is a Joe Murray design (like the Wanga) but is 853 and specified for 100mm forks (as is the wanga).

Both are sitting in the garage doing nothing. If you liked either you could have the frame for 80 (paint job is better on the wanga – a Bob Jackson one in peacock blue).

Bizango pics here : I was going to do this but I bought another flux frame so the parts from the Wanga are going on that now I think :

http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=54974&start=10

Sanderson.

Rides like my 93 explosif but is heavier.

Thats nice Turnerguy. Manged to did a picky up of my old one….

Voodoo wanga by binlidski, on Flickr

That’s not my bizango though, my frame is white but has a few chips on the paint so I was going to get a respray, and have got some (but not all) replacement decals from voodoo, Joe Murray answered the email and posted them 🙂

FWIW though, I don’t think that my Kona or many others of that era actually have a particularly springy ‘steel’ ride. A lot of people feel what they think they should IMO.

This, in comparison to newer bikes the Hahana and Explosif I had weren’t all that. Nice bikes, but certainly the Explosif for me was one if the most disappointing bikes I’ve ever ridden, just flat feeling. although to be fair, my main ride at the time was a Scandvik Hummer, so pretty much anything felt dead in comparison

My 1998 & 1999 Calderas have DB stays are really very comfortable and springy.

I think similar years Explosifs had the same stays with a fancier front triangle (Kilauea 631, Expolsif 853)

The closest I have found so far is the Soul.

nothing rides quite like an old kona…

luckily for you I have a delightful 92 vintage cindercone for sale…

🙂

FWIW though, I don’t think that my Kona or many others of that era actually have a particularly springy ‘steel’ ride. A lot of people feel what they think they should IMO.

I don’t either. But by fek does it ricochet off the rocks and belt up hills a bit sharpish. It’s light and unbelievably direct.

By comparison we had a Genesis iO single speed that weighed 2.5lb+ more then my geared Kona, was a shockingly poor climber and as dull as ditchwater.

TurnerGuy,

I’d be interested if you are selling either of those frames
My 1996 Voodoo only has canti mounts so a new frame would be cheaper then getting disc mounts brazed on and re sprayed

Sold my ’98 Kona Hei Hei last year to a guy in Thailand for silly money and in it’s place got the last version of Litespeed’s Obed frame at less than half price. Love it and wouldn’t think of going back, nor would I want to drive my 90s Fiesta XRi again either.

Having said all that, the old Konas were a bit special.

this is how good old Konas were :

I love and hate my old nineties Columbus Max Explosif in equal measure; sometimes we get on and other times it tries to kill me… but I will have the last laugh when I kill it 😈

PeterPoddy – By comparison we had a Genesis iO single speed that weighed 2.5lb+ more then my geared Kona, was a shockingly poor climber and as dull as ditchwater.

Thats not quite how you worded it in the advert I bought from. I am however loving it so much that I’m thinking of changing it for something better… if that makes sense

Thats not quite how you worded it in the advert I bought from.

busted !!!

Here’s my Voodoo Wanga :

(if you can’t see it it’s a facebook thing).

with 100mm Reba’s on, XC717s on Hope XCs, and 110mm stem, which I use as my ‘guest’ bike as it is so solid. Weigh’s about 26 like this I think.

It has sliding paragon dropouts so is pretty versatile and I keep considering putting an Alfine 8 on the back, but in reality I don’t do mud so much these days and if it is not too bad I take the turner as the bushings are so good in the mud.

You are welcome to come and try it as is, and I could put some lighter wheels on if you want to see what it is like with a little less weight.

I could then swap the frame over to the Bizango as I was going to do this anyway to see what it was like – I had always been on the lookout for one from ages ago and then one came up on ebay, so I bought it when I don’t really need it now.

So one frame will go and the other may become the ‘shopping’ bike for runs to the local village…

Note than the Wanga has a very tall headtube so is a bit different to the bizango – but the user reviews are always very good so it is worth trying I reckon, if you are close.

Also note that seatpost/saddle combo – USE titanium and an old flite gel flow – it’s really springy and add a lot to the ride quality !

I will email you…

thepodge – Member 
Thats not quite how you worded it in the advert I bought from. I am however loving it so much that I’m thinking of changing it for something better… if that makes sense

Ouch! 😆

Wow those voodoos are lovely! Would it be possible to send me pics? I’d be interested.

I went from Explosifs to a Sanderson Life and wasn’t at all disappointed.

There’s a cheap Sanderson Life on ebay now, but it has a reserve…

Here’s a google cached image of the white bizango frame I got from ebay :

Here’s another of the Wanga upside down having the wheel re-inserted :

Here’s my old Columbus Explosif with 80mm forks – I swapped to the Wanga to use 100mm forks and discs :

and here’s my old folding commuting mtb, a Dahon Zero-G which was also designed by Joe Murray I believe :

Wow those voodoos are lovely! Would it be possible to send me pics? I’d be interested.

you probably mean the ones on the retrobikes link – I think they are all in the states.

I bought my white frame mostly after reading that thread – planning on a respray/powdercoat for it as it’s a little tatty – I think I will need to create the Bizango decals for it as Joe didn’t have any to send.

It seems to have turned into a bit of a Voodoo fanboy thread, this 🙂

I loved that bike. Losing my business meant it had to go. Sold it for next to nowt too 🙁 but as someone who loved old Kona’s too, I couldn’t recommend them highly enough. Great ride-all-day-while-grinning bike!

really loved the ‘old’ Konas, especially the early 90’s Explosif – was a lovely XC bike

was lucky enough to then own a couple of KHS Montana including the Pro (True Temper OX Ultra II tubing) and Team Ti (butted titanium) which were both under 22lb with Future Shock MMX fork, Syncros finishing kit and Shimano XTR

shame the “new” Kona hardtails are nothing like the old, when I worked at Evans we kept having to do this, because they were all coming ‘bent out of the box’