By watching others and listening to them… 😉

You can do a lot more one a full sus bike, been riding for 16 years most of them on a full sus, there a lot better than they used to be. My first one didn’t work when you stood up. But i must say you do have to spend quite a bit more on one, so why not just get a second hand giant trance frame of ebay.

Edit:
They improve you’re climbing because the rear wheel can track the ground a lot better thus giving you better grip.
Also thought id just show the Luddite’s what a real mountain bike looks like, cant see the point in hard tails my self 🙂

don simon – Member
The point being that a FS gives a level of comfort that not only allows you to ride though/over any obstacle without thought but you also lose any sensation of feedback from the trail.

don simon – Member
just said I’d never ridden one nor have the intention

can’t decide if you are a poor troll or highly opinionated on things you have little experience of? or maybe both?
the 😆 🙄 😉 ‘s aren’t making it any clearer either.

I am going to go for the controversial approach of having a hardtail, a full suss and a fully rigid and thinking they’re all ace, and all do the exact same job but in different, interesting ways.

Ive never ridden a road bike, nor intend to.

MrSmith – Member

don simon – Member
The point being that a FS gives a level of comfort that not only allows you to ride though/over any obstacle without thought but you also lose any sensation of feedback from the trail.

don simon – Member
just said I’d never ridden one nor have the intention

can’t decide if you are a poor troll or highly opinionated on things you have little experience of? or maybe both?
the ‘s aren’t making it any clearer either.

Maybe this will help a little, but don’t worry about reading everything before commenting, I see your problem, you’re trying to contrive a negative picture of me and neither of your options are true, I do, however, have opinions and they are based either on first hand experience or the experiences of people I trust. Just to correct you, I said I have NO experience of riding Full sussers and as a poor troll I seem to have had a reasonable reaction.
If I tell you something tastes like dog shit, several other people tell you something tastes like dog shit, are you going to try it to confirm that it tastes like dog shit?

If I tell you something tastes like dog shit, several other people tell you something tastes like dog shit, are you going to try it to confirm that it tastes like dog shit?

i would give it a sniff to see if it was bovine or canine

But would you taste it? We all know that the smell might not be representative of the taste.

I said I have NO experience of riding Full sussers

So how exactly are you qualified to critique their ride feel? Is it because one of your equally well informed Halfords bike riding associates told you that the Shock-wave sucked?

don simon – Member

If I tell you something tastes like dog shit, several other people tell you something tastes like dog shit, are you going to try it to confirm that it tastes like dog shit?

I’d wonder why you know what dogshit tastes like.

don simon – Member
If I tell you something tastes like dog shit, several other people tell you something tastes like dog shit, are you going to try it to confirm that it tastes like dog shit?

I’d wonder why you know what dogshit tastes like

Maybe he has it in his sandwiches with some pesto.

I’m happy that folks want to ride FS bikes, my personal choice is an HT and I have not seen any evidence to tell me that a FS will serve me better.

Me and you find a rocky decent (doesn’t even have to be rocky infact) and see how long I am waiting for you at the bottom for. Then you will see a lot of evidence why a FS bike will serve you better.

So how exactly are you qualified to critique their ride feel? Is it because one of your equally well informed Halfords bike riding associates told you?

Small world! You know my riding associates. Give me a shout next time and I’ll buy you a cerveza.

Me and you find a rocky decent (doesn’t even have to be rocky infact) and see how long I am waiting for you at the bottom for. Then you will see a lot of evidence why a FS bike will serve you better.

Well that would depend on whether the 400m climb was before or after the decent.

If I tell you something tastes like dog shit,

But would you taste it?

i wouldn’t believe anything you say so no, i wouldn’t taste it.

i wouldn’t believe anything you say so no, i wouldn’t taste it.

Do you want to correct that, surely if you don’t believe me you would taste it? And of course that is your choice and I wouldn’t dream of trying to convince you otherwise, insult you or try to impress people with cheap (and crap) funnies. 😉

Well that would depend on whether the 400m climb was before or after the decent.

Nope it would be faster both up and down hill. People think you’re stupid for a reason, im new hear but i take it ur the forum troll/annoying person that really knows very little. Also Spanish beer sucks, and in my experience tastes a little like gone off lemonade.

Do you want to correct that, surely if you don’t believe me you would taste it?

no. no desire to edit that as i haven’t changed my mind.

And of course that is your choice and I wouldn’t dream of trying to convince you otherwise,

then why ask me to?

insult you or try to impress people with cheap (and crap) funnies

you haven’t insulted me so no offense taken.
you did make me laugh though.

Nope it would be faster both up and down hill. People think you’re stupid for a reason, im new hear but i take it ur the forum troll/annoying person that really knows very little. Also Spanish beer sucks, and in my experience tastes a little like gone off lemonade.

You’re a funny little chappy aren’t you? Could you explain to me why I’m stupid? And why you feel you need to call me stupid.

Nope it would be faster both up and down hill.

Bless.

no. no desire to edit that as i haven’t changed my mind.

Now I’m actually confused, you wouldn’t believe me yet you would follow my advice. 😕

Once I offer you my advice you can do what you want with it, I wouldn’t dream wasting a Sunday afternoon trying to tell you that you’re wrong.

You’re a funny little chappy aren’t you? Could you explain to me why I’m stupid? And why you feel you need to call me stupid.

You are stupid because you claim to have in-depth knowledge of a subject that you clearly have no experience off. Hence you are stupid.
I want to know how you can critique the ride of a bike that you have never even ridden?

You are stupid because you claim to have in-depth knowledge of a subject that you clearly have no experience off. Hence you are stupid.
I want to know how you can critique the ride of a bike that you have never even ridden?

Where have I said that I have in depth knowledge? I have an opinion based on the views and experiences of people who’s opinions I trust, and who know me and my riding style and things I have witnessed. Resorting to calling people stupid doesn’t do much for your debating skills either. Anything else?

It never fails to amaze me how **** dumb some people are, mostly found on internet forums. I don’t know why I bother!

I wouldn’t dream wasting a Sunday afternoon trying to tell you that you’re wrong.

😆 🙄

I concur. Why do you bother?

I’d wonder why you know what dogshit tastes like.

😆

don simon – give up, you’re really not doing yourself any favours here. If you don’t think full suss is for you then fine, I’m just not sure why you keep posting in a thread about something you clearly have no knowledge of. Don’t knock it til you’ve tried it is a fairly good maxim imo.

Calling other people narrow minded is hilariously ironic too.

Nope it would be faster both up and down hill.

This sentence contains up to three or more incorrect facts.

Are h/t’s faster?

Just watched the mens world cup xc race at Dalby, & the winner was on a full susser….

don simon – give up, you’re really not doing yourself any favours here. If you don’t think it’s for you then fine[u], I’m just not sure why you keep posting in a thread about something you clearly have no knowledge of. Calling other people narrow minded is hilariously ironic too.

Apparently not fine, as you all want to tell me that my personal opinion is wrong and as most of the arguments against me appear to be less informed than you claim my opinion is or simply insults. 🙄
I have a question, why don’t we see full suss bikes at the XC World Championships? Soft tails are creeping in, but the majority of riders are on hardtails. Why is that, if full sussers will beat a hardtail on the climbs?
EDIT: What’s the course like? I ask as I’ve seen Ivan Alvarez riding World Cup courses on a fully rigid. And as we know the Wrld Cup courses are becoming more like downhill courses where half the field of world class riders will dismount on the technical sections, including José Antonio Hermida.

Where have I said that I have in depth knowledge? I have an opinion based on the views and experiences of people who’s opinions I trust, and who know me and my riding style and things I have witnessed. Resorting to calling people stupid doesn’t do much for your debating skills either. Anything else?

Actually thinking about it I think you are both stupid and ignorant.

I rode more or less the same route yesterday (25lb HT) and today (30lb FS). Yesterday I was more tired. Today the trails seemed a little boring.

I concur. Why do you bother?

bother with what?

MrSmith – Member

I concur. Why do you bother?

bother with what?

With this. 😉

Actually thinking about it I think you are both stupid and ignorant.

Thanks, coming from you I’ll take that as a compliment. 😀

Just watched the mens world cup xc race at Dalby, & the winner was on a full susser….

Apparently not fine, as you all want to tell me that my personal opinion is wrong and as most of the arguments against me appear to be less informed than you claim my opinion is or simply insults.
I have a question, why don’t we see full suss bikes at the XC World Championships? Soft tails are creeping in, but the majority of riders are on hardtails. Why is that, if full sussers will beat a hardtail on the climbs?

The way I see it, doesn’t matter which is faster, never something I’ve cared about as I ride both style of bikes. It’s all about the rider input/skills/fitness/etc etc in my opinion. And why people care is beyond me. Just ride the bike and have a larf.

.. back to the original question I guess.

I ride two bikes, both stumpjumpers, one being a carbon hardtail, the other an FSR. Both have 120mm minimum of front travel (sids and revelations).

Now I may be missing the point a little, and no doubt influenced by one to many injuries but I don’t equate outright speed to “fun”. I’d much rather the challenge, and if I fail then the off is at a speed that I am going to walk away from mostly in tact.

I find the HT means I get more of a work out, have to lift the bike over obstacles, look further ahead, mentally find a line and stick with it. I get tired a lot quicker but the thrill factor is higher. Its more of a rattle attack but I have more “feel” of what is happening.

The FS is more forgiving, I can climb in comfort and find my cadence a lot smoother so grip seems improved, aided by the fact Im not being bounced out of the saddle so often ( … poor form or not im to ignorant to know). Coming down the “flow factor” is higher. Descents are at a higher speed in no small part I am sure due to the confidence it gives. Its more forgiving but if I cock up hopefully it wont chuck me to hard into a tree. I can ride longer but not necessarily further on it.

If I had to chose one it would be a FS, albeit a shorter travel ie Camber, Genius, Zesty etc (I’m sure there are plenty of others) which would allow the best of both hard argued for camps …

Also Spanish beer sucks, and in my experience tastes a little like gone off lemonade.

That’s going a bit far, a cold Mahou on a hot summer’s evening is pretty close to perfect.

while we are on the subject of new stuff, is that colour telly any good never seen a problem with the old black n white. Also will 35mm prints really be any good? Slides work so well especially when you have friends round

OP try one, buy one. FS bikes are better than hardtails in every conceivable way, you’d be crazy not to. There’s a lot of gibberish spouted by HT nerds all over the internet, ignore these ‘sperglords though.

Before this thread descends into a hardtail jihad, here are a few myths and truths to get you started:

Myths:
– HT teaches you rad gnar skillz, FS makes you lazy.
– FS makes things “too easy” (har, yeah ok if you’re Steve Peat maybe)
– FS will “roll over anything” (It’s a pushbike, not a range rover)
– FS are a lot of hassle to keep running.
– You should “learn to ride properly” (whatever this means) on a HT first
– A HT can turn an overweight IT consultant from Reading into a biking hard man (extra gnar awarded for lack of gears and boutique brands from Northern England. Blokes on fully rigid 29ers are so masculine they manage to impregnate women at 500 yards)

Truths:
– FS is faster than HT downhill.
– FS is more comfortable.
– FS allows you to attempt more rad gnar things because it’s better offroad than HT, because it has suspension both ends.
– Bike nerds are easy to wind up.

About right RJ

I would say though…
HT teaches you rad gnar skillz – Helps though makes you think about line a bit more which does translate back on the FS

FS is faster than HT downhill. – Depends on the rider!!

Bike nerds are easy to wind up – Oh no there not

FS is faster than HT downhill.

That’s the second time that claim has been made on this thread.

I’ll be at Erlestoke 12 next Saturday and I’ll be aiming to reach 65km/h down that long chalk track on a hardtail 29er. I’ll post the GPS evidence here afterwards.
I challenge anyone, on any bike, to post evidence that they went faster.

Graham, the previous claim was that a full suss bike would be faster uphill too. 🙄

HT are great for those who think being battered about is exciting.

Don – there are plenty of climbs by me that I could not do on my HT and I could on my FS when I had both.

How would a fs that simply rides over all obstacles

OMG where can I get one of these incredible machines that can ride over ALL obstacles?! Cos last time I was on my FS I had to steer around all sorts of boulders and trees and things, I guess it’s just not good enough.