Viewing 40 posts - 201 through 240 (of 252 total)
  • More G20 disproportionate police actions.
  • RudeBoy
    Free Member

    Brack- why do you wish to know my age? Do you want me to be a teenager? Are you trying to groom me? :wink:

    grumm
    Free Member

    Funny how all of the people who are protesting against the police officer’s violent actions,and advocating freedom of speech….appear to be quite vulgar, aggressive, and the ones who are shouting every one else down.

    Quite angry boys aren’t you??

    tell you what, i thought you may be reasonable, so ill sign off with a

    **** off

    **** idiots

    grizzlygus
    Free Member

    thegreatape – Member
    Looks like this kettling thing is going to be reviewed, among other issues.

    I’ve always thought the kettles day’s were numbered, whether it was by a legal challenge (I know that up ’til now they’ve failed) or because it is so hugely counter productive.

    Yes you’re right stoner, kettling is extremely effective at stopping protests. But the negative effects it has, has to be seen to be believed. There was a very good letter in the Times the day after the G20 protests by one of it’s female readers, it really showed the frustration and anger it can cause to ordinary law abiding people.

    When kettling was first introduced a few years back, the police just had to simply direct people until they were trapped and then seal them off with police lines. People generally do, what is asked of them by the police. However, protesters have now got wise to the tactic and are becoming aware when a kettle is being formed, so that it would now appear the police are having to resort to much more aggressive tactics as people are resist attempts to corral them.

    On a positive note however, kettling does allow the 60 year old retired professional from Tunbridge Wells who’s protesting with his wife over concerns for the environment, to see a side of the police which they would otherwise never see. That can’t be a bad thing.

    As far as thugs in the police force is concerned, I have no doubt that most coppers join the police force simply because they believe that it is a job worth doing (plus of course it’s well paid and there’s no chance of redundancy) I also believe that most coppers behave as they believe that they are expected to behave. So whilst individuals should undoubtedly be held accountable for their behaviour, any problems relating to unacceptable standards needs to be seen as the responsibility of senior officers. It is simply not good enough to lay all the blame on the individual who loses it.

    It’s perhaps worth remembering that whilst there might be serious concerns with the policing of demonstrations and protests, in general the police today is imo immeasurably better than the police was 30 or 40 years ago.

    30 or 40 years ago corruption ran right through the heart of the police force. Units such as the West Midlands Serious Crime Squad and the Porn Squad were basically crime organisations. A man attacking his wife was considered a “domestic issue” and police involvement was generally not considered necessary. There was no such thing as “hate crime”. Rape cases were dealt with in a completely insensitive manner. And IRA bombing outrages were solved by simply fitting innocent people up. Things are very very different today.

    BTW my comments on why most coppers join the force is directed at male PCs only, WPC are a completely different kettle of fish imo. I don’t know if it’s because women who want to put a uniform on and order men around have “issues”, or whether once in the force some women feel they have to “prove” just hard/tough/nasty they can be, but in my experience WPCs are always by far the most unreasonable. If I was at a demo and had to approach a copper, I would never ever, approach a WPC. Maybe I’ve been unlucky, but as a result of my experiences, I frankly feel sorry for coppers who have to work along side WPCs. Having said all that, I’ll contradict myself by saying that I once knew a WPC who was a really lovely person 8O Mind you, she only ever wanted to work at a desk and truly hated going ‘on the beat’.

    GNARGNAR
    Free Member

    brack
    OOh and now heres another one….like the group attack don’t you!?

    Nope, you’re confusing us with riot police.

    scraprider
    Free Member

    looked like she deserved a slappin tbh, as most of them prolly did , peacfull protest crap , put your self on the line , its a very scary place to be , i can tell you, they spit at you , swear at you , lob stuff at you , more tear gas imo.

    vdubber67
    Free Member

    I know this is ‘only’ an internet forum etc, and I’m not going to step into the debate, but I think it’s really significant that there are people out there who aren’t prepared to sit back and swallow the lies, b*llshit and deceit that we’re fed on a daily basis in this country, and who are actually prepared to speak out eloquently and succinctly on things like this. MisterGnar, Rudeboy (and others)- thank you for your words on this subject. It’s been a refreshing read.

    richc
    Free Member

    looked like she deserved a slappin tbh, as most of them prolly did , peacfull protest crap , put your self on the line , its a very scary place to be , i can tell you, they spit at you , swear at you , lob stuff at you

    yep those plastic bottles looked lethal, you could easily cause someone a nasty scrape or even get get covered in vicious sticky liquid.

    stumpy01
    Full Member

    Been an interesting read.

    I have tried to imagine what it must be like in that situation. Arresting that woman wouldn’t really be an option in that situation. Not enough Police resource to keep arresting people.
    My take on it is that Police are just normal people like everyone else. To be stood in front of that many people in a sitaution that could potentially kick-off at any moment, must be pretty scary. And if I was there as a Police officer, knowing how out-numbered ‘we’ were I would want to keep things as calm as possible. I don’t think the bloke should have clobbered that woman based on that short piece of video, but for all we know she might have been antagonising for hours or been seen with other perhaps more ‘able’ looking protestors. Maybe the policeman genuinely thought that his actions were justified.

    I think that if you go to a protest with hundreds (if not thousands) of other people, make a point of getting right into a policemans face, swearing at him/her and ignoring requests to move back you are very naive if you don’t think you might get a bit of a shoeing.

    My partner is training to be a police officer. She is probably more intelligent than a lot of the people on here who keep claiming that the Ploice are neanderthal bullies etc.
    If she was in a situation where she felt that physical action was required to stop harm to herself or others, then I would hope she would use it.

    I am not saying the policeman in that vid was right, but I am not saying he was wrong either……it’s all too easy to judge from a short snippet of video….

    juan
    Free Member

    easygirl – Member

    ive got it now…….
    the police are thick stupid violent thugs,
    Yup we already clarified this point ;) It seems to me that there is a lot of frustration in your speech easygirl. Is it because you end up being a traffic warden/cop wannabe rather that a proper one?
    I have not done any research on the topic through english books, but if you speak french I’ll be happy to provide you with numerous books filled up with story of cops being no more than just thugs. More than enough in my opinion to fear them and basically change side of the street when I cross one.

    Griz, when will I be able to vote for you as PM :P

    GNARGNAR
    Free Member

    stumpy01

    but for all we know she might have been antagonising for hours or been seen with other perhaps more ‘able’ looking protestors

    Still doesn’t justify it and is quite absurd. Shout at a policeman for long enough and he has a licence to beat you? Hang around with “able looking” people and the policeman is liable to beat you, especially if you are smallest and least intimidating? That does make sense though, most bullies are cowards and will pick on the weak.

    stumpy01

    Maybe the policeman genuinely thought that his actions were justified.

    Still doesn’t justify it in the slightest.

    stumpy01

    I think that if you go to a protest with hundreds (if not thousands) of other people, make a point of getting right into a policemans face, swearing at him/her and ignoring requests to move back you are very naive if you don’t think you might get a bit of a shoeing.

    Yes because we all know, the punishment for disobedience is physical violence.

    stumpy01

    My partner is training to be a police officer. She is probably more intelligent …..

    Oxymoron.

    juan
    Free Member

    Actually I’ll vote for griz only if he appoit Mister Gnar as police minister :D

    stumpy01
    Full Member

    So MisterGnar, you think his actions were erm, perhaps not justified or something??
    I don’t remember saying they were, either. In fact I said that from that short video clip I don’t think he should have clobbered her.

    Oxymoron……excellent…..ha ha…..great one…… :|

    myheadsashed
    Full Member

    I see the ‘small completely innocent young lady’ has now employed Max Clifford as her ‘PR agent” lol
    Nice little earner if you can get it

    grumm
    Free Member

    More importantly, I see that Ian Tomlinson’s death was caused by internal bleeding not a heart attack, according to the 2nd post-mortem.

    grizzlygus
    Free Member

    I see the ‘small completely innocent young lady’ has now employed Max Clifford as her ‘PR agent” lol
    Nice little earner if you can get it

    WTF do you mean by writing small completely innocent young lady in apostrophes ??

    Are you suggesting that in reality she isn’t small at all ? I reckon 5 foot tall and six and a half stone is pretty ‘small’, what would you call it ?

    And are you suggesting that you have some sort of proof that she isn’t a ‘completely innocent young lady’ ? Are you saying that this was all an elaborate plan by her whereby she forced a big burly policeman to attack her against his own will ?

    What are you …… a bit of a simpleton or something ?

    I don’t have the slightest problem with her not wanting to provide free stories to the newspapers, anymore than I have a problem journalist getting paid for writing the story, or newspaper proprietors making a profit from the story, or coppers get paid overtime for their part in the demo.

    I hope she gets as much money as she possibly can for what happened to her. Maybe she’ll give a large donation to the animal sanctuary where she works in East Sussex. If it’s the one I think it is I was there last Sunday delivering some rescued animals, and it is a very impressive place indeed – spotless and extremely well run.

    I also hope it doesn’t put her off fighting against the effects of climate change with all it’s disastrous environmental consequences to all species across the globe.

    As obviously the 5 foot nothing, six and a half stone girl who is prepared to stand up to a violent thug in uniform believes that getting out there and being pro-active is more important than sitting on your ar5se all day behind a computer spouting shite on a mountain bike forum.

    Good for her.

    RudeBoy
    Free Member

    Heh, nice one GG.

    Hmm, let’s see; the police have their PR machine (which has been spouting lies), and the woman who was attacked is quite rightly looking to earn a few quid out of it.She has, after all, been the unwitting actor in a piece of drama that has been shown round the world. The assualt she suffered has been used to sell newspapers and get TV ratings, so why shoon’t she have a chunk?

    Max Clifford is a slimy **** though, but I only say that because I’m jealous. He’s worked hard for years, and is a clever bloke. He exploits the medias’ insatiable appetite for sensationalism. Fair play.

    trailmonkey
    Full Member

    He exploits the medias’ insatiable appetite for sensationalism. Fair play

    Everyone who has taken part in these threads is as guilty in that desire for sensationalism as the press are in their desire to feed it to us. The whole focus of attention since the G20 summit has been focused on the the media fed images of crusties smashing windows or policemen bullying civillians. The real issues of the day, the proposals of the summit leaders have become lost amongst a sea of other stories, far more exciting and, well, sensational. Just have a trawl through the forum records and see how many words have been written on the proposals and how many haver been written on the violence.
    Very clever news manipulation and everyone has suckered for it.

    Zulu-Eleven
    Free Member

    Sorry, still seems to me that the hysterical little poison dwarf was asking for trouble – she quite rightfully was told to get back as the crowd surged toward the cordon – the kettling/cordon has been found legal in the highest courts and the police have an absolute right and duty to act to prevent a breach of the peace – madam didn’t like being told what to do and she kicked off, the police officer quite correctly started off with minimum force and clear verbal warnings but she chose to ignore them and get in his face in an aggressive and hysterical manner, as such I cannot see that he had much of a choice!

    Perhaps if “protesters” on the day before didnt act like This! then the police would not have had to control the crowds in a fairly assertive manner? I’ve been on the receiving end of some big protests from the dog on a string brigade on more than one occasion, and their actions always end up pushing things as far as they think they can, and generally a little further, and then it all kicks off! If you choose to associate with them, then expect to be treated as one of them.

    Whatever you choose to believe – no-one was prevented from protesting on that day – however the right to PEACEFUL protest demands that people do it in a controlled manner that allows the police to protect property and protect the safety of the general public – How soon we forget images like this in the centre of london:

    Peacefully protesting Poll Tax Rioters (all Thatchers Fault Of course)

    Whether you like it or not – not everyone in a protest is willing to do it peacefully, and there are always a small minority of the great unwashed who revel in trying to provoke a riot – and if choose not to distance yourself from them and then you act like a hysterical little bitch then you’re going to get slapped like one!

    myheadsashed
    Full Member

    What has size got to do with anything GG? Are you saying a 5ft woman couldn’t potentially wield a blade/gun/syringe insert any offensive weapon were appropriate and injury the policeman, is the copper a clairvoyant?

    Do you know the woman you seem to know her vital statistics?

    She was warned several times and each time when she failed to respond the consequence got a little more severe. A talking to, a strong word in her shell like, a push, a slap and then a whack with a baton, it fair in my eyes.
    You seem to be taking it very personally GG, is she your retarded inbred little sister with whom you have a child out of wedlock and share a chrome plated caravan with?

    grizzlygus
    Free Member

    Very clever news manipulation and everyone has suckered for it.

    I couldn’t agree less.

    The ‘clever news manipulation’ was attempted on April 1st when newspapers such as the Sun printed, ready for distribution the next day, front pages like this :

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_jkuZg923RnM/SdTDsW0alMI/AAAAAAAAAA8/mJ9gHOBLkMc/s1600-h/15253997.jpg

    Although the Sun undoubtedly had reporters at the demo who would have witnesses incidences of police brutality and completely unacceptable police tactics, they hoped that the population would be ‘suckered’ into believing that the police wanted nothing more than to guarantee the right to peaceful protest. And despite that their best efforts, they were unfortunately confronted by angry mobs hell-bent on violence.

    Fortunately there were some people at the demo who had cameras and recording equipment and who aren’t in the pay of Rupert Murdoch, and who were able to provide us with the truth. As a consequence of this, the attempt of ‘clever manipulation of news’ failed miserably.

    And I for one, am extremely glad of that. Because whilst incidences of police brutality are hardly new, the high profile reporting of them certainly is.

    What is also relatively new, are many of the tactics used on April 1st. Including kettling, police officers hiding their faces, widespread removal of shoulder numbers, extensive use of dogs, un-uniformed coppers walking around with truncheons in their hands, police shields been used edge-ways to smash into peoples faces, and senior officers responsible for operations saying “We’re up for it”

    These are all extremely worrying developments, and if as result of extensive discussions in the media (including the internet) it reduces the chances of recurrence, then hopefully we might have better policing, a better police force, and people will be able to walk the streets without fear of being attacked by thugs wearing uniforms.

    grizzlygus
    Free Member

    is she your retarded inbred little sister with whom you have a child out of wedlock and share a chrome plated caravan with?

    Yes she is. So I would be grateful if you would not be abusive about her.

    duntmatter
    Free Member

    Everyone who has taken part in these threads is as guilty in that desire for sensationalism

    I’m not. :P

    Zulu-Eleven
    Free Member

    hat is also relatively new, are many of the tactics used on April 1st. Including kettling, police officers hiding their faces, widespread removal of shoulder numbers, extensive use of dogs, un-uniformed coppers walking around with truncheons in their hands, police shields been used edge-ways to smash into peoples faces, and senior officers responsible for operations saying “We’re up for it”

    Or perhaps lawful tactics (Police officers have to follow a lawful order from a superior officer!) which have been forced upon them by the actions of protesters and protagonists – who repeatedly turn every peaceful protest into a chance to Smash the facist pigs!



    These are all extremely worrying developments, and if as result of extensive discussions in the media (including the internet) it reduces the chances of recurrence, then hopefully we might have better policing, a better police force, and people will be able to walk the streets without fear of being attacked by thugs wearing uniforms.

    But – perhaps the more likely scenario is that we will see the police avoid taking decisive action early on the next time there is a protest, for fear of upsetting the Guardianistas – with the result that things get out of hand and we see another poll tax riot, or worse, and then the same press leaping all over them for not acting sooner to quell a potential riot – the police still have that pesky duty to ensure the protection of life and property, the preservation of the Queen’s peace, and the prevention and detection of criminal offences!

    trailmonkey
    Full Member

    I couldn’t agree less

    But you’ve actually proved my point by carrying on your argument concerning police brutality.

    The whole point of manipulation of the news is that no one is talking about the G20 summit, just the violence that surrounded it.

    I find it quite ironic that you should feel that exposure of Police shortcomings might lead to improvements in Police accountability, in the anniversary week of Hilsborough where no Police officers have ever been brought to account despite the damning evidence of an independant judicial enquiry ( The Taylor Report ).

    Anyway, that’s all I’m saying about it. I’m not playing that game anymore.

    uplink
    Free Member

    detection of criminal offences!

    Unless perpetrated by themselves of course

    RudeBoy
    Free Member

    Who let Labrat out of his cage? Run out of Valium, Labby?

    Zulu-Eleven
    Free Member

    C’mon Fred – T’was nothing more than a love slap! I’d bet most people on here have given their girlfriends worse and got away with it!

    If it was a bloke acting the **** and gobbing off to a police officer like that and crying about it on TV then I have no doubt we’d all be buying tickets for the MTFU thread – As I said before, Hysterical little bitch who it now turns out may well have had something of an axe to grind with Plod, supposedly been nicked a few times for shoplifting and drug possession!

    She’s apparently in line for up to 50K off the papers for her poor little me story – hang on, wasn’t this supposed to have been an anti Capitalism march?

    RudeBoy
    Free Member

    The Internet + Labrat =not a good combination.

    Don’t you have something to delete off your Hard Drive, Labby? :wink:

    And most men don’t go round slapping women, no.

    But we know you prefer ’em not to be able to fight back, eh?

    Zulu-Eleven
    Free Member

    Play the ball Fred, you can do better than that – and you know the trouble you’ve got into before round here for making those comments… :wink:

    RudeBoy
    Free Member

    What comments would those be? Dunno what you’re on about.

    Play the ball? Bit rich, coming from someone who advocates using violence towards women/smaller people…

    Zulu-Eleven
    Free Member

    See bottom of page http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/animal-rights-activists-terrorist-right/page/2

    using violence towards women/smaller people…

    Hey, I wouldn’t want to be accused of discrimination – however nowhere did I advocate anything of the sort

    grizzlygus
    Free Member

    nowhere did I advocate anything of the sort

    It’s a shame that Singletrack archives are no longer accessible. I remember a certain labrat posting his fantasies about raping and breaking a woman’s neck. I have the URL but it doesn’t appear to be working ….. lucky you.

    Zulu-Eleven
    Free Member

    Sorry Gus – If you’re sad enough to have saved the URL of something said clearly in jest a different context about a year ago – then you’re a stranger bloke than I’d previously taken you for.

    In other news – Common sense has now dictated that the best course of action when repeatedly told to move by riot police is to do as you’re F**king well told:

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/video/2009/apr/15/g20-protest-police-dog-bite

    grizzlygus
    Free Member

    If you’re sad enough to have saved the URL of something said clearly in jest a different context about a year ago –

    Yep – that’s me.

    It was brought to my attention by someone else on here when he reminded you of it. I did indeed bookmark it, as it was the sickest post I’ve ever read on here. And whilst it might well have been said in ‘jest’, I reckon that it was an excellent example (as clearly the other punter did) of just how your mind works.

    Just because something is said in ‘jest’, doesn’t make it acceptable. You wouldn’t for example, ‘joke’ about having sex with children.

    Would you ?

    scraprider
    Free Member

    all she had to do was . move away , her choice not to = tough s$*t

    RudeBoy
    Free Member

    something said clearly in jest a different context

    In what ‘context’ could such sick fantasies be taken, pray tell?

    Your comments, re violence towards people, and hitting women, aren’t particularly funny. In fact, on many an occasion, you’ve revealed some pretty vile and disturbing aspects of your character. I won’t go over old ground, but suffice to say, some of your attitudes seem to be quite nasty, really.

    T’was nothing more than a love slap! I’d bet most people on here have given their girlfriends worse and got away with it!

    So you think it’s acceptable, to use violence towards people, especially for a man to use it against a woman? Because that’s what you seem to be suggesting. And you do seem to advocate using violence against people exercising their legal democratic rights.

    Sorry, have I taken anything out of ‘context’? I don’t think I have.

    I’m not going to continue this any further, as I think it’s quite unsavoury.

    But for your own sake and others, please think about what implications the views you express may have, speshly on a forum such as this.

    I really do hope you aren’t serious, and that you’re just trying to get attention, albeit in a particularly provocative and inadequate manner.

    Because your ‘jokes’ aren’t funny.

    brakes
    Free Member

    get back to the point ladies

    or is thread finally going to finally die the horrible death it deserves

    RudeBoy
    Free Member

    The reason for staring it, was so’s we could ‘discuss’ the issues at stake; issues which ultimately affect all of us, not least, the misuse of police powers, and the implications on all our civil liberties and democratic freedoms.

    I think it’s succeeded, pretty well. Still think there’s more room for intelligent and informed debate though. something that people like GG seem to be able to do, but which others aren’t capable of, sadly.

    brakes
    Free Member

    these threads do tend to drag on though

    not that I’m helping…

    I guess I’m just trying to gain some perspective on this whole topic and whilst some of the comments are well put, informative and informed, when the posts inevitably get too left/right-wing and posters rely on insults, poor analogy and diatribe they get a bit irritating

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